Active setup how powerful of amp?

[gocards]

I am trying running an active setup for the first time with one set of DLS up6i components I just bought along with a Pioneer Prs 80 Head Unit and I need a 4ch amp. (Sub and amp for sub are already taken care of)

The UP6i speakers are rated at 150rms / 180max 4ohms.

I know the tweeter is rated at 50rms / 80max 4ohms (per the manual on DLS website) and I cant find specs for the mid woofer but a DLS rep told me they run at 150rms (doesnt sound correct)?

What rms ratings should I be looking for for an amplifier to run these active? My understanding is that I could run 100w rmsx4 amp and turn down the gains for the tweeters to properly run these.

Will this be enough Power? Could I go with more power, say 125x4 safely?

I appreciate any help you guys can give me!

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[neo_styles 10+ year member]

MOAR POWER!>!!!!

You can always get an amp that will put out more power than rated and just be conservative with your gains. I'm sure the last thing you want to is cram your cargo space with a bunch of 2-channel amps. A PPI P900.4 or SS TN4.900 would be great choices with their tiny footprint and 200-dollar price tag.

 

[gocards]

Ok thanks, that clears it up. I will be going with the PPI p900.4

 

[Danometal 10+ year member]

I have experience with a PPI Black Ice BK800.4 amp. It's a monster amp for a steal of a price. It has active capable crossovers in case your 80 PRS doesn't stick around for some reason.

 

[esmokah 10+ year member]

I picked up a p900.4 to replace my massive nx4. i will get it in tonight but I don't think I will mess with it too much.

 

[gocards]

Between a PPI Black Ice BK800.4 and a PPI P900.4 which would you choose, pricing aside?

BK800.4 specs:

130x4 .55% THD+noise

PPI P900.4 Specs

power output @ 1.0% THD, 14.4V

145W x 4 @ 4ohm

Would the differences in SQ even be noticeable at those levels?

 

[Danometal 10+ year member]

Black Ice is a little bigger, but it's Class AB vs the Class D of the Phantom. Opinions vary regarding the SQ of Class D fullrange amps, but I doubt there's any audible difference. It comes down to personal preference. I like the looks of the Black Ice quite a bit better personally.

 

[zako 10+ year member]

Between a PPI Black Ice BK800.4 and a PPI P900.4 which would you choose, pricing aside?
BK800.4 specs:

130x4 .55% THD+noise

I am not suite sure where you pulled these "specs" from. They're not on PPI web site as far as I can see. Don't tell me "sonicelectronix". Their web masters often don't know what amplifier "THD" spec is, and post random crap in their "spec" table. I wouldn't worry about the THD of these amps. However, a while ago someone posted the channel separation spec for PPI P900.4 at 1KHz, and I didn't like it a lot (it was 30ish). My preference would be to see it at >50dB. 99% of time this shouldn't matter at all since most people don't optimize for good imaging by the means of EQ and time alignment. But if you're building an SQ system where one of the goals is consistent imaging, that may not be a desirable spec if the amplifier is to power tweeters (channel separation gets worse with each octave.. so a crosstalk of 30dB 1KHz can become 10dB at high frequencies). This is still a great amp given the price of $200. You can't always have every parameter and spec to be in the optimal range for such price. Unfortunately, I haven't see a third party test of PPI Phantom amps that would either confirm or deny this.

However, if you're running active, using PPI P900.4 to power tweeters may be overkill to begin with. I'd use this amp to power mids and subwoofer (with bridged channels) and power tweeter with something like (like head unit, or may be something like Boston Acoustics GT-275).

 

[neo_styles 10+ year member]

Maybe he got it from the manual? It's been a while since I looked into it, but that's the only place I'd trust spec-wise.

 

[neo_styles 10+ year member]

Nope, just checked the manual, no THD spec.

 

[gocards]

I had to search around various sources to find the specs on the BK800.4, so you are probably correct in assuming that these are unreliable.

Will the PPI P900.4 be too powerful of an amp for these tweeters even with the gains turned down appropriately? they are rated at 50 rms, 80 max. I don't want to burn these tweeters up but I want enough power for the woofers.

