Looking for a decent 5" (ish) woofer

[analogfreq]

I am putting together a car audio system right now, first one ever. Starting with a digital media receiver for the source. The sub will probably be a Morel Primo 8" sub in a sealed box, powered by an Alpine mono amp. There is driver that is better suited for lower frequencies, I am looking at, but for now, the Primo 8 will do. Adequate fused power is provided at the amps. Currently, the mid tops are some Morel Tempo 402's with external crossover. Not huge power at all, but they sound nice for what they are capable of. They will be powered by two channels of a 4 channel Class AB amp. They are built into some Baltic Birch 'pods', on custom built mounts. The amp allows for an adjustable high pass filter which will be utilized, probably around >320hz. The sub will be on a low pass filter, cut around 90hz.

The mid-bass is missing.

This is in a Toyota pickup, extended cab. Not the friendliest vehicle for a sound system. I am thinking of installing some 5" woofers, maybe 5.5", 6", or 6.5", for the 'kick' section but I would like to retain the factory grills for the low-keyness. These will be on a low pass filter <320hz, with a high pass filter set around 90hz.

I am not looking for ear bleeding power, just good clean sound.

Does this sound like a decent plan? I am a newbie with car audio, so this is the most important question of this post.

Second, any recommendations for a nice mid-bass woofer driver that would fit this application? (90hz - 315hz) Most of the offerings I see are cheap chinese built drivers. I have built a good number of pro sound reinforcement systems, mainly horn based, and have used nice drivers, which is where I am basing my judgement of 'cheap Chinese built drivers' from. Build quality is usually obvious in drivers, whatever quality.

There are a lot of drivers out there without the big box names, or even the 'higher end' names. After seeing some of the supposedly 'higher end' drivers, I know that with a lot of these brands, the brand is what is being charged, not the build quality.

As a bonus question, how can a high quality DAC be placed in the system. I suspect that the Kenwood DMR that I have, only has a so-so DAC.

Thanks, all! This looks like a great forum.

Click to read more...

 

[BCotrell 10+ year member]

Try to do 6.5” that 5” driver size doesn’t give much bass

 

[analogfreq]

I was just measuring the opening in the panel, and 5" is too small. The bolt pattern diameter for the 5" driver below is too small for the opening. 6" driver is likely. A 6.5" driver requires a spacer of some sort. I am not totally against a 6.5", but so far, the rest of the system is pretty incognito. A driver that fits in the factory opening is ideal. Probably going to need some serious rattle chasing and damping in those cavities.

I was just looking at this. I have built some subs from some larger Ciare drivers. Really nice speakers.

Ciare HWG130 - Ciare HWG130 is a 5 inch 4 ohm speaker with a rubber surround bass and mid-bass speaker systems- Ciare Speakers - Ciare HWG130 5 inch speaker for bass guitar speaker systems, PA speakers, motorcycles, car speaker systems, recording stu

Ciare HWG130 5 inch 4 ohm speaker with rubber surround The Ciare HWG130 is a 5 inch speaker with 260 watts program power handling. The Ciare HWG130 is a quality bass & mid-bass speaker. The Ciare HWG130 works well in bass guitar speaker systems, PA speakers, motorcycles, car speaker systems...

www.usspeaker.com

 

[analogfreq]

Maybe more specifically, it looks like this driver could work well in a sealed box. I am trying to learn how to figure out what size box would give the desired result of a speaker using this Morel Virtus MW6 driver, that covers the 90hz - 300hz well.

• Nominal Impedance: 4 Ohms
• Power Handling: 140Wrms
• Max. *****.Pwr Handling: 300Wrms
• Sensitivity (2.83V/1M): 88dB
• Frequency Response: 55-4000 Hz
• Resonant Freq. Fs: 65Hz
• Voice Coil Diameter: 2.1in (54mm)
• Voice Coil Height: 0.48in (12mm)
• Voice Coil Type/ Former: Aluminum
• Voice Coil Wire: Hexatech Aluminum
• DC Resistance: 3.5 Ohms
• Voice Coil Induct. @1 kHz: 0.33MH
• Magnet System: Double Ferrite Rear Vented
• HE-Magnetic Gap Height: 0.16in (4mm)
• B-Flux Density (T.M.): 0.65
• BL Product/BXL:3.41
• Max. Linear Ex./Xmax: ±0.16in (±4mm)
• Suspension Compliance CMS - mm/N: 0.57
• Electrical Q Factor QES: 1.3
• QTS: 0.9
• QMS: 2.88
• Mech.Resistance RMS - Ohm/meter: 1.49
• Moving Mass MMS - gr: 10.67
• Equiv. Can Air Load VAS: 11.387L (0.45cu.ft)
• Effective Piston Area SD: 119sq.cm (18.45sq. inch)
• Cone Type: Formed Paper
• Cone Material: Composite Cellular Fiber
• Unit Diameter: 6.5in (165mm)
• Mounting Depth: 2.36in (61mm)
• Mounting Cutout: 5.55in (141mm)
• Net Weight: 0.739lb (1.61Kg)
  
