why that was nice

[SomeGuyDude 10+ year member]

well I think you misunderstood, i this statement was not related to the previous post about the canadian health care system. Honestly globally countries feel sad for the US and our health care system. American's think that the other countries are inferior and we are the end all be all, but peoples way of life in other nations far exceed ours. In some countries they have free delivery doctors. meaning just as we call up to order pizza, they call a doctor and they make free house calls and if its something they cant handle they send an ambulance to get to take you to the hospital and guess what its free. Most of my family on my mothers side lives in Toronto and they maybe pay 15% tax but again dont have to pay for anything medically. On visit to an ER or surgery can cost you your salary. My g/f mother had a kidney transplant and was in the hospital for 4 days and thebill was over $200k. I'd pay more taxes for no health care cost in a heart beat

Nono, I was agreeing with you. That system is EXCELLENT, and any increase in taxes is more than offset by lowered insurance payments. Canadians and Brits pay around 8% of their GDP toward health care in taxes, Americans pay 17% of our GDP toward private health care. A universal system would, on average, cut the amount of money each person spends on health care in HALF, and we'd end up with a way better system.

But unfortunately what's on the table in the US isn't even universal, it's a sort of weird hybrid.

 

[duece212 5,000+ posts]

So you want a government bureaucrat to decide if grandma starves to death?
And you do want people to starve to death if your government bureaucrat decides they dont want to work.

overpopulation is a problem...

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

Dam, did anyone catch that history channel special on the megladon? They were going to carbon date a tooth they found to determine if it likely still exists, but I had to go to work and missed the results. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif

 

[JayRich 10+ year member]

I am not sure if you realize how stupid this comment is.

What was stupid about that statement exactly. Canadians pay more taxes than we do, but have FREE healthcare. What part of that does not make sense to you???

 

[snoopdan 5,000+ posts]

I don't think so.
My father is in terrible health...why shouldn't he pay more for insurance? Even he thinks he is getting over on the system.

because that's a socially, but mostly moral issue. So we (as a society) should just let the sick get sicker by not being able to afford healthcare? Jesus christ flip, why don't you fire up the gas chambers while you're at it.

 

[JayRich 10+ year member]

Nono, I was agreeing with you. That system is EXCELLENT, and any increase in taxes is more than offset by lowered insurance payments. Canadians and Brits pay around 8% of their GDP toward health care in taxes, Americans pay 17% of our GDP toward private health care. A universal system would, on average, cut the amount of money each person spends on health care in HALF, and we'd end up with a way better system.
But unfortunately what's on the table in the US isn't even universal, it's a sort of weird hybrid.

Gotcha

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

Nono, I was agreeing with you. That system is EXCELLENT, and any increase in taxes is more than offset by lowered insurance payments. Canadians and Brits pay around 8% of their GDP toward health care in taxes, Americans pay 17% of our GDP toward private health care. A universal system would, on average, cut the amount of money each person spends on health care in HALF, and we'd end up with a way better system.
But unfortunately what's on the table in the US isn't even universal, it's a sort of weird hybrid.

Americans make poorer healthy choices than other industrialized countries as well. Until we start executing people for unhealthy habits, it's going not going to work out. I wonder if there are other charges on things like sugary snacks, tobacco, booze, etc.

 

[duece212 5,000+ posts]

because that's a socially, but mostly moral issue. So we (as a society) should just let the sick get sicker by not being able to afford healthcare? Jesus christ flip, why don't you fire up the gas chambers while you're at it.

sometimes you gotta thin the herd

 

[tRiGgEr 5,000+ posts]

Them being a model has no influence in my decision to date them.

Them being attractive is.

 

[faulkton 5,000+ posts]

OP, Your data is flawed and biased. There is nothing in that data that requires medical expenses to be the sole contributing factor to the bankruptcies.
Only that about half of the people who went bankrupt had incurred medical expenses covering 10% of their income.

Who is to say that half of the american population does not also incur expenses of this magnitude?

The data ONLY shows that medical expenses were a contributing factor to a large number of bankruptcies. Well that's wonderful, but so were double cheesburgers and cup-o-noodles.

That is why your data is flawed, it presents results and draws an irrelevant conclusion from them.

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

Teasing causation from cross-sectional data is challenging. Multiple factors push families into bankruptcy. Yet, the data clearly establish that illness and medical bills play an important role in a large and growing proportion of bankruptcies.

 

[faulkton 5,000+ posts]

overpopulation is a problem...

Well its a good thing that you represent such a minority position no one even takes it seriously.

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

What was stupid about that statement exactly. Canadians pay more taxes than we do, but have FREE healthcare. What part of that does not make sense to you???

Healthcare is not free if they are paying for it in the form of higher taxes.

because that's a socially, but mostly moral issue. So we (as a society) should just let the sick get sicker by not being able to afford healthcare? Jesus christ flip, why don't you fire up the gas chambers while you're at it.

I cannot think of a mechanism or program that would provide benefits to the sick without proper measures in place to prevent moral hazard. I do support rolling uninsurable people into programs that allow them to get care. However, I find a very difficult time supporting enabling people to live who are not making choices to improve their own lives. If sick people aren't demonstrating that they are trying to get better through healthy eating, exercise, SOMETHING why should I contribute to their life? If you are drowining and swimming for your life, I'd be more than happy to give you a helping hand. But if you are drowing and waiting for me because I have some moral duty to help you, well, you can just fvcking drown.

 

[faulkton 5,000+ posts]

So Jmanpc you take issue with my original posting?

Or do you agree with what i first posted?

 

[jmanpc 5,000+ posts]

I would propose we provide a minimal assistance program that would provide for bare necessities such as food and shelter.
Not a comfortable lifestyle by any means but enough to keep people from starving to death.

What would you do about people whom your government bureaucrat has decided dont want to work but have children?

Do you want children to starve to death because of their parents?

Why do you keep assuming I want people to starve to death? This is why you're such an *** to debate with.

Providing people with the means necessary to get by without working provides an incentive for people not to work and be of detriment to society.

In a perfect world, a bureaucrat wouldn't have to decide who eats and who doesn't. However, this isn't a perfect world, and there isn't a perfect solution. What it comes down to is that people are deciding for themselves whether they eat or not.

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

Teasing causation from cross-sectional data is challenging. Multiple factors push families into bankruptcy. Yet, the data clearly establish that illness and medical bills play an important role in a large and growing proportion of bankruptcies.

I wonder if those people (who had insurance) where given guidance on how to select healthcare plans would they have still found themselves in similar economic circumstances?

People review compensation, 401(k), and vacation plans dilligently when accepting employment. How come they do not research their insurance policies with equal vigor?