Break in period for subs

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

Why couldn't parts be manufactured in a way that doesn't require breakin? Why don't manufacturers break in drivers/parts before sending them out the door? Sounds like that would eliminate a lot of warranty claims and improve their reputation.

I do believe some companies do break in their subs some. I'm not here to make a claim about how long it takes to break in a sub. I'm just sharing what I've heard with my own ears.

I want to be clear, I'm not an SPL guy. I'm not looking at sub break in from an SPL perspective. I'm looking at breaking in a sub for people who want to play music, specifically heavy bass music, and that's how I approach my advice or thoughts or whatever on this subject.

Some subs are just inherently soft and don't really need a break in. Lower powered woofers are sometimes the best example of this.

I think the main reason is durability. Good companies make woofers that are built to last. If a woofer is already loose as its inherent design, then it might degrade too quickly over time and have poor performance.

I know there's gotta be people on here that have seen a really old sub that sags? You know, like a 10-15 year old sub that's really old and been played a lot. I've seen old woofers where they aren't centered on the coil anymore, from an in and out perspective. The sub is so old that the coil just sits way down in the motor (with the sub facing up). I think one of the subs I saw like that was an ancient type r or type s.

If break in time isn't a thing, then how is it possible for woofers to start sagging over time? Does anyone think a coil sitting like .5" further into the motor while resting doesn't affect the playing capabilities of that sub?

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

I mean saying a spider that vibrates in and out somewhere between 20-80 times per second for it's entire usage, saying that spider doesn't stretch out from that over time is just illogical. Spiders are fundamentally flexible and that flexibility will change over time, even just from age and normal usage.

If break in time isn't a thing, then how would you like a recycled spider out of a 10 year old woofer instead of a new one?

 

[Kickstand Premium Member]

I have had my share of DD subs
Nothing as crazy as the 9500's but still
I have always broken them in and then slowly brought them up to full power
4-6 weeks before I turned my amp up to where it should be and even then I was slow to crank it up and only in short bursts for a while
Even now I just put that 3510 back in and I still gave it a break in period. Not as long, only a couple weeks to "warm it back up"
Out of the 5-6 subs I have had from them I have never once smelled them burning

I wish I would have know about the whole break in thing back in the day
Would have saved me a lot of $$$

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

So please, if you would, contact the company that held the world record for years and tell them that they are wrong about breaking in their own subwoofers:

No need to contact them. If they had any objective data to back this up they would have it there in their writeup. IMO that whole thing is just a bunch of pseudo science designed to first cover their arse if someone destroys a sub right out the gate and second to try to get people to start off cautious with their new product and feel out its limits. I'm not so convinced by marketing hype especially when it flies in the face of many years of my own experience/observation.

The ability of humans to remember sound and sound intensity is extremely poor, this is well documented. There's no way you're hopping in the car one morning after completing your """break in""" ritual and saying with confidence "Oh wow, this sounds way better and deeper than it did a couple weeks ago".

I defy anybody to show me some actual evidence of this phenomenon. For example 4 identical subs side by side in identical enclosures on identical power, two fresh out the box and the other two having undergone some magic ritual then roll power up until they all break to determine which if either survive more power. Or before and after RTA graphs or SPL measurements of subs after various periods of any magic ritual you feel is going to make an audible difference. Even IF DD has some top secret unicorn tears they use in their soft parts that aren't used in the Sundown and Nuway ultra stiff spider packs I've used that somehow MUST be stretched out a bit before they function without failure, shame on them for not just building a machine that bends them up a bit before assembly. You can buy even the stiffest ones on the market and soften them up noticeably in just a few minutes by just working them back and forth with your hands.

Where did I say anything about changing t/s parameters?

You did not, but ironically the DD writeup you linked did and for some reason they only even mentioned Fs. If you claim some audible change happens at some point, posting before and after TS parameters would be useful data in backing up this claim.

Or is there some more subtle pixie dust they put in those softparts that will make them break prematurely or sound audibly different after some ritual is performed that cannot be measured via TS specs?

Your fart box tunings are so high that you don't even need to break a woofer in because you're playing high notes like any prefab can do.

The double irony here is that I typically build to "DD Box" volume and port ratios.

I've never measured any subs before and after t/s parameters, personally. T/s are relative, you can spot a woofer with no break in time, but the t/s can still show the character of the woofer, regardless.

