Need opinion on good 3000+ amp

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

A half bridge is 2 polarized full bridges iirc (why they’re so much bigger than full bridge), which allows both + and - charging of each board, and each board seems to be able to balance itself out through the power supply by dumping or pulling in evergy back into both polarities of the 12v. Full bridge amps have a more loop type power supply, where energy can only be pulled in via the + and exit via the -, so it seems full bridge amps can’t use the the 12v electrical system as well to balance out spikes/dips of voltage internally as well as a half bridge design. Full bridge is 1 board and doesn’t process the energy internally in the same fashion. Half bridges are able to seemingly balance out both + and - polarity boards independently of each other using your 12v system, IMO, and that’s higher damping. And this conclusion only applies to class D sub amps. Frequency totally matters with damping factor.

This conclusion comes from studying write ups on amplifier types and how the energy flows through the power supplies. That was the main factor that I saw, because half bridges are two full bridge amps internally, where each full bridge has its own polarity, therefore each individual full bridge within the amp can individually balance out each board and its polarity, which creates more stability with rapid impedance changes, voltage spikes inside of the amp, etc. Seems like full bridge amps might have more trouble with internally over-volting (like when your sub is over xmax, and the coil is pounding the motor field), which may be why some people have them cut out during normal play on music or why they maybe can’t do something like run a .5 final ohm load on the amp with music. Full bridges seem to be way more sensitive to subwoofer movement, at least the shitty Chinese full bridges that are cheap dog ****, IMO. I don’t like them, personally, but I won’t hate if someone runs them.

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

that’s higher damping

No, that's a poor attempt to describe the difference between full bridge and half bridge. What did any of that have to do with output impedance? You also never answered why you would even consider .5 ohm load if you believe damping factor is so important?

What's really fascinating here is that you're still holding on to that meme in the first place when even premium priced snobophile brands like Mosconi aren't even publishing that spec for bragging rights these days. But I guess if you don't really understand what any of this means it's as good a thing as any to get hung up about.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

No, that's a poor attempt to describe the difference between full bridge and half bridge. What did any of that have to do with output impedance? You also never answered why you would even consider .5 ohm load if you believe damping factor is so important?

What's really fascinating here is that you're still holding on to that meme in the first place when even premium priced snobophile brands like Mosconi aren't even publishing that spec for bragging rights these days. But I guess if you don't really understand what any of this means it's as good a thing as any to get hung up about.

It’s not as dramatic as you’re making it, lol. Why don’t you go de-pump your nuts a tad. Idk how it’s not a factor, when it seems like many more expensive amps have higher damping factors than less expensive amps. What’s the difference in damping factor between Sundown’s SIA vs a Sundown Salt series? Idk wtf you’re talking about like I’m bowing down before the God of damping or something. Voltage tries to go back into the amp from sub movement generating electricity, or trying to. It’s not just an “output” but an input, as well. AC is what powers subs, so both speaker terminals on the amps also flip, and the sub can overcharge that wire, trying to send electricity back into the amp. How the amp deals with the sub’s electrical changes is the damping factor.

I guess the (relative) damping factor of boxes doesn’t matter, either.

‘Damping Factor: This is a quantity which defines how quickly the amplifier can stop a reproduced frequency such as a bass note. The higher the damping factor, the better the amp will control the woofer and help reduce overhang distortion (again to a point). The damping factor of an amplifier is mostly dependent on the output impedance of the power amplifier and the ability of the power supply which feeds the power amp.’

What is Slew Rate and Damping Factor?

What does damping factor and slew rate specifications mean for amplifiers? We discuss in this brief FAQ.

www.audioholics.com

‘…and the ability of the power supply which feeds the power amp.’

^^^That‘s why full bridges tend to have lower damping factors than half bridges. The difference in the way power supplies work and the way the boards are polarized between half bridge and full bridge amps is what allows a half bridge to be able to dampen the woofer better, to whatever extent. Having high electrical capacitance and charge rate of your 12v system (like capacitors) + high-ish damping half bridges = ultimate woofer control.

But, yeah, let’s recommend amps for music that control the high xmax subwoofer less. It’s not all the factors, but it is a factor.

 

[deez283 10+ year member]

So you still don't understand what any of this means, didn't bother to even learn what it means, and are just going to ignore the questions, post random non sequitors and double down.

Can you explain what part of full bridge designs effects output impedance and why, if damping factor is important to you, you would even consider .5 ohm?

Hmm.. Well every time you drop the ohms the damping factor is cut in half.. So if you want your damping factor to remain high as possible you would be wanting to run higher ohm loads to achieve this.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

Hmm.. Well every time you drop the ohms the damping factor is cut in half.. So if you want your damping factor to remain high as possible you would be wanting to run higher ohm loads to achieve this.

For competitors, they can run lower ohms on music. You know, like the 60 second average on music competition or whatever (I forget what it’s called). Some use half bridges and low ohms to compete in those, for example. So, if you’re in a class limit on fusing or wattage or whatever, you can wire to lower ohms, from my experience, with half-bridges that are rated the same as a full bridges, I mean. Class limitations or something like that, where your amp is only going to be so big (wattage-wise), that hinders your power output. Then, you can’t run at .5 ohms vs 1 ohm, because you got a shitty Chinese full bridge. I know some people who could run .25 ohms and switched to 1 ohm for daily. Good luck pulling that off with a cheap amp lol. Just examples of the extremes, that’s what I’m trying to post is. That’s where you’ll see the difference the hardest.

