Should i sue them or not?

[OldManTod 10+ year member]

Hey Man,

Many people here are not understanding our great state and the fuqin laws we have, unlike you, I don't support the law that passed because I don't believe that the gubment should be able to tell who to do what (which is what they are doing), however I do respect that you don't like the smell and all that goes with it (I am not a smoker, but I do throw darts and come home smelling like something that is about to happen after I have been in a bar for 6 hours).

Anyway, first and foremost, all four sets of lips would been bigger had they been talking like that in front of my family, hit the biggest fukker first and ask who's next.

As far as suing, you are not going to get a good lawyer if you goto "Dewey Cheatem and Howe" for a free consultation, lawyers worth their weight don't do it that way.

Soooo much of the law here in Ohio is in flux that your case would take YEARS beyond years to ever get heard because the law would need to go in effect (as it relates to enforcement and I believe that when it does, you will see changes to the actual law) and all the other appeals would have to settle in before you could get heard and then, if the law gets repealed in the mean time, things could end up just fading away.

I can assure you the courts are done with people suing like this. A couple years ago, somebody hit my wife head on in a turning lane (get this, he dropped a lit smoke in his lap and he was trying to find it), we got the lawyer because the insurance company was stimping us (after 60 days, they had still not claimed responsibility) and in the long run, the entire situation ended up costing us $1600 (because some guy wasn't paying attention). I chalked that up to, at least there were no lingering health effects on my wife and kids.

I did research on the jury rulings and saw stuff where people were offered $16k settlements, turned it down and got like $300 (some got thrown out alltogether).

I know it sucks, consider it a learning experience, but with a lawyer and then consider time involved in actually going through the suit, I think you would see it as a waste of time.

Now on the other hand, if you want to get a sh!tstorm started, you could call the local news stations with the story prepared (hospital bills, etc.) and rat them out for not enforcing their policies and accuse them of profiling.

- T

 

[mtlhead 10+ year member]

Hey Man,
Many people here are not understanding our great state and the fuqin laws we have, unlike you, I don't support the law that passed because I don't believe that the gubment should be able to tell who to do what (which is what they are doing), however I do respect that you don't like the smell and all that goes with it (I am not a smoker, but I do throw darts and come home smelling like something that is about to happen after I have been in a bar for 6 hours).

Anyway, first and foremost, all four sets of lips would been bigger had they been talking like that in front of my family, hit the biggest fukker first and ask who's next.

As far as suing, you are not going to get a good lawyer if you goto "Dewey Cheatem and Howe" for a free consultation, lawyers worth their weight don't do it that way.

So much of the law here in Ohio is in flux that your case would take YEARS beyond years to ever get heard because the law would need to go in effect and all the other appeals would have to settle in before you could get heard and then, if the law gets repealed in the mean time, things could end up just fading away.

I can assure you the courts are done with people suing like this. A couple years ago, somebody hit my wife head on in a turning lane (get this, he dropped a lit smoke in his lap and he was trying to find it), we got the lawyer because the insurance company was stimping us (after 60 days, they had still not claimed responsibility) and in the long run, the entire situation ended up costing us $1600 (because some guy wasn't paying attention). I chalked that up to, at least there were no lingering health effects on my wife and kids.

I know it sucks, consider it a learning experience, but with a lawyer and then consider time involved in actually going through the suit, I think you would see it as a waste of time.

Now on the other hand, if you want to get a sh!tstorm started, you could call the local news stations with the story prepared (hospital bills, etc.) and rat them out for not enforcing their policies and accuse them of profiling.

- T

Well said

 

[bonesninja 5,000+ posts]

the lawyer i got is a friend of brother in law who deals with corporate lawsuits. This guy is a far cry from the ole dewey, cheatum and howe types and definately not an ambulance chaser. He's doing as a personal favor at no cost, and since he is semi-retired he has alot of time to dedicate to the case. Like i said tho, i just want someone to stand up and say they were wrong and all my expenses paid on this. if i get anything extra, then it's all good.

EDIT: i take that back, it's not totally free. I have to build a deck around his pool and remove and repour the walkway that goes out to his boathouse. But he pays for materials

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

I don't think it is BWW's place to enforce the law. They cannot prevent people from smoking in thier facility, they can only use resources of government agencies to enforce the laws.

It is not a policy of BWW, rather a law.

 

[OldManTod 10+ year member]

I just went back and saw that you got a lawyer, good luck, you never know how it is going to turn out and especially if you get to a jury, it could go either way.

Sucks what happened and I feel bad for your family to have to go through that, kids at that age don't understand what is going on.

Wiggee's FTL

Good Luck,

T

 

[mtlhead 10+ year member]

People....it is a law in Ohio that any public place is to be smoke free...these establishments MUST enforce this law. Why would police come to some place to tell some dumbass to put out a cigarette when a manager should be able to do that by themselves.

