breaking cones?

[Slo_Ride 5,000+ posts]

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/needpics.gif.edd6d28e76618c28c46f343991bcced5.gif

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

these cones are stupid light. like 200 grams for the 18. the carbon cones are about that weight and way stronger. like 3x stronger. might end up with them. i can get some 8 layer aluminum coils to slap in there. no problem with that. im 90% sure its 9.25" spiders on this landing.

I've got some Sundown Z spiders that diameter. Not terribly stiff but they're pretty nice, huge flat tinsels. My cones are rather heavy but they won't break. Really the MMS includes the mass of the air your cone is trying to push as well so in the big scheme of things cone material isn't going to make or break you. Aluminum vs. copper coil is a big mass savings 4 layer vs. 8 layer coil is a couple tenths. Not sure which generation 95 motors you have but the older ones I've seen have a pretty tight gap and use 4 layer. The point of kevlar/carbon fiber cones isn't saving mass it's surviving 170dB+. There is no reason you should be breaking cones. I'm calling user error on this one. DD is the winningest brand of woofer in db-Drag and they build 95XX to handle proper competition conditions.

yea. the box isn't deep and its abit small. right now fore daily i have 36x8(21n^2 per cube) in 13.5 tuned to 42. For SPL its 14ft^3 400in^2 tuned to 51. I've tried with and without pieces to reduce reflection/loading. the surround tore yes i reglued it, yes i do have some trapped pressure but the box is borderline to small so for now i have to live with it. i might have to step down to 15s to get better numbers but i love 18s cone area and the fact i can play 30 full tilt and they still get off.

Easier to shrink the box/port than to make them bigger, huh?

13.5 seems small for 2 18s.
wouldnt 15-16 cubes net be better?

I'd think 18-20 cube would be better for critically over-damped 18s.

 

[wew lad 5,000+ posts]

I'd think 18-20 cube would be better for critically over-damped 18s.

If you're familiar with the Team AA's, where should I be heading as far as net volume per 15? tuning and port area is also something I'm curious about as it seems good for daily now but again, I'm not an expert

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

I've got some Sundown Z spiders that diameter. Not terribly stiff but they're pretty nice, huge flat tinsels. My cones are rather heavy but they won't break. Really the MMS includes the mass of the air your cone is trying to push as well so in the big scheme of things cone material isn't going to make or break you. Aluminum vs. copper coil is a big mass savings 4 layer vs. 8 layer coil is a couple tenths. Not sure which generation 95 motors you have but the older ones I've seen have a pretty tight gap and use 4 layer. The point of kevlar/carbon fiber cones isn't saving mass it's surviving 170dB+. There is no reason you should be breaking cones. I'm calling user error on this one. DD is the winningest brand of woofer in db-Drag and they build 95XX to handle proper competition conditions.


Easier to shrink the box/port than to make them bigger, huh?

I'd think 18-20 cube would be better for critically over-damped 18s.

I only have so much space. I built it as big as I could. Lol

I'm about to double power. We will see how they hold up. My other mid 150 builds never had this issue. These cone are stright up weak.

Yea I'd like 8 per but I can get 7.5 per max with 350in^2 tuned to 49

 

---------- Post added at 11:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:30 PM ----------

 

I've got some Sundown Z spiders that diameter. Not terribly stiff but they're pretty nice, huge flat tinsels. My cones are rather heavy but they won't break. Really the MMS includes the mass of the air your cone is trying to push as well so in the big scheme of things cone material isn't going to make or break you. Aluminum vs. copper coil is a big mass savings 4 layer vs. 8 layer coil is a couple tenths. Not sure which generation 95 motors you have but the older ones I've seen have a pretty tight gap and use 4 layer. The point of kevlar/carbon fiber cones isn't saving mass it's surviving 170dB+. There is no reason you should be breaking cones. I'm calling user error on this one. DD is the winningest brand of woofer in db-Drag and they build 95XX to handle proper competition conditions.


Easier to shrink the box/port than to make them bigger, huh?

I'd think 18-20 cube would be better for critically over-damped 18s.

You mean underdamped? I measured the qes to be .62 and fs 38hz

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

If you're familiar with the Team AA's, where should I be heading as far as net volume per 15? tuning and port area is also something I'm curious about as it seems good for daily now but again, I'm not an expert

No idea, but I know the older DD95XX were very similar to the Shocker Sigs as far as stiff suspension and strong motor force (tight gap). Any of the "team" woofers use a huge gap to fit a huge coil for big power handling... I don't know where they land as far as electromagnetic damping and haven't seen any around here.