 

[Bobbytwonames 5,000+ posts]

This conclusion comes from studying write ups on amplifier types and how the energy flows through the power supplies. That was the main factor that I saw, because half bridges are two full bridge amps internally, where each full bridge has its own polarity, therefore each individual full bridge within the amp can individually balance out each board and its polarity, which creates more stability with rapid impedance changes, voltage spikes inside of the amp, etc. Seems like full bridge amps might have more trouble with internally over-volting (like when your sub is over xmax, and the coil is pounding the motor field), which may be why some people have them cut out during normal play on music or why they maybe can’t do something like run a .5 final ohm load on the amp with music. Full bridges seem to be way more sensitive to subwoofer movement, at least the shitty Chinese full bridges that are cheap dog ****, IMO. I don’t like them, personally, but I won’t hate if someone runs them.

Why are you replying to yourself? Put the Oxy down already.

 

[Bobbytwonames 5,000+ posts]

For competitors, they can run lower ohms on music. You know, like the 60 second average on music competition or whatever (I forget what it’s called). Some use half bridges and low ohms to compete in those, for example. So, if you’re in a class limit on fusing or wattage or whatever, you can wire to lower ohms, from my experience, with half-bridges that are rated the same as a full bridges, I mean. Class limitations or something like that, where your amp is only going to be so big (wattage-wise), that hinders your power output. Then, you can’t run at .5 ohms vs 1 ohm, because you got a shitty Chinese full bridge. I know some people who could run .25 ohms and switched to 1 ohm for daily. Good luck pulling that off with a cheap amp lol. Just examples of the extremes, that’s what I’m trying to post is. That’s where you’ll see the difference the hardest.

All wattage classes are done by clamping the watts. You can run .5 ohm if you want to in any wattage class. If the max wattage is 5K then you are limited to 5K @ whatever ohm you are running. You can't cheat the system when you have to clamp your wattage. Please speak of what you know. Stay in your lane keyboard Cowboy

 

[Bobbytwonames 5,000+ posts]

Please tell me, how did I **** on your reply?

S/N ratio is a spec to look at yes but it varies from manufacturer to manufacturer on how they actually come up with their number.

I am a fan of half bridge amps so I start there and then stick to reputable brands and research them. There’s not one specific factor I look at when purchasing. I do check out Big D’s dyno’s as well but that’s mostly for his opinion on build quality and amp guts.

Where did I say that S/N ratio is the end all be all? I said that's what I prefer to look at. I didn't say it was the only thing that I look at. Big difference.

 

[Clifff150 10+ year member]

You are as soft as Charmin dude. You take everything so personal it’s unbelievable. Just because I said S/N Ratio isn’t the be-all and end-all doesn’t mean I’m attacking you. Other users read posts and maybe they learned that S/N Ratio isnt a reason to buy amp a over amp b. Maybe they’ll then further their knowledge in S/N Ratio and damping factor from this thread. Maybe they’ll also learn that you are special

 

[Bobbytwonames 5,000+ posts]

You are as soft as Charmin dude. You take everything so personal it’s unbelievable. Just because I said S/N Ratio isn’t the be-all and end-all doesn’t mean I’m attacking you. Other users read posts and maybe they learned that S/N Ratio isnt a reason to buy amp a over amp b. Maybe they’ll then further their knowledge in S/N Ratio and damping factor from this thread. Maybe they’ll also learn that you are special

I am special for many reasons. Most people will never accomplish anything close to what I have. When did I say that S/N ratio was the be all end all when picking an amp out like you said? Can you answer a question without attacking me personally?

 

[Clifff150 10+ year member]

I didn’t say you said it was the be-all and end-all! I was making a statement about S/N Ratio and why to not base a decision solely on that spec.

 

[shredder2]

I am special for many reasons. Most people will never accomplish anything close to what I have.

That statement of yours speaks volumes man, ok then dude.
Keep on bassin' and whatever you do.
Ur SpEcIaL.
Let me know when U break 150 btw. Oh btw... 3k stock usually is 151-152db competitively when the rubber hits the road.

 

[Bobbytwonames 5,000+ posts]

That statement of yours speaks volumes man, ok then dude.
Keep on bassin' and whatever you do.
Ur SpEcIaL.
Let me know when U break 150 btw. Oh btw... 3k stock usually is 151-152db competitively when the rubber hits the road.

At what hz.? Please share.

 

[Bobbytwonames 5,000+ posts]

That statement of yours speaks volumes man, ok then dude.
Keep on bassin' and whatever you do.
Ur SpEcIaL.
Let me know when U break 150 btw. Oh btw... 3k stock usually is 151-152db competitively when the rubber hits the road.

I probably won't get there with 4 - 10's, new box, and a 5K. I might have a chance if I go with 4 - HD10's and an 8K.

 

[shredder2]

At what hz.? Please share.

47hz... 2700 clamped. It got down to 28hz but my cabin liked 47 tuned 38hz. So theres your freq.
I'm not a rebassed low lows freak. I enjoy rock music... And watching the wipers bounce occasionally. Glass costs, hinges too... Etc.
It was fun hitting those #. I won't lie.
But anymore the whole thing is... Yuck.
Abandoned and shelved. I gifted most my audio away.
A strong deck mated to sensitive speakers does the job.