I would like to stay within a 200 budget for the amp and I have a sub-woofer amp already, all I have left to get is the amp and head unit.

I also want to try the active setup out vs passive (I have never heard active but I like a challenge and it would be worth it to have better sq to me).

If the channel separation is going to be significant, then is there a better amp I could go with for around the same price range? or maybe two 2-channel amps instead? (150rms for woofers, 50 rms for tweeters)

 

[gocards]

Ok I think that I am going to go with one of these two options for my active setup unless you guys have an alternative suggestion for roughly the same cost:

1) Bi amp with Soundstream PX2.200 for tweeters and Soundstream PX2.580 for the woofers

PX2.200 runs 70x2 rms, tweeters take 50 rms/80 max

PX2.580 runs 190x2 rms, woofers take 150 rms/180 max

This way I would not have to worry about channel seperation as with two amps it would basically be a non-issue(besides crosstalk in the HU which is not avoidable)

2) Single amp with PPI P900.4 for tweeters and woofers

P900.4 runs 145x4 rms, tweeters take 50 rms/80 max, woofers take 150 rms/180 max.

This would take up less space and be an easier install but Im afraid it wouldnt sound as good with the crosstalk of tweeter and woofer channels

Im leaning towards setup number one now. Is there any reason that this is not a good option? Either one will cost me around 200.

 

[Danometal 10+ year member]

There's pros and cons to each.

A single amp solution is simpler and easier to install properly/find a location for/etc. However, you will waste a good bit of the power of 2 of your channels by only powering tweeters.

A bi-amp solution makes better use of the available power, but is more complex to install and integrate into an amp rack or whatever. It definitely takes up more space and requires more RCAs, power and ground wires, distribution blocks, etc. You also gotta fit a sub amp along with them if you're running a sub.

You can see in my avatar that I only had enough room for a 4 channel, a mono, and a small crossover on my amp rack. I thought about bi-amping my front stage so I could bridge my 4 channel, but my whole amp rack design would've had to be pretty weird looking to make it work. Car audio is full of compromises.

Your call.

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

You can run tweeters on a P900.4 or similar amplifier. The gain adjustment is one way to turn down the levels to match your woofers, plus your head unit or processor may have a level adjustment in addition to EQ.

Regarding the P900.4 vs BK800.4, the P900.4 is a much smaller amplifier. You will never fit a BK800.4 under a front seat, whereas that's easy with a P900.4. If you don't care about space then it comes down to Class AB vs Class D. The P900.4 has been tested to have a ruler flat frequency response as well as making "clean" power up to and beyond its rating of 145W per channel. In my mind that eliminates any question of "will it sound good enough for me?". For someone who obsesses over the sound of Class AB or even Class A vs the rest, I don't know what to tell you as I'm tired of that debate. Class D is more efficient, and so that's a nod toward the P900.4.

 

[gckless 5,000+ posts]

You can run tweeters on a P900.4 or similar amplifier. The gain adjustment is one way to turn down the levels to match your woofers, plus your head unit or processor may have a level adjustment in addition to EQ.
Regarding the P900.4 vs BK800.4, the P900.4 is a much smaller amplifier. You will never fit a BK800.4 under a front seat, whereas that's easy with a P900.4. If you don't care about space then it comes down to Class AB vs Class D. The P900.4 has been tested to have a ruler flat frequency response as well as making "clean" power up to and beyond its rating of 145W per channel. In my mind that eliminates any question of "will it sound good enough for me?". For someone who obsesses over the sound of Class AB or even Class A vs the rest, I don't know what to tell you as I'm tired of that debate. Class D is more efficient, and so that's a nod toward the P900.4.

Without getting into the debate of class A vs. AB vs. D, I would like to reiterate the efficiency advantage. Depending on what amp you choose, and what amp you decide to go with (or have?) for your subs, and how your car's electrical looks like right now, you may or may not need to spend a bit on electrical upgrades. Beefing up electrical can potentially add up quick.