You mean underdamped? I measured the qes to be .62 and fs 38hz

What is QTS? How did you measure? Which series 95s do you have?

 

[Boomin_tahoe 5,000+ posts]

This keeps getting better and better...between this thread and the other calling out Hertz Mafia. UPS lost his battery terminals, wall issues, breaking cones, etc etc. Yet this guy knows it all....on how to build the perfect system from the start. And so far he's had nothing but bad luck lmao.

Quite entertaining to say the least.

 

[Hertz Mafia]

I only have so much space. I built it as big as I could. LolI'm about to double power. We will see how they hold up. My other mid 150 builds never had this issue. These cone are stright up weak.

Yea I'd like 8 per but I can get 7.5 per max with 350in^2 tuned to 49

 

---------- Post added at 11:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:30 PM ----------

 

You mean underdamped? I measured the qes to be .62 and fs 38hz

Idk why you think u need so much port. My 4 18s have 300” of port and does 158db, my buddy 4 15s has 230” port does 160db+...my other c-pillar had two 18s and 160” port did 153... and your talking about 350”+ for two 18s... sounds like you don’t know what your doing. And u saying your other mid 150s builds.... lmao what!!!! U never had any 150db builds. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crying.gif.ec0ebefe590df0251476573bc49e46d8.gif u did a 147db

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

Idk why you think u need so much port. My 4 18s have 300” of port and does 158db, my buddy 4 15s has 230” port does 160db+...my other c-pillar had two 18s and 160” port did 153... and your talking about 350”+ for two 18s... sounds like you don’t know what your doing. And u saying your other mid 150s builds.... lmao what!!!! U never had any 150db builds. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crying.gif.ec0ebefe590df0251476573bc49e46d8.gif u did a 147db

Larger port is always going to be more efficient regardless of what a guy you know is getting away with. That said, OP's port certainly isn't small to the point where it should be holding him back. More would probably help but it's not going to gain him more than 1 or 1.5 dB.

 

[Hertz Mafia]

Larger port is always going to be more efficient regardless of what a guy you know is getting away with. That said, OP's port certainly isn't small to the point where it should be holding him back. More would probably help but it's not going to gain him more than 1 or 1.5 dB.

U can’t just make the port bigger and gain DB.. that’s not how it works

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

U can’t just make the port bigger and gain DB.. that’s not how it works

For practical purposes larger port = more efficiency but if you have data to the contrary please present it. It certainly goes against all conventional wisdom and published research.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

No idea, but I know the older DD95XX were very similar to the Shocker Sigs as far as stiff suspension and strong motor force (tight gap). Any of the "team" woofers use a huge gap to fit a huge coil for big power handling... I don't know where they land as far as electromagnetic damping and haven't seen any around here.


What is QTS? How did you measure? Which series 95s do you have?

9515i. The series before they went to the bigger coils. After I get 15kw they won't be able to handle the power in 7.5 per driver..

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

Idk why you think u need so much port. My 4 18s have 300” of port and does 158db, my buddy 4 15s has 230” port does 160db+...my other c-pillar had two 18s and 160” port did 153... and your talking about 350”+ for two 18s... sounds like you don’t know what your doing. And u saying your other mid 150s builds.... lmao what!!!! U never had any 150db builds. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crying.gif.ec0ebefe590df0251476573bc49e46d8.gif u did a 147db

The port needs to be huge. The more Port area the more displacement. and having a box too big hurts output because it starts to unload like it's freeair.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

This keeps getting better and better...between this thread and the other calling out Hertz Mafia. UPS lost his battery terminals, wall issues, breaking cones, etc etc. Yet this guy knows it all....on how to build the perfect system from the start. And so far he's had nothing but bad luck lmao.

Quite entertaining to say the least.

I wish they would find my ****

 

[wew lad 5,000+ posts]

9515i. The series before they went to the bigger coils. After I get 15kw they won't be able to handle the power in 7.5 per driver..

you wont get 7.5 per driver, more like 5kw

 

[Hertz Mafia]

you wont get 7.5 per driver, more like 5kw

He was sayin 7.5 cubes, not wattage lol