So do TS parameters not matter at all in box design? If you expect some audible change in output after some period of time or some ritual is performed how do you account for this change when designing a box if any of this change is likely to make an audible difference?

You aren't going to sit here and tell me break in time doesn't make many a sub play music better.

Define "better" and then provide some objective data to back up this claim.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but you aren't the type that goes around playing 25 hz on the streets, are you?

No, nor are DD subs (particularly up to a generation or two ago) the type of subs which really excel for that application in the first place. Now that you've moved the goalpost to """"break in""" only makes an audible difference at 25hz provide some data to back this up. What ritual does Jacob suggest for """break in""" on his X series?

I've seen people blow subs from not letting them break in.

How on Earth can you determine that what they did to break them the first time wouldn't have happened regardless of any ritual you performed with those same woofers before they were abused? How did you determine that the failure wasn't either legitimate manufacturer defect or outright abuse?

So, when your woofer is really stiff, it basically doesn't move enough on the low notes, and that causes excessive heat buildup in the coil.

Can you quantify how much more movement you will get after precisely what ritual is performed that will make such a dramatic difference in thermal power handling? I've worked in the business and seen the same chucklefucks break speakers within minutes of leaving, even after watching them pull across the street, go into the trunk, and crank the "volume knob" on the amps up to max. Stupid people doing stupid **** doesn't mean that happened because they didn't follow some secret ritual, it's because they're bone-heads who have no concept that equipment has limits. Some learn their lesson and use equipment within tolerance afterwards and some do not.

How does this theory account for mechanical failures? Should someone who has """broken in""" their sub be more concerned about over excursion after they have stretched out the suspension some? By how much will this change effect power handling as far as mechanically breaking things at low frequencies if we rely on the stiff suspension to control the cone below tuning?

If break in time isn't a thing, then how is it possible for woofers to start sagging over time?

Post pics of a 20 year old DD sub with spider sagging. The further you try to move the goalposts here arguing with yourself the more you're disproving your own case. The type of driver that is going to sag in 20 years is going to be extremely soft to begin with and will probably change parameters the least from brand new to end of life while the drivers that are built extremely stiff and will stay stiff forever are the ones that openly suggest these special juju rituals.

About 8 or 9 years ago I measured TS parameters of an old Clarion 32" that a friend owns and the TS parameters were within 2-3% identical to published specs from the early 90s. There is also some good data to be found online of full range bookshelf type drivers being measured over a period of several years.

Spiders are fundamentally flexible and that flexibility will change over time,

Nobody has denied this. The question is by how much, over how much time, and at any point will it make either an audible difference or a significant difference in either thermal or mechanical power handling. I originally even offered to share real objective data on measured specs of woofers to help have a serious discussion on the subject and you attacked the very idea before going on to write a page full of conjecture and anecdotal evidence of a bunch of ignorant hoodrats who blow **** up.

Finally, why is it that I can build extremely stiff suspension subs that I can beat on full power within an hour of assembly and DD can't build one that won't fail without some 12-24 hour ritual being performed over it?

 

[LsGuy]

For me, I just go by manufacturer recommendations, that way I'm covered in case of a warranty claim. Most recent subs I installed were JL's, and JL says no break-in required, so I didn't perform one.

 

[metalheadjoe 10+ year member]

I think you two (@Buck and @hispls) are arguing separate issues. It comes down to whether (some) manufacturers specify break-in/warm-up for their drivers as a means to optimize output verses a means to counter warranty claims. If for warranty purposes, I think that would be easily disputed; if a spider literally tears apart (one example mentioned) without the voice coil being burned, that suggests the power rating wasn't exceeded and the spider should have been built to withstand the power rating of the driver. However, if the break-in/warm-up is to maximize the driver's bandwidth, efficiency, and other acoustic aspects, that is (as hispls said) a lot more difficult to prove because a lot of it is opinion.

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

if a spider literally tears apart (one example mentioned) without the voice coil being burned, that suggests the power rating wasn't exceeded

Nonsense. Run any sub free air at 10hz at it's "rated" power and see how many are going to not break mechanically. I say this because SoundQubed (back in Audio-Q days) was notorious for **** quality softparts and used the "break in" as a cop out to not honor warranties.

a lot more difficult to prove because a lot of it is opinion.

It is extremely simple to prove. Post up TS parameters, Termlab scores, or RTA measurements before and after either some period of time or before and after performing some sort of ritual.

I shall eagerly await some hard data on this subject.

