Subwoofer Amp UPGRADE Advice really needed.

[Jaguar 10+ year member]

If you're looking at durability or quality, you need to look elsewhere than kicker. If you're trying to save money, you need to look elsewhere than kicker. Not sure what the other 3 pages have said here, I've only looked at the first. And if you really want an improvement in bass, get a properly built ported enclosure. Which will probably mean you need to go down to a pair of 10's, since a pair of 12's needs a lot of room.Also, if you really want to start learning about car audio, there's no better place than this site to learn the basics from every angle: Basic Car Audio Electronics

There's no better site for everything in one place, that makes it easier to understand. And if you read all of that, it will eliminate most, if not all, of the basic beginner questions.

I'm sure you guys could teach me so lot, I know I'd be jealous of some of your systems, thanks for your advice as well. One day Im going to be smart enough to give as much consideration to non-mainstream brands as name brands I promise. Hopefully one day I can look back and laugh at my choices and have a real pavement pounding system. I calculate my next level up to be around a few months from now. Glad to be a member of this forum.

 

[Danometal 10+ year member]

Well if my guy at Gwinnett sound (Gang) tells me I should take them back I will, but I doubt he will. I'm just going to tell him to wire me right to my amps capabilities, until I get a more suitable amp. The standard Kicker Comps I had before in my system were 8 ohms. Can someone direct me to a place where I can learn more about Ohms, I want to be really studious like you guys and know my stuff. I also want to get into speaker anatomy. It's interesting.

I meant to add:

The Comps are 8 ohm, single voice coil subs, wired together in parallel (+ to +, - to -), to present a 4 ohm load at the bridged Kenwood amp. The dual 4 ohm CVRs essentially become 8 ohm subs by wiring their voice coils in series (+ terminal on one voice coil wired to - terminal on the other, and remaining + and - out to the amp, and then repeat for second sub), and then, just like the Comps, are subsequently wired together in parallel to present the final 4 ohm load.

If you got a 1 ohm stable amp, you simply wire the voice coils in parallel vs. series, and your final load becomes 1 ohm.

 

[Jaguar 10+ year member]

This ^
However, I will contend that Kicker doesn't quite deserve the hate they get. I'm not crazy about the inductance specs on the CVRs (Le of 7+), nor the less than desirable Xmax, but they demonstrably pound hard for the watts used. If they aren't overpowered by much, and the amp isn't driven to clipping, they will take a serious beating and get loud doing it for what they are.

@ Jaguar:

I must concede that CVRs definitely perform better in a properly designed ported box vs. sealed (but please no high tuned, too small boxes. That's one reason they have a negative reputation).

Well Kicker speakers Kick hard. Again I can't say much for SQ but as far as how my system is set up I needed SPL subwoofers. I'm using a box similar to this for the new Kicker Compvr 12"s. I think it's the same box. As you can see it's pretty big. I was going to get the Kicker Vx, CompVX | KICKER but I'll check those out in a few months.

 

[av83 10+ year member]

Well Kicker speakers Kick hard! Some of these other speakers non-mainstream subwoofers don't look like they will last long under pressure, but what do I know. I'm using a box similar to this for the new Kicker Compvr 12"s. I think it's the same box. As you can see it's pretty big. I was going to get the Kicker Vx, CompVX | KICKER but I'll check those out in a few months.

^^^^^ No to that. Don't buy an enclosure that wasn't designed specifically for your needs. Looking like it's "pretty big" is a far, far cry from knowing it's correct.

 

[Jaguar 10+ year member]

I meant to add:
The Comps are 8 ohm, single voice coil subs, wired together in parallel (+ to +, - to -), to present a 4 ohm load at the bridged Kenwood amp. The dual 4 ohm CVRs essentially become 8 ohm subs by wiring their voice coils in series (+ terminal on one voice coil wired to - terminal on the other, and remaining + and - out to the amp, and then repeat for second sub), and then, just like the Comps, are subsequently wired together in parallel to present the final 4 ohm load.

If you got a 1 ohm stable amp, you simply wire the voice coils in parallel vs. series, and your final load becomes 1 ohm.

Quackhead suggested something very similar, so this is what I'll advise my guy to do. I would attempt it, truthfully Parallel and Series wiring does not seem difficult individually, but together? I rather have my man do it. I doubt it will cost much.

 

[quackhead 10+ year member]

what this all comes down to, is what sounds good to YOU. You are fortunate to have the resources you have available today..Like I said in another post, I learned through reading magazines and trial and error...and at $1.00 per watt at the time, some of those errors were mighty costly. Class D amplification was a Blessing in efficiency in more ways than most will ever know.

 

[Jaguar 10+ year member]

^^^^^ No to that. Don't buy an enclosure that wasn't designed specifically for your needs. Looking like it's "pretty big" is a far, far cry from knowing it's correct.

Wow, a lot of feedback on this thread, Im sure I'm going to get trashed later by more experienced members, but again I am new to this, also very excited to learn more. As for the box I already have it, but if it's advised I'll just get the Kicker CompVR Box. It's not expensive.

 

[av83 10+ year member]

Quackhead suggested something very similar, so this is what I'll advise my guy to do. I would attempt it, truthfully Parallel and Series wiring is does not seem difficult individually, but together? I rather have my man do it. I doubt it will cost much.

Seriously? You are not even trying. It sounds like your "guy" has his hands deep in your pocket.... and if you let him, he's going to leave them in there. You are wasting money hand over fist.