 

[bonesninja 5,000+ posts]

I don't think it is BWW's place to enforce the law. They cannot prevent people from smoking in thier facility, they can only use resources of government agencies to enforce the laws.
It is not a policy of BWW, rather a law.

Thats all fine and dandy but the liability falls in them facilitating them use of ashtrays, which in my mind amounts to being co-liable to the crime at hand. If you own a bar and there are people running a drugs out of your bar, you can have your all your bar assets, including the building seized whether you participated or not. The penalty of the crime should never have an impact on your decision whether or not you uphold the law in your establishment. On top of that, the law would agree with me because the business itself is the one who gets fined the big dollars, up to $2500 per smoker, while the smoker themselves are only liable for up to a $100 fine.

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

People....it is a law in Ohio that any public place is to be smoke free...these establishments MUST enforce this law. Why would police come to some place to tell some dumbass to put out a cigarette when a manager should be able to do that by themselves.

You are saying that regular citizens are required to enforce laws. I do not believe it. When someone shoplifts from Wal-Mart they must call the police in order to enforce laws on shoplifting. They (wal-mart) is not allowed to enforce the laws. That is like saying regular drivers should be able to issue tickets for traffic violations.

The manager is not given the power by the legislature to enforce laws. Maybe, but I seriously doubt it.

 

[OldManTod 10+ year member]

I don't think it is BWW's place to enforce the law. They cannot prevent people from smoking in thier facility, they can only use resources of government agencies to enforce the laws.
It is not a policy of BWW, rather a law.

I respect your opinion, but you have to understand the way the Ohio law is working.

There is a law, but in practice it isn't necessarily being enforced, then throw in that many of these places exist for folks who want to go and drink and smoke and have fun, so when you take smoking out of the mix, alot of places are not enforcing because they want to try and stay in business.

I can assure if/when the law goes in effect and is being enforced, many places that are around the ohio borders are going to go out of business because people are going to drive another 2 miles into whatever state and be able to smoke.

In Illinois, there are cities that are banning and many places are feeling it because patrons are going elsewhere.

Again, I respect that you want to take your family somewhere and enjoy the smoke free environment, but a place like BW3 is typically a bar scene, I wouldn't expect less.

Think about this (I have 4 kids, so I unfortunately am calloused to children and their behaviour). Most people who vote are at the age where they are not around small children and therefore put a law on the books to ban children from being in public places and being unruly, after all, they have a BP/Heart condition and can't be "aggravated".

I am far from wearing tin foil hats and thinking the gubment is out to get me, but everyday our rights get chipped away at a little more when bans like this happen.

And for those of you who have not thought about it yet, consider if all the smokers woulda got off their lazy @$$es and actually voted against this law, this would never have been an issue.

- T

 

[mtlhead 10+ year member]

Businesses are expected to comply with the law, meaning ashtrays need to be removed, signs need to be posted, and smoking needs to be stopped.

http://www.smokefreeohio.org

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

Thats all fine and dandy but the liability falls in them facilitating them use of ashtrays, which in my mind amounts to being co-liable to the crime at hand. If you own a bar and there are people running a drugs out of your bar, you can have your all your bar assets, including the building seized whether you participated or not. The penalty of the crime should never have an impact on your decision whether or not you uphold the law in your establishment. On top of that, the law would agree with me because the business itself is the one who gets fined the big dollars, up to $2500 per smoker, while the smoker themselves are only liable for up to a $100 fine.

Those fines are in place (to the business) to help suggest that patrons do not smoke in their facility.

The drug issue is irrelevent because they would be held as possesing illegal drugs.

Giving the people an ashtray does sound like a will breach of the law. They facilitated the smokers in breaking the law.

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

http://www.smokefreeohio.org

But does it say to remove smokers from the building?

 

[bonesninja 5,000+ posts]

You are saying that regular citizens are required to enforce laws. I do not believe it. When someone shoplifts from Wal-Mart they must call the police in order to enforce laws on shoplifting. They (wal-mart) is not allowed to enforce the laws. That is like saying regular drivers should be able to issue tickets for traffic violations.
The manager is not given the power by the legislature to enforce laws. Maybe, but I seriously doubt it.

I didn't say that the business can fine or take someone to jail. They MUST tell that person to put out the cigerettes or remove them from the premises if they don't comply. If they refuse to leave now there is an additional charge of trespassing at which time the law will be called. By even refusing to do so, they are liable for whatever results may happen. It's very clearly written in the law and thats why the state can fine the shyt out of businesses who refuse to comply

 

[mtlhead 10+ year member]

i never said they had to...just they needed to tell em to stop smoking

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

I didn't say that the business can fine or take someone to jail. They MUST tell that person to put out the cigerettes or remove them from the premises if they don't comply. If they refuse to leave now there is an additional charge of trespassing at which time the law will be called. By even refusing to do so, they are liable for whatever results may happen. It's very clearly written in the law and thats why the state can fine the shyt out of businesses who refuse to comply

I am reading the law now. It is only seven pages but I am curious on what actions the business must take.