 

[dragon.breath 10+ year member]

I can’t give you hard data, but I can tell you this. A couple of years ago one of my friends decided to do a no wall spl setup in a Blazer. He decided that the first thing he would do is figure out the resonance frequency of his truck. So he bought a new 8 inch sub ( I think it was a Jbl, not 100% sure) and built a small sealed box for it.
then he borrowed a spl meter from his work and took measurements. 25hz to 75hz one hertz at a time at 5 watts. Probably 3 seconds per frequency. Then repeated it at 50 watts. After that he went back to 5 watts to double check his measurements. The sub had gained 2-3 db from 30hz up to about 45hz during the testing.

 

[metalheadjoe 10+ year member]

Nonsense. Run any sub free air at 10hz at it's "rated" power and see how many are going to not break mechanically. I say this because SoundQubed (back in Audio-Q days) was notorious for **** quality softparts and used the "break in" as a cop out to not honor warranties.

Did their ratings specify a frequency range? If not, that argument is void. Have you had a warranty claim denied because you didn't break the driver in, or do you know any instances of that happening? Are you to the point where your walls are up and you are arguing to argue?

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

No need to contact them. If they had any objective data to back this up they would have it there in their writeup. IMO that whole thing is just a bunch of pseudo science designed to first cover their arse if someone destroys a sub right out the gate and second to try to get people to start off cautious with their new product and feel out its limits. I'm not so convinced by marketing hype especially when it flies in the face of many years of my own experience/observation.

The ability of humans to remember sound and sound intensity is extremely poor, this is well documented. There's no way you're hopping in the car one morning after completing your """break in""" ritual and saying with confidence "Oh wow, this sounds way better and deeper than it did a couple weeks ago".

I defy anybody to show me some actual evidence of this phenomenon. For example 4 identical subs side by side in identical enclosures on identical power, two fresh out the box and the other two having undergone some magic ritual then roll power up until they all break to determine which if either survive more power. Or before and after RTA graphs or SPL measurements of subs after various periods of any magic ritual you feel is going to make an audible difference. Even IF DD has some top secret unicorn tears they use in their soft parts that aren't used in the Sundown and Nuway ultra stiff spider packs I've used that somehow MUST be stretched out a bit before they function without failure, shame on them for not just building a machine that bends them up a bit before assembly. You can buy even the stiffest ones on the market and soften them up noticeably in just a few minutes by just working them back and forth with your hands.



You did not, but ironically the DD writeup you linked did and for some reason they only even mentioned Fs. If you claim some audible change happens at some point, posting before and after TS parameters would be useful data in backing up this claim.

Or is there some more subtle pixie dust they put in those softparts that will make them break prematurely or sound audibly different after some ritual is performed that cannot be measured via TS specs?



The double irony here is that I typically build to "DD Box" volume and port ratios.



So do TS parameters not matter at all in box design? If you expect some audible change in output after some period of time or some ritual is performed how do you account for this change when designing a box if any of this change is likely to make an audible difference?



Define "better" and then provide some objective data to back up this claim.



No, nor are DD subs (particularly up to a generation or two ago) the type of subs which really excel for that application in the first place. Now that you've moved the goalpost to """"break in""" only makes an audible difference at 25hz provide some data to back this up. What ritual does Jacob suggest for """break in""" on his X series?



How on Earth can you determine that what they did to break them the first time wouldn't have happened regardless of any ritual you performed with those same woofers before they were abused? How did you determine that the failure wasn't either legitimate manufacturer defect or outright abuse?



Can you quantify how much more movement you will get after precisely what ritual is performed that will make such a dramatic difference in thermal power handling? I've worked in the business and seen the same chucklefucks break speakers within minutes of leaving, even after watching them pull across the street, go into the trunk, and crank the "volume knob" on the amps up to max. Stupid people doing stupid **** doesn't mean that happened because they didn't follow some secret ritual, it's because they're bone-heads who have no concept that equipment has limits. Some learn their lesson and use equipment within tolerance afterwards and some do not.

How does this theory account for mechanical failures? Should someone who has """broken in""" their sub be more concerned about over excursion after they have stretched out the suspension some? By how much will this change effect power handling as far as mechanically breaking things at low frequencies if we rely on the stiff suspension to control the cone below tuning?



Post pics of a 20 year old DD sub with spider sagging. The further you try to move the goalposts here arguing with yourself the more you're disproving your own case. The type of driver that is going to sag in 20 years is going to be extremely soft to begin with and will probably change parameters the least from brand new to end of life while the drivers that are built extremely stiff and will stay stiff forever are the ones that openly suggest these special juju rituals.