  
  
  Virtus MW6 - Morel 6.5" Virtus Series Mid Woofers

  <ul> <li>Nominal Impedance: 4 Ohms</li> <li>Power Handling: 140Wrms </li> <li>Max. *****.Pwr Handling: 300Wrms </li> <li>Sensitivity (2.83V/1M): 88dB </li> <li>Frequency Response: 55-4000 Hz </li> <li>Resonant Freq. Fs: 65Hz

  www.woofersetc.com

 

[analogfreq]

Maybe a better question still..

How to provide the 90hz through 300hz range in this small system?

Sealed box?

Bass reflex box?

Driver?

 

[BCotrell 10+ year member]

You may be overthinking this. your proposed driver frequency is 55-4000 so your desired range is doable. Just know that it might take a little more than headunit power to get your midbass drivers to wake up at those lower frequencies, also enclosure will be key. Keeping your install low key in stock door location might be tasking. Try to determine available airspace in that door cavity and checking to see that it meets the recommended requirements of the drivers. If you pass go here, do everything you can to seal your doors. This means a good amount of matting, closed cell foam behind the speaker in the door cavity and metal sheets and sheet metal screw to cover major door access holes with dynamat over that. Or you could fiberglass small enclosures If you got skills like that.

What I listed isn’t step by step by any means just things to consider that might be part of the proces. Kick panels might prove to be easier overall with better sound results

 

[analogfreq]

Thank you.

Yes, 2 channels of one of the amps will power the kicks. 70w RMS @ 4ohms, so not huge, but I dont think I need to fully power these drivers, not looking for earbleeding SPL. I think I will be happy with the Morel 402's, they are breaking in right now, about 20 hours in now. I made some Baltic Birch enclosures, and am machining some adjustable mounts so they will sit at head level, behind the seats in the corners. I do not think it will take much from the midbass section to balance those, what is important to me is smooth response and some good kick. With the 402's and the sub, there is a big gap between 100-300hz (ish)

I think I am abandoning the idea of keeping the drivers hidden in the rear cavities of the car, mainly due to too many compromises in using that location, and more effort needed in sealing and damping. So, right now I am trying to figure out what the minimum size box is for building the kick section. I have decided on the Dynaudio Esotec MW162 driver for these. Most of the box calculators are for subwoofer enclosures. I do not need or want to go to 30hz with these, only right around 100hz. The amp has a low pass filter on it, and I will put a capacitor in-line to cut out the sub frequencies. I think this is a workable plan, except I have no idea how to calculate for a box, sealed, bass reflex, or bandpass, that is tuned for the 100-300hz range, short of building a couple of test cabinets, oversize, and gradually moving the rear panel in. Unfortunately, I am not set up to measure frequency response, so that would just have to be a 'sounds good' sort of thing. I would love to know that I am starting from an engineered volume tuned for the chosen frequency.

Any ideas on what sort of cabinet would be a good balance of smallest size and smooth, flat frequency response? How to design the cabinets?

 

[analogfreq]

Like, how do you use Qts to determine box volume for a particular driver, when that driver covers a pretty wide frequency range and you only want to use it for a portion of that?

 

[analogfreq]

Questions answered. More research came up with that driver in a sealed box of .22cu.ft. having an f3 of 86.42 and a Qtc of .707. Small and simple.

 

[BCotrell 10+ year member]

Questions answered. More research came up with that driver in a sealed box of .22cu.ft. having an f3 of 86.42 and a Qtc of .707. Small and simple.

Kick panel likely easier to make that environment vs isolating within an unknown and frequently leaky door environment

 

[analogfreq]

Yep. You are correct.