low (22Hz) port tuning in real world trunk applications

I would never tune that low... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/fyi.gif.9f1f679348da7204ce960cfc74bca8e0.gif Sounds like it would only be good to act as like a home theater sound, and not musical ,if that makes any sense
Not musical? You must be used to 35 Hz and up tuned enclosures. Sure, with lower tuned setups you get less output, but that's the same with sealed enclosures as well. Low end is amazing and yes, it does sound very musical. I've heard a setup tuned to somewhere below 20 Hz, was somewhere between 14 and 18 Hz. Still had plenty of output and sounded great.

 
I think the difference is substantial:
sealedvsportedpg6.jpg


Imageshack is slow as fawk today. refresh if needed. ported in green.

I am not referring to what a theoretical plot can produce, but rather the amount of musical content that exists at the sub-20Hz level.

Don't get me wrong here though; you do what you want to do.

 
What are you listening to in car that is dropping down into the low 20's? I don't listen to anything like that, so I've never tuned that low....
Bass I Love You...has a 14 Hz note in there IIRC. P Diddy has a song called Diddy Rock and it drops real low, forgot what frequency but it's at about 2:06. T.I. has a song called Undertaker, I think... drops low in the begining. Lil Wyte's Oxycotton or Hoods Run Down also drops very low. And there's plenty of other songs that get quite low around 30 Hz and it makes a difference. Young Jeezy and Akon's Soul Survivor (31 Hz IIRC) for example, or USDA's White Girl (32 Hz IIRC) and Jeezy's I Put On. I personally don't mind sacrificing some output for low end.

 
Frankly, if you're going to tune to the low 20's you might as well simply go with a sealed design or IB for that matter. There is little point having a port there when its not being used...
I'd have to agree with this as well...though IB will require quite a bit of work.

 
I am not referring to what a theoretical plot can produce, but rather the amount of musical content that exists at the sub-20Hz level.
Don't get me wrong here though; you do what you want to do.
I get what you mean about the content. But even 30hz provides

6db of increased output. That would be helpfull right?

 
I get what you mean about the content. But even 30hz provides6db of increased output. That would be helpfull right?
There is certainly *much* more bass content at 30Hz than there is at 20Hz. Hypothetically speaking, would you rather like to augment the bass when there is 40% content or 2%? The choice is yours.

 
i was told that if u tune anywhere in the low to mid 20's it will sound like a sealed box but it will have the output of a ported box...so if a sealed box does like 20hz at -3db...the ported box (depending on how big it is) tuned in the low to mid 20's should be higher...it would be nice to have a box tune to 22hz that has a +3db bump at 20hz

80
At frequencies much higher than the tuning point, the air mass in the port stops moving and becomes like another wall in your enclosure. So basically, the enclosure starts to act like a sealed box and the driver will react accordingly (speaking in the bass range and I'm ignoring all port resonances above the fundamental). In an enclosure tuned in the 20hz range, the driver will start to act like it is in a sealed enclosure around 40hz and up. That will also help give the setup the sound of a sealed enclosure for a good chunk of the bass range. The bass in my car is very punchy and tight with no traces of stored energy or sloppy transients. I would say it is very similar to the .707 sealed box alignment I have used with exception to 35hz and below, where my current box will play down there effortlessly and clean. No more bottoming out the driver trying to get decent output below 30hz.

Frankly, if you're going to tune to the low 20's you might as well simply go with a sealed design or IB for that matter. There is little point having a port there when its not being used...
So extra bandwidth is a bad thing to have? You would rather throw a ton of power at a driver and try to get all the excursion out of it that you can and drive up all that nonlinear distortion? Also, just because the port is tuned in the 20s does not mean that it will not aid in output above and below tuning. If designed correctly, the setup can sound sealed down to a certain frequency and then below that, the port comes into play to aid in output and help with cone control. The stored energy problems and group delay effects are also minimized by tuning so low and you drive those effects down out of the more common spectrum.

In my testings, the large sealed enclosure rolled off too quickly below 35hz (in car) and lacked definition and output in the 20s. Even IB systems can have this problem (depending on car and equipment) and even so, not many people have an option to run IB in a car environment. IB can also lack in output and power handling which leads to multiple large drivers when a single small driver could have done the same job with lower distortion.

So really, there is no point going sealed if you're looking for REAL bottom end extension. Yes, the port IS used in low tuned enclosures and yes there is a point if you're looking for a solid, low distortion, bottom end.

What are you listening to in car that is dropping down into the low 20's? I don't listen to anything like that, so I've never tuned that low....
It's not very common but it is out there. There are a lot of bass tracks from people like Bassotronics and the like that have a lot of content down there. I am a fan of that style music and listen to it often. There still is content in other genres of music as well and many times, it just goes unnoticed due to being too low amplitude. Avenged Sevenfold's song Almost Easy has some 20hz material in it that sounds pretty interesting. I listen to a lot of Ayreon and Arjen's stuff also contains content in the 15-25hz range. Many classical pieces can get down there as well.