About 8 or 9 years ago I measured TS parameters of an old Clarion 32" that a friend owns and the TS parameters were within 2-3% identical to published specs from the early 90s. There is also some good data to be found online of full range bookshelf type drivers being measured over a period of several years.



Nobody has denied this. The question is by how much, over how much time, and at any point will it make either an audible difference or a significant difference in either thermal or mechanical power handling. I originally even offered to share real objective data on measured specs of woofers to help have a serious discussion on the subject and you attacked the very idea before going on to write a page full of conjecture and anecdotal evidence of a bunch of ignorant hoodrats who blow **** up.

Finally, why is it that I can build extremely stiff suspension subs that I can beat on full power within an hour of assembly and DD can't build one that won't fail without some 12-24 hour ritual being performed over it?

You were the ******* first, bro. You started it. If you're going to call everything I say ******** like that, and then claim I'm doing a magic ritual like a sarcastic *******, that's how I'm going to talk to you.

You have something to prove, I don't.

You look for stuff to call me out on bro. You try to correct me on stuff all the time. I don't care.

I'm just sharing my experience. I never said a DD sub sagged. I said an Alpine did, an old one, that had been played a lot. My point was the more that you play a speaker, the more age it gets. Everything eventually fails man, that's aging, everything ages and it changes things, especially if a woofer is being used that whole time. Woofers get worn out suspension wise after lots and lots of playing (takes a very long time, people usually don't have this problem). But I'm just speaking on what I've seen to explain certain factors of subs in certain contexts.



DO YOU EVER PLAY 25 HZ BRO? TELL ME. I'M NOT TALKING UNTIL YOU TELL ME THAT YOU PLAY 25 HZ SO YOU CAN UNDERSTAND WHERE I'M COMING FROM. I'M NOT TUNED AT F*CKING 38-40 HZ. BREAK IN DOESN'T MATTER NEARLY AS MUCH WHEN YOU'RE TUNED THAT HIGH.

ONCE AGAIN, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THINGS TOWARDS ME IN A WAY I DIDN'T STATE THEM.

I never claimed sh*t about t/s parameters, expect where you can see where a woofer has been tested with zero break in time, like some Skar t/s parameters seem to be.

You keep saying t/s parameters and changes in response to me, like you're proving yourself right, when I never mentioned t/s parameters.

I don't need t/s parameters to confirm what my ears are hearing. It's not anecdotal evidence. You might as well go ahead and call me a liar and full of sh*t. How in the living f*ck would YOU know anything about what I'VE heard and how it sounded? That's a really big ******* assumption that only your experiences are correct.

So do you play 25 hz? Answer the question and don't avoid it, because it's completely relevant. You don't have to break in much to play 35-40 hz, if any at all.

Oh that's right, you don't think anybody should like any sound other than what YOU like. So therefore people don't need to break in because they shouldn't play lows because you don't like lows. And all of this is a complicated subject. This is the opposite of a one size fits all recommendation. Just the type of music you listen to can determine a break in, if it's even needed dude.

Let me know when DD is sending you box designs directly. Because that's what I have. DD, the actual company, sends me box design customers that contact them, sometimes, if the situation is appropriate. So I certainly must be an idiot.

You're trying to be so right that you aren't even listening to my side. You've made up your mind that you know everything and very aggressively go after things you think are BS. I largely respect that, actually. But you aren't really getting what I'm saying, I don't feel like, based off how you respond to me.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

So, how much 25 hz do you listen to?

Do you even listen to bass below 30 hz? This matters a lot.

Low frequency reproduction is different than high frequency production, and spider stiffness plays a massive role.

Not everybody uses woofers like you do. That's where I think you're failing here in your assessment. I think you're a really smart dude and know a lot and you definitely have a perspective and info on angles that I don't, because I don't compete. Most of my customers like their boxes tuned in the low 30's.

Like I say man, break in time isn't going to mean as much if your tuned in the high 30's. You're not going to hear it like some of my high 20's tuned boxes.