 

[Danometal 10+ year member]

I'm sure you guys could teach me so lot, I know I'd be jealous of some of your systems, thanks for your advice as well. One day Im going to be smart enough to give as much consideration to non-mainstream brands as name brands I promise. Hopefully one day I can look back and laugh at my choices and have a real pavement pounding system. I calculate my next level up to be around a few months from now. Glad to be a member of this forum.

I'm sure to get a dislike on this, but be careful about buying into the "non-mainstream > mainstream" mentality, as that's not necessarily true. I will buy whatever product is the most feasible for its job, as dictated by its specs, budget, design goals, etc.

For example:

1). I needed a component set with silk dome tweeters, and mids with 2 inch or less mounting depth. Polk DB 6501 fit the criteria.

2). I needed amps with front mounted controls, CEA-2006 compliant power output, smooth looks, and 1000 watts on tap for the sub stage. Boston GTA series amps took care of that.

3). I needed a single 12 inch sub that destroyed the lows, has low distortion, is very efficient with tons of output, and didn't cost a fortune. JBL P1224 to the rescue.

4). I needed an electronic crossover that costed less than $150 and did full bandpass for the mids. Cache' CEX on sonicelectronix for $89. Perfect.

I could care less who hated on my setup and/or my gear for any reason. It sounds AMAZING. It sounds like the bands I listen to are literally playing on the hood of my car at full tilt. In essence, I was able to meet my design goals with the equipment chosen and the install performed. Only the Cache' unit would classify as non-mainstream.

 

[TheUnderFighter 10+ year member]

Yea... that box pictured there is TINY for two 12's. If you want louder bass, you'll need a ported box. And if you go ported, you're likely not going to have enough room for 12's. Best bet would be two 10's, or one 15. The Kicker whatever box will be a huge waste of money. Those are high tuned boxes, with not nearly enough internal volume. Especially for Kicker subs, which are notorious for requiring much greater than average amounts of air space to perform optimally.

 

[Jaguar 10+ year member]

Seriously? You are not even trying. It sounds like your "guy" has his hands deep in your pocket.... and if you let him, he's going to leave them in there. You are wasting money hand over fist.

Well the two people who told me how to do it were very specific, I suppose I could have a look at it, either way I'm going to have additional wire. If it's as simple as doing a Parallel wiring and adding series wiring that might be easy, but wouldn't the tuning on my amp need to be adjusted as well. The last 12"s I had in that box were 8ohms, these are 4ohms each. Also may I make a suggestion? Try and be a little more constructive with your criticism, I'm new. It's just you seem a little rough around the edges, thanks.

 

[TheUnderFighter 10+ year member]

Well the two people who told me how to do it were very specific, I suppose I could have a look at it, either way I'm going to have additional wire. If it's as simple as doing a Parallel wiring and adding series wiring that might be easy, but wouldn't the tuning on my amp need to be adjusted as well. The last 12"s I had in that box were 8ohms, these are 4ohms each. Also may I make a suggestion? Try and be a little more constructive with your criticism, I'm new. It's just you seem a little rough around the edges, thanks.

The wiring is a simple as connecting the dots as pictured on the diagrams.

The tuning is as simple as taking your DMM and setting gains to the proper pre-out voltage.

If you're talking about Low Pass filters, that's set to your liking.

Bass boost is always set to 0.

 

[quackhead 10+ year member]

Well the two people who told me how to do it were very specific, I suppose I could have a look at it, either way I'm going to have additional wire. If it's as simple as doing a Parallel wiring and adding series wiring that might be easy, but wouldn't the tuning on my amp need to be adjusted as well. The last 12"s I had in that box were 8ohms, these are 4ohms each. Also may I make a suggestion? Try and be a little more constructive with your criticism, I'm new. It's just you seem a little rough around the edges, thanks.

you were running subs parallel to the KW bridged before?..if so, with the series/parallel config, your amp should "see" the same 4 ohm load impedance

 

[Jaguar 10+ year member]

Yea... that box pictured there is TINY for two 12's. If you want louder bass, you'll need a ported box. And if you go ported, you're likely not going to have enough room for 12's. Best bet would be two 10's, or one 15. The Kicker whatever box will be a huge waste of money. Those are high tuned boxes, with not nearly enough internal volume. Especially for Kicker subs, which are notorious for requiring much greater than average amounts of air space to perform optimally.

I don't think I could get a wider box in my trunk. That one takes the entire length from left to right. I think a deeper box might sound better for these subs. Incidentally the Kicker CompVR factory box is much smaller than the one I have.

Can I ask a question? When I took my 12"s out I noticed some sealant in the box to glue the parts of the box together. I expect the people that make these make so

many that they don't really use as much sealant as they could. Would it help to seal re-enforce the integrity of tinside of the box along those adhesive lines in the box. If so what type of sealant.

 

[av83 10+ year member]

Yea... that box pictured there is TINY for two 12's. If you want louder bass, you'll need a ported box. And if you go ported, you're likely not going to have enough room for 12's. Best bet would be two 10's, or one 15. The Kicker whatever box will be a huge waste of money. Those are high tuned boxes, with not nearly enough internal volume. Especially for Kicker subs, which are notorious for requiring much greater than average amounts of air space to perform optimally.

In other words... Return your subs. Then come back and tell us what you are looking to achieve, and with what amount of dinero you have to accomplish it. Then, after you have made an informed decision based on the opinions and knowledge of people that know this hobby VERY well, you can purchase goods with the satisfaction of knowing you made a well-informed decision. Then, the kind-hearted people here at caraudio.com will do all we can to help you get it installed correctly. But, you can't just keep picking stuff out with the hopes that it will work and not knowing for sure. Or worse, being sold whatever your local shop feels like getting rid of that day....