Featured Was wondering if someone could help me make sense of an issue I stumbled upon?

[GomerPyle]

Hi everyone, Thanks in advance if you're here looking at this as I am new to the forum.

I am probably 3/10 knowledgeable on car audio set ups, but recently stumbled upon some weird stuff in my first car I bought/newly found project car.

I'll put the "short run down" first and explain details later as to not discourage anyone from helping (don't want to bore anyone).
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Car: 2002 Mustang GT (convertible - Not Sure if its relevant)
Audio: Mach 460 with the 2 factory amps under the seat

Aftermarket unit: Pioneer FH-X720BT (Pioneer Unit Link)
Aftermarket Speakers: Unsure (I remember just picking them)

Parts Purchased So Far: Metra Wiring Harness
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Short Run Down

Issue:

Sound to speakers works but sounds VERY diminished. Like an old radio with no bass.

Incidentally found 2 AMPS unplugged under back seats. Plugged them back in with factory harnesses. Now ZERO sound to speakers. (unplugged, sound back)

After researching, I found my car needs a special secondary RCA harness to integrate the amps, to allow the aftermarket speakers to function.

Was ready to add the secondary harness (Metra linked above + RCA), got the dash off and found 4 speaker wires spliced into a Metra harness to the Pioneers unit harness. No secondary RCA harness.

UNIT --> Pioneer Unit harness--> Metra + 4 speaker wires --> Vehicle Lines (Pics attached)

The research (Here) says it should just be:

Pioneer unit harness--> Metra Harness + RCA harness included spliced together --> Vehicle lines

The 4 speaker wires threw me for a loop and I didn't want to mess anything up!

Can someone help me make sense of the correct way to proceed?

I am assuming that the RCA harness, speaker wires, METRA harness are able to be all spiced together with the RCA harness, but I didn't want to cause more problems.

Unfortunately, I will have to leave it as is, if that's the outcome here, but wanted to 100% confirm before I started "splicing and dicing" like an idiot.

THANKS again, I appreciate any input!
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LONG Version (May have more Info to help, but wasn't sure)

Many many years ago, My factory speakers were blown and rattling and very bad sound, head unit/disc changer broken. Had them replaced at a "professional shop"

Picked the car up and the speakers had sound, and worked, but they sounded like they had zero... absolutely zero depth. Think old 1995 radio with FM tuner. No bass or anything. More on this in long story.

Working on convertible top here last week, I took back seat out to get to the convertible motor and cylinders, I notice 2 amps that were unplugged.

Racking my brain I remembered the only time seat was off was during speaker install. "They must have forgot to plug them in, and that's why it sounds crappy"

Plugged them in and checked.... no sound. Unplugged them.... sound, but as before (crappy)

Did a deep dive and found this write up (Here) that many people had this issue with aftermarket units in this vehicle with the Mach 460 system.

Purchased the items listed, got into the dash.... found speaker wires all spliced in and didn't want to mess anything up.

My understanding is that I just need to splice in the RCA harness where it is advised, and it will integrate those amps, achieving normal sound?

I feel the shop took the lazy route and tried to sell me aftermarket AMPS and such, but who knows. I don't really care because 1) I have no idea if that's the case, 2) I drove it for almost 15 years as is and accepted that I would have crappy sound forever (haha)

I am hoping there is a fix.

So.... Thanks to anyone here still reading and can help.

Cheers!

Gomer

Click to read more...

 

[mahc 10+ year member]

That is a lot of tape and heat shrink lol! All these black wires are very suspicious. Looks like they ran new wires from the Pioneer harness directly to the speakers so they probably disconnected the speakers from the amps in the doors. Not a very good shop indeed. They were supposed to use a Ford amp pin connector to rca adapter to send signals to the amps. With that, they'd only need 12v, ground, accessory, dim and remote (five wires) from the car to the pioneer harness and of course, the antenna.

 

[GomerPyle]

That is a lot of tape and heat shrink lol! All these black wires are very suspicious. Looks like they ran new wires from the Pioneer harness directly to the speakers so they probably disconnected the speakers from the amps in the doors. Not a very good shop indeed. They were supposed to use a Ford amp pin connector to rca adapter to send signals to the amps. With that, they'd only need 12v, ground, accessory, dim and remote (five wires) from the car to the pioneer harness and of course, the antenna.

Am I "up the creek without a paddle", per se?

Haha.

Very frustrating to find, especially considering 10 minutes in to searching I found this was incorrect.

 

[mahc 10+ year member]

2002 Mustang Mach 460 Stereo Wiring Colors

 

[mahc 10+ year member]

Am I "up the creek without a paddle", per se?

Haha.

Very frustrating to find, especially considering 10 minutes in to searching I found this was incorrect.

No you just need to reconnect the stock wires to the speakers, use the rca adapter and plug the amps.

 

[GomerPyle]

No you just need to reconnect the stock wires to the speakers, use the rca adapter and plug the amps.

Ok hopefully they didn't F that up and rup them out.

I'll have to investigate when I can.