And like I say still, break usually isn't that big of a deal lol. A lot of subs don't need a huge break in. Subs with no play time need to played some before you go super hard on them, especially on low notes, sometimes. That's why I'm not going to sit here and argue about t/s because there's a ton of subs and all of them are different. I don't care about t/s in relations to break in. I care about how it sounds to the ear, because that's what the whole f*cking point of people's boxes are.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

Did their ratings specify a frequency range? If not, that argument is void. Have you had a warranty claim denied because you didn't break the driver in, or do you know any instances of that happening? Are you to the point where your walls are up and you are arguing to argue?

This is an extremely important point.

You can apply a lot of power to woofer in certain circumstances because the notes your are playing are too far away from what the woofer can fully reproduce that you can give them full power and it works, because the woofer isn't actually using the power, the resonance of the frequency is too low for the coil to interact with the motor properly. You might be able to see that in impedance if you free air certain subs at 10 hz.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

I could play 14 hz with my 2 18's and it shook my truck. I didn't have a subsonic filter at all, because I was tuned a 29 hz and the sub starting losing it's ability to throw itself hard enough to bottom itself out below tuning, because I was getting so low that the woofer couldn't fully reproduce the note, so I never had to run a lower crossover (I did for voltage reasons around like 24-25 hz).

@hispls I'm not even saying that you're wrong, but you're saying I'm wrong, and I don't think you quite understand fully what I am saying.

Yes, sound is subjective, but that's what the whole point is. People don't care about their t/s and how it changes or doesn't. People mostly care about how it sounds to their ears.

I installed dude, 100's of cars. We used to install on 5-10 cars a day during tax season. Even customers would tell us over time the subs were hitting lows they didn't know a sub could even hit, and it was related to the woofer loosening up, and we hadn't mentioned anything about that to them. When that happens, where you literally have 100's of customers in your local area that bump around town and you see them roll by the shop and turn their bass up and we all wave at them, that's the way it was. I was in the thick of East Nashville with thugs and guns and drugs and hipsters and rednecks and 26" rims. We served everybody. Black, white, asian, aliens, we didn't care. Many many people made the comment of how their subs played lower the longer they played them. You can say all of those people are wrong too, and you weren't there to see this, so I can't prove this to you, but I have no reason to lie. I'm literally telling people my life and experiences.


Now when a customers tells me their sub started playing lower after a while and they really liked it, you know what I DO NOT DO?

I would never tell a customer that their magic ritual is bullsh*t. They wouldn't even understand that concept, because they don't even know enough. They only know that their subs played the low note on Put On way better the 10th time they played that song than the first time. How in the living f*ck could all of these people that I installed their system and built their box for be full of sh*t? They walk in and say "Hey Buck! Man, holy cow, the subs sure are hitting lows better now that I've played them a while." I've heard that many times. So, go ahead and call BS on those people too, who don't even know anything about audio other than bass sounds awesome and they want it.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

Like we'd always run the subsonic a little high on fresh installs, depending on the customer's personality and music they listened to. I know, from installing, that using the theory of a break in time works for people that don't understand or are just new to audio. I know it's a lot safer to not play heavy lows on a fresh woofer. I've made woofers stinky like that.

And it's ok if a manufacturar needs a break in time. Please explain to me what is so nightmarish about a sub needing a break in time?

If anything, it's just safer than sorry, as well. @hispls You're deep into this like most people aren't. Your knowledge and thirst for knowledge are wayyyyy deeper than most people's, and that's highly respectable, IMO. I respect it, legitimately. You've showed me stuff I didn't know about, and I learned from it. Idc who's audio wiener is bigger, I've proven myself, it's not about that to me, I'm not here to prove myself over you. I'm just here to share my experiences.

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

The sub had gained 2-3 db from 30hz up to about 45hz during the testing.

2-3dB gain seems as unlikely as TS parameters changing that much after only a minute and a half of play at 50W. That is so unusual if it were me I'd buy a couple more of those subs to do more careful/thorough testing.

Did their ratings specify a frequency range? If not, that argument is void. Have you had a warranty claim denied because you didn't break the driver in, or do you know any instances of that happening? Are you to the point where your walls are up and you are arguing to argue?

Dunno what their ratings were but spiders failing prematurely was a somewhat commonly problem for Audioque in their early days and "you didn't break it in" was a cop-out they used often when presented with returns on things that had failed. Oddly enough since their first generation of subs we stopped reading about spiders tearing so either everybody is now properly "breaking in" their subs or they sorted their **** out with the shoddy Chinese parts since then.
I'm not looking to argue, I'm demanding evidence to prove dubious claims.

