Sub suggestion

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

If your amp is underrated, then you can do direct RMS matching between amps and subs

 

[2RZ-FE 10+ year member]

My amps are way above the rms as my subs. I have a 12" Demon and a 12" SA12. Both amps do 1200w rms both are JBL. Box rise and all that.

 

[Marve_Lous]

I say 2 GCON 15s with D4 coils wired to 1 ohm on the Smart 3. I've heard plenty of people say the SSAs can handle above their RMS ratings, and with box rise they won't get the full 3k watts anyway.

 

[Masted85]

I like headroom with wattage. I've seen way more underpowered system blow up than overpowered ones.

3000 watt amp? I'd look at 2500-2800 watt subs total
1200 watt amp? I'd look at 1000w subs
10,000 watt amp? I'd look for 8000w subs total

Thanks for all your help on this post.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

I disagree with box rise and that whole concept of how that works. The resistance is fluid. You have no idea what your rise is playing music. The resistance is changing 100's of times per second, depending on the location of the coil relative to the flux field of the magnet. Switching between notes is going to rise differently than a tone. For daily, there is almost zero benefit to designing around rise.

 

[Masted85]

I say 2 GCON 15s with D4 coils wired to 1 ohm on the Smart 3. I've heard plenty of people say the SSAs can handle above their RMS ratings, and with box rise they won't get the full 3k watts anyway.

That sounds good to me. Any site suggestions for purchase?

 

[Masted85]

I disagree with box rise and that whole concept of how that works. The resistance is fluid. You have no idea what your rise is playing music. The resistance is changing 100's of times per second, depending on the location of the coil relative to the flux field of the magnet. Switching between notes is going to rise differently than a tone. For daily, there is almost zero benefit to designing around rise.

I don't know if you are doing box designing at the moment but I may need something drawn up, if you are.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

Nominal resistinace in ohms seems to be simply the wire resisitance. you can actually have a really low resistance potetionally when a sub is at peak xmax in one direction and the suspension pulls it back down. And in all reality, higher average resistance loads on the amp will make the amp more efficient and run cooler, which can often times makes the system play better. I've hooked up a fi q 15 at 1 ohm vs 4 ohm in my f150. only had it all stock electrical + a batcap 2000 in the back. The sub was literally almost as loud at 4 ohms as it was at one. That's 1200w vs 450w on my amp. There's a balance in electrical systems that's important to find. I had 380 ah worth of batteries in my exploder and a 300 amp EA alt charging @ 15v. All this for a 200 w x 2 channel and 2 1200w sub amps bridged. I was able to run my subs at 1.4 strapped vs the rated 2 ohms. When you start doing that, running low ohms without a very hefty charging system and batteries, you can get wild peaks because the sub resistance at certain notes will be way louder because you're already struggling to keep voltage and when that notes hits and the resistance drops at that note, it puts more power through the sub. But when your box is musical oriented with a smaller port and it's designed for a wide bandwidth, that more even resistance keeps the sub voltages more in line across your frequency bandwidth. My 2 18's had an insane peak around like 65 hz where I would drop into the 11 volt range at full tilt, even with all of that electrical. it was loud as ****. Had to do with my low tuning and the fact the box was sort of larger than it needed to be for extending up that high. So on my 9887, I did a like light -6 or -12 db per octave crossover at 50 hz, so it would soften everything above 50 hz a little, and wouldn't rape my equipment playing over 60 hz. Worked out really well actually.

 

[Marve_Lous]

That sounds good to me. Any site suggestions for purchase?

I ordered from store.soundsolutionsaudio.com and it got to me pretty quick.

 

[Marve_Lous]

Nominal resistinace in ohms seems to be simply the wire resisitance. you can actually have a really low resistance potetionally when a sub is at peak xmax in one direction and the suspension pulls it back down. And in all reality, higher average resistance loads on the amp will make the amp more efficient and run cooler, which can often times makes the system play better. I've hooked up a fi q 15 at 1 ohm vs 4 ohm in my f150. only had it all stock electrical + a batcap 2000 in the back. The sub was literally almost as loud at 4 ohms as it was at one. That's 1200w vs 450w on my amp. There's a balance in electrical systems that's important to find. I had 380 ah worth of batteries in my exploder and a 300 amp EA alt charging @ 15v. All this for a 200 w x 2 channel and 2 1200w sub amps bridged. I was able to run my subs at 1.4 strapped vs the rated 2 ohms. When you start doing that, running low ohms without a very hefty charging system and batteries, you can get wild peaks because the sub resistance at certain notes will be way louder because you're already struggling to keep voltage and when that notes hits and the resistance drops at that note, it puts more power through the sub. But when your box is musical oriented with a smaller port and it's designed for a wide bandwidth, that more even resistance keeps the sub voltages more in line across your frequency bandwidth. My 2 18's had an insane peak around like 65 hz where I would drop into the 11 volt range at full tilt, even with all of that electrical. it was loud as ****. Had to do with my low tuning and the fact the box was sort of larger than it needed to be for extending up that high. So on my 9887, I did a like light -6 or -12 db per octave crossover at 50 hz, so it would soften everything above 50 hz a little, and wouldn't rape my equipment playing over 60 hz. Worked out really well actually.

So it'd be better for him to get 2 D2 coils wired at 2 ohms to be easier on his electrical system?

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

I don't know if you are doing box designing at the moment but I may need something drawn up, if you are.

I'm starting back.

So it'd be better for him to get 2 D2 coils wired at 2 ohms to be easier on his electrical system?

I wouldn't do that if you can run at 1 ohm and it gives you more power. Literally every factor plays into what I was talking about. Clean signals, good voltage, quality of sub and box, vehicle resonances. I was just saying if you're building a daily system, it's way easier to do close to the vanilla ratings when pairing amps and subs. And just do a musical box based around bandwidth you want in either direction. I don't see much gain for doing stuff SPL competitors do like running lower than rated ohm levels on your amp or designing a box around it's electrical resistances. You just give the sub what it wants, good clean power and a good box, and it's going to be loud regardless. Box rise is there but chasing it for music it's like chasing the dragon. It's just going to move around too much because you're playing more than 1 tone.

I'm fairly sure most 4th and 6th order bandpasses are going to have more rise because there's typically going to be more pressure on either side of the cone, being that there's the extra stage of compression in the front chamber. If that was the biggest issue, then why are the loudest vehicles in the world mostly running series 6th orders?

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

I'm pretty sure these 180 db guys largely run series 6th orders.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

They don't like to show their secrets so it's hard to prove

 

[shredder2]

I still vote for 2 Gcon 15s in that 06 Tahoe, That smart3 should be just enough to flex a pair of these nice.

Nice and simple too, ported subs up/port back

 

[Masted85]

I still vote for 2 Gcon 15s in that 06 Tahoe, That smart3 should be just enough to flex a pair of these nice.

Nice and simple too, ported subs up/port back

Now I'm pretty stupid and I'm sure this has come up a million times. The system will be just Daily/Showing off so what is the size I should go for? I'm really just wanting something bigger than 12 since it's not a common size in my neck of the woods. Also the upgrade options on the SSA page. Is there anything I should go for or not?