I will try and take pics when I map out the wiring to confirm so I don't completely destroy everything haha.

Edit: forgot to say thanks!

 

[mahc 10+ year member]

Ok hopefully they didn't F that up and rup them out.

I'll have to investigate when I can.

I will try and take pics when I map out the wiring to confirm so I don't completely destroy everything haha.

Edit: forgot to say thanks!

No problem. Here to help and learn.

 

[GomerPyle]

2002 Mustang Mach 460 Stereo Wiring Colors

Thanks for this! Will need it.

I will update when I can investigate these 4 speaker wires further.

Cheers

 

[mahc 10+ year member]

Thanks for this! Will need it.

I will update when I can investigate these 4 speaker wires further.

Cheers

Yes, let us know.

 

[1aespinoza 10+ year member]

Am I "up the creek without a paddle", per se?

Not at all. The White, Gray, Green, Purple pairs are all speaker wire sets. As marc2112 said, they are probably wired direct to the speaker locations. If you find those black wires at the speaker locations you will be set.

 

[GomerPyle]

Not at all. The White, Gray, Green, Purple pairs are all speaker wire sets. As marc2112 said, they are probably wired direct to the speaker locations. If you find those black wires at the speaker locations you will be set.

Just so im not totally lost this weekend:

-Trace black wires from dash here to speakers
-Unplug
-Hook factory wires back in

(Pray they didn't just cut them out or some crap)

-then wire pioneer harness --> RCA + Metra harnesses --> vehicle harness

-plug amps in and test

I have the back panels off for convertible top piston replacement, so I'll be able to look while I'm here.

1 question: at the speaker. 1 speaker wire split to 2. Are these wires uni directional?

As in.... when you split the speaker wire in to 2, it matters which wire plugs where?

Like I said. I'm somewhat of a noob.

(Let's say I trace 1 wire and have purple + purple/black. Is there an indicator on the speaker where to plug which one?)

Thanks again. Will keep updated.

 

[1aespinoza 10+ year member]

Trace black wires from dash here to speakers
-Unplug
-Hook factory wires back in

If the black wires go to the speaker locations, you can use the radio as the power source for them. No amp needed. You can just wire the speakers into them and plug the radio back in and start enjoying.
If the black wires are not there, do find out where before the weekend so we can plan the next move.

 

[mahc 10+ year member]

Pretty sure the black wires gotta go. He doesn't need speaker wires at the head unit, the rca adapter sends signal to the amps and they take care of the speakers.

 

[GomerPyle]

If the black wires go to the speaker locations, you can use the radio as the power source for them. No amp needed. You can just wire the speakers into them and plug the radio back in and start enjoying.
If the black wires are not there, do find out where before the weekend so we can plan the next move.

Ok will do!

 

[1aespinoza 10+ year member]

Pretty sure the black wires gotta go. He doesn't need speaker wires at the head unit, the rca adapter sends signal to the amps and they take care of the speakers.

The thing is that we do not know exactly what those wires are being used for. If they do go to the speaker locations and OP wants to use a full range amp, then using a speed 9 wire to the radio harness will be the best move. Since OP also said the sound is flat, it would be interesting to see how the tech got this wired up.
I find it odd that when the OEM amps are plugged in, he loses sound.

 

[GomerPyle]

The thing is that we do not know exactly what those wires are being used for. If they do go to the speaker locations and OP wants to use a full range amp, then using a speed 9 wire to the radio harness will be the best move. Since OP also said the sound is flat, it would be interesting to see how the tech got this wired up.
I find it odd that when the OEM amps are plugged in, he loses sound.

Yeah when I plug these in here. I hear the click when they power on.... I see the stations playing/connect to BT.... but no sound

When I unplug them, unit has sound but zero depth and flat.

My list here is to:

1) see what's up with these wires inside the doors and recheck the rear speakers to see if black speaker wires are running to them

2) hopefully be able to plug old factory car wires back in

3) figure out the wiring of the head unit harness, rca harness, and Metra harness.

Will report back

 

[1aespinoza 10+ year member]

When I unplug them, unit has sound but zero depth and flat.

Are there wires on the other side of those OEM amps?

 

[GomerPyle]

Are there wires on the other side of those OEM amps?

Good question.

I will take a peek after work today. I'm not 100% sure.

 

[GomerPyle]

Are there wires on the other side of those OEM amps?

Just did a quick google.Google.

The circles in the image are what's visible in my Pic. The arrow would be the back of the units (not visible)

(Reuploaded my cars pic here just to compare)

 

[1aespinoza 10+ year member]

The circles in the image are what's visible in my Pic. The arrow would be the back of the units (not visible)

After checking a few sites I will assume the rear small plug carries the audio signal from the radio. There are no splices in the front plugs which I will also assume are the speaker outputs and power inputs. Then the black wires should be spliced at the speaker locations, and that could mean the OEM tweeter wires are still plugged in. If so then that would explain why your radio protects itself when the amp is plugged in.
Furthermore, if the OEM tweeters are still connected they could cause sound issues like you currently have. 2 tweeters per side is not pleasing IMO.