You look for stuff to call me out on bro

Why take this personal? If you had time to scour my post history I've called ******** on this "break in" thing every time the topic has come up around here. You started by making claims about this "break in" pheomenon, I declared ******** without proof. Burden of proof is on the person who makes a claim.

Everything eventually fails man, that's aging, everything ages and it changes things, especially if a woofer is being used that whole time.

Again, nobody has attempted to contradict this, but the question is how much and over how much time? Show data to prove this is meaningful for practical purposes.

DO YOU EVER PLAY 25 HZ BRO?

I'm still waiting on you to give me the names of a few non slowed or re-bassed songs that contain 25hz material. Seriously though, no I do not, but if your point is break in only matters at 25hz, why bring up DD as your evidence when their stuff is NOT designed to tune that low? Do you have any evidence or hard data to prove your claims?

I don't need t/s parameters to confirm what my ears are hearing. It's not anecdotal evidence.

Are you claiming that TS parameters do not predict the output of a woofer in a box? "It sounded better" is absolutely anecdotal and subjective as opposed to objective evidence which could be proven with some recorded data.

Do you even listen to bass below 30 hz? This matters a lot.

No, but give me the names of some non slowed commercial release music and I may give it a whirl. How precisely does this matter?

You're not going to hear it like some of my high 20's tuned boxes.

Again if you're claiming some audible difference that somehow cannot be predicted or shown by changes to TS parameters, post up some before and after RTA graphs or Termlab numbers for proof and do not forget to note after how much and what kind of play time and at what power these changes take place.

I don't think you quite understand fully what I am saying.

Correct. Are you claiming that some "break in" ritual is needed to prevent subs from breaking or are you claiming that there will be some audible difference in output and/or response after some conditions have been met? Or do you claim both? DO you claim that this is with any speakers or only with certain types/brands?

The fact that nobody has nailed any of this down with specifics or any hard data only confirms my assertion that this is largely just pixie dust, unicorn tears, and tribal rain dances. Until I am shown some hard evidence to the contrary I'll go on with my belief that the vast majority of change in compliance in those ultra stiff woofers happens within only minutes of hard play (up to x-max) and that if your sub is failing right out the gate it is from poor parts or build quality or outright abuse and not because someone didn't perform the right ritual beforehand. Furthermore I will continue to demand proof of claims, and if such proof exists you wouldn't need to write three or four text walls in reply but would simply link some videos of side by side testing or some recorded data to prove this claim.

Some links on the topic that provide measured data. My apologies if they use TS parameters as evidence.

Speaker Break In: Fact or Fiction?

Driver "break in", "burn in" or "run in" is a topic that's been debated in various forums for years. This topic continues to ignite occasional flame wars, fueled by the contributions of both

www.audioholics.com

Speaker Break In: Fact or Fiction?

Driver "break in", "burn in" or "run in" is a topic that's been debated in various forums for years. This topic continues to ignite occasional flame wars, fueled by the contributions of both

www.audioholics.com

Matrix-Hifi: Speakers Burn In

Responses from several well known manufacturers when asked about "break in".

Do Audio Speakers Break-in?

There are a lot of "everybody knows" type of rules in audio with one of them being that audio gear in general, and speakers in the specific, benefit from "break-in." That is, their performance improves after some time. This is mostly touted by audiophiles but manufacturers also fuel this...

www.audiosciencereview.com

You will notice that the ONLY people on this thread who are posting any measured data are proving that any change over time is inaudible. Another interesting point raised here is that never in the history of loudspeakers are any of these "break in" changes for the worse but always make things sound better.

An interesting message posted here by Dr. Sean Olive of Harmon International:

Breaking in new Speakers

Hi, I am about to take delivery of a brand new pair of B & W 685 speakers. I read somewhere about breaking them in by playing low level back ground music for up to 50 hours.Does anyone know about breaking in speakers, and can give some guidelines?thanks.

www.stereophile.com

Of course this is followed up by all the subjective feelings of the golden-ear crowd who can really hear the difference 200 hours later, some going as far as to claim a coil will perform differently after some heating and cooling cycles. No lie, there are people who claim amplifiers and even cables need hours of "break in" to really hear nuances and subtleties. Oddly enough nobody who can hear the difference weeks or months later is posting up any hard data by way of RTA graphs or TS parameters changing over time.

This topic has been beaten to death for decades now and I have yet to find any hard data provided by the "break in" camp. Post up some real data and not another page worth of subjective opinions and pseudo science.