It's not about playing songs with constant bass lines to show off how loud and consistent they are but rather to play music and enjoy the detail and depth to it. For example, I was listening to a blues song the other day that had a constant foot tapping against an old wood floor. There was a nice resonance that dug down very deep and it made my car cabin area appear to be much larger due to the apparent low resonance of the floor. That subtle content (I believe it was from like 18-21hz or so?) added detail that I was not able to get from listening to the track with my headphones that only get down to around 30hz before starting to crap out.

 
There is certainly *much* more bass content at 30Hz than there is at 20Hz. Hypothetically speaking, would you rather like to augment the bass when there is 40% content or 2%? The choice is yours.
Content percentage is a horrible way to decide the bandwidth of your musical content. The bandwidth should be based on personal preference of sound, not how much musical content there is there... come on.

Also, not everybody is interested in high gain low bandwidth.

 
I'm one of the lucky ones whose IB setup does not lack in output compared to sealed or ported enclosures. Having a trunk car and the ability to go IB'd, I would much rather have this IB setup over a huge ported box. A ported enclosure tuned to 20hz would be even bigger since 20hz would call for a very long port length.

If you have the room, gas, and suspension for a giant ported box, then more power to ya.

 
Bass I Love You...has a 14 Hz note in there IIRC. P Diddy has a song called Diddy Rock and it drops real low, forgot what frequency but it's at about 2:06. T.I. has a song called Undertaker, I think... drops low in the begining. Lil Wyte's Oxycotton or Hoods Run Down also drops very low. And there's plenty of other songs that get quite low around 30 Hz and it makes a difference. Young Jeezy and Akon's Soul Survivor (31 Hz IIRC) for example, or USDA's White Girl (32 Hz IIRC) and Jeezy's I Put On. I personally don't mind sacrificing some output for low end.
NONE of that shit gets played on my system though //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif I prefer music, not test tones with some idiot going............aaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crazy.gif.c13912c32de98515d3142759a824dae7.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

I agree with Mark, if you want to tune that low then why not just go sealed. And super low tuning doesn't necessarily equal SQ. My HT subs are tuned to 19Hz and they're great for HT, but not as good on most music.

 
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy gyeah. hahaaaaa

Throne room and title ending on the IASCA disc is awesome //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 
Content percentage is a horrible way to decide the bandwidth of your musical content. The bandwidth should be based on personal preference of sound, not how much musical content there is there... come on.
Also, not everybody is interested in high gain low bandwidth.

No need to get all defensive on us here, just because we don't agree with you...

I like to look at things from a practical standpoint. If my preference of sound equates to one song out of 100 that has content to 20Hz, I would probably base my design on the other 99, not the one. But like I said, the OP (and anyone else for that matter) can do what he wants.

Folks around here seem to be hung up on sheer output however, and to help achieve that would be to tune where it has the highest impact...

 
No need to get all defensive on us here, just because we don't agree with you...
I like to look at things from a practical standpoint. If my preference of sound equates to one song out of 100 that has content to 20Hz, I would probably base my design on the other 99, not the one. But like I said, the OP (and anyone else for that matter) can do what he wants.

Folks around here seem to be hung up on sheer output however, and to help achieve that would be to tune where it has the highest impact...
I'm not upset or annoyed. I think you would be surprised to see how much content there really is below 30hz on many tracks. And I'm speaking for all kinds of music. Rap seems to be one of the only genres I can't find music with much stuff below 30hz. There are slowed down songs but I don't count that.

 
I'm one of the lucky ones whose IB setup does not lack in output compared to sealed or ported enclosures. Having a trunk car and the ability to go IB'd, I would much rather have this IB setup over a huge ported box. A ported enclosure tuned to 20hz would be even bigger since 20hz would call for a very long port length.
If you have the room, gas, and suspension for a giant ported box, then more power to ya.
You don't need a huge enclosure (net or gross) for low tuned enclosures nor do you need as much port area. Sure if you're one of those people who think that you need 14-16" per cubic foot, then you're going to have a hell of time getting something tuned that low. Realistically, you don't need as much tuning lower.

My current enclosure for a single 12 is smaller than the 2.2 @ 33hz enclosure I had in there and it gets lower, is more efficient, and is much cleaner.

 
NONE of that shit gets played on my system though //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif I prefer music, not test tones with some idiot going............aaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyy //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crazy.gif.c13912c32de98515d3142759a824dae7.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif
I agree with Mark, if you want to tune that low then why not just go sealed. And super low tuning doesn't necessarily equal SQ. My HT subs are tuned to 19Hz and they're great for HT, but not as good on most music.
Lol.... I play it every now and then, but for the most part I prefer setups that can get low, I just think it sounds better.

More power for subs dosn't always accomplish a goal either. Highly efficient drivers are very helpful. I actually like having a sub that needs only a few hundred watts. Not only is it saving money on buying an amp with less power, but it also does not require multiple batteries and an HO alt.

Then again, what is plenty loud for me as a daily setup is probably not enough for some people. High 130's, shoot even around mid 30's for setups that peak in the 30 Hz range is plenty for me.

 
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