Newbie with a question

[beech2000]

Why does my Kenwood excelon KAC-x541 in bridged mode driving a single CVR 12 at 2 ohms sound so much better at any setting wired on either channel bump stronger and cleaner than my Alpine MRP-M500 with any and all settings tried. What am i doing wrong?

Supply power wire - AWG 4 hook up wire for power and ground

Speaker wire - AWG 12 to CVR polarity verified correct

Dual 4 ohm voice coils wired in parallel to achieve 2 ohms and verified with my Fluke DVM

Tried sub with dual voice coils wired in series (8 ohms) very weak

Head unit is Kenwood excelon x993 POS - Door speakers are polk audio 6 inch

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[Branden2277]

Because pretty much when you bridge the amp you split the ohms that subs wired to so your amp is running at 1ohm instead of two giving you more power but creating more heat that your amp is not rated for. It might sound better because your pushing more power to your sub but your amp will not last if it isn't rated for a 1ohm load

 

[Babykinns 10+ year member]

Why does my Kenwood excelon KAC-x541 in bridged mode driving a single CVR 12 at 2 ohms sound so much better at any setting wired on either channel bump stronger and cleaner than my Alpine MRP-M500 with any and all settings tried. What am i doing wrong?Supply power wire - AWG 4 hook up wire for power and ground

Speaker wire - AWG 12 to CVR polarity verified correct

Dual 4 ohm voice coils wired in parallel to achieve 2 ohms and verified with my Fluke DVM

Tried sub with dual voice coils wired in series (8 ohms) very weak

Head unit is Kenwood excelon x993 POS - Door speakers are polk audio 6 inch

I may be wrong but I'm pretty sure I'm right.

I'll explain it like this.

The kenwood puts out 270 rms x 2 at 4 ohm bridged. Which is 540 rms.

At 2 ohm your sub is going to draw nearly 2x as much power out of the amp and your bridging it creating a 1ohm final load.

That is drawing way more power out of that amp than it can handle and your going to burn it up very fast doing that.

The reason it sounds better than on the Alpine is because the Alpine is only doing roughly 500rms and your probably ******* somewhere near 600-700 out of the kenwood.

I guarentee you will burn up that kenwood if you keep it bridged like that and you'll be lucky if you dont burn up the coils on the cvr or blow it

 

[beech2000]

Okay,

I just got done wiring the dual voice coils in Series and now have 8 ohms as measured again at the amp using my fluke DVM. Since the Kenwood is connected in bridged mode, I understand my impedance is really 4 ohms Correct? I also understand the Alpine is a mono amp (Not bridged) so since I have the dual voice coils wired in series does that mean the Alpine is seeing 8 ohm impedance and that's the reason for the sound quality difference ? The Kennwood still in all circumstances sounds way better than the Alpine? It doesn't make any sense. Thanks for the reply's

 

[beech2000]

Okay,I may be wrong but I'm pretty sure I'm right.

I'll explain it like this.

The kenwood puts out 270 rms x 2 at 4 ohm bridged. Which is 540 rms.

At 2 ohm your sub is going to draw nearly 2x as much power out of the amp and your bridging it creating a 1ohm final load.

That is drawing way more power out of that amp than it can handle and your going to burn it up very fast doing that.

The reason it sounds better than on the Alpine is because the Alpine is only doing roughly 500rms and your probably ******* somewhere near 600-700 out of the kenwood.

I guarentee you will burn up that kenwood if you keep it bridged like that and you'll be lucky if you dont burn up the coils on the cvr or blow it

I think I get it now.

So to accurately compare the two amps, I would have to wire the Kenwood at 4 ohms (Bridged) and the Alpine can be wired with both voice coils in parallel.

Can I use only one of the two voice coils to achieve the 4 ohms for the Kenwood? The CVR booklet says they must both be used. If I do that then I will have to run them in series for the Kenwood.

 

[Babykinns 10+ year member]

I think I get it now. So to accurately compare the two amps, I would have to wire the Kenwood at 4 ohms (Bridged) and the Alpine can be wired with both voice coils in parallel.

Can I use only one of the two voice coils to achieve the 4 ohms for the Kenwood? The CVR booklet says they must both be used. If I do that then I will have to run them in series for the Kenwood.

The rms power for the sub is divided between the coils if I'm correct. So in theory yes you could use just 1 vc but you would need to make sure its only getting half the power. As far as comparison for the amps you cant actually compare them with just your 1 sub. You would need a dual 2 ohm wired to 4 ohm to bridged on the Kenwood while your dual 4 is wired to 2 on the Alpine.

Your best bet in my opinion is to just wire the CVR down to 2 ohm and run it on the Alpine just to be safe because the way you were running it on the kenwood will burn up the kenwood. I have 2 Dual 4 ohm CVR's wired at 2 ohm. The rms rating for CVR's is 400 but I know they can safely take a little over 500rms ea because I have been pumpin 1.1k rms into mine for about a month now. If your aiming for more bass try to get your hands on another CVR and a 3.75-4.0 cubic foot ported box and an amp that does 800-1k rms. You can get another 1 of those CVR's on ebay cheap. The only hard part is making the right box for them unless you can afford the dual 12" kicker box thats made for them. They sound real good in the kicker box though. Mine is the side ported one. Remember some of this is just my opinion and just a heads up a lot of people will probably come in here and talk trash just because we're talkin kickers lol.

 

[bbeljefe]

When you run a DVC sub on only one coil you cut the power handling of the sub in half, plus you induce a current on the other voice coil, which is wasted energy.

Your best bet, as has been said, is to run the sub on the monoblock amplifier as it's designed to run the sub. Use the 2 channel to make your front stage come alive. ;-)

 

[beech2000]

When you run a DVC sub on only one coil you cut the power handling of the sub in half, plus you induce a current on the other voice coil, which is wasted energy.
Your best bet, as has been said, is to run the sub on the monoblock amplifier as it's designed to run the sub. Use the 2 channel to make your front stage come alive. ;-)

Okay I understand. I just am greatly disappointed in the Alpine sound though. I still can't help to think I am doing something else wrong but can't identify it. So many people rank the Alpine high which is the reason for the recent purchase. Many thanks for the help. Regards.

 

[Babykinns 10+ year member]

Okay I understand. I just am greatly disappointed in the Alpine sound though. I still can't help to think I am doing something else wrong but can't identify it. So many people rank the Alpine high which is the reason for the recent purchase. Many thanks for the help. Regards.

No problem and no you weren't doin nothing wrong the alpine was just giving the sub what its suppose to get the way you were wiring it to the kenwood was giving it way to much which would of blown your sub or fried your amp or both. It might of sounded a lot louder and cleaner ect at the time but it was probably only played for a short period of time right?

 

[beech2000]

The rms power for the sub is divided between the coils if I'm correct. So in theory yes you could use just 1 vc but you would need to make sure its only getting half the power. As far as comparison for the amps you cant actually compare them with just your 1 sub. You would need a dual 2 ohm wired to 4 ohm to bridged on the Kenwood while your dual 4 is wired to 2 on the Alpine.
Your best bet in my opinion is to just wire the CVR down to 2 ohm and run it on the Alpine just to be safe because the way you were running it on the kenwood will burn up the kenwood. I have 2 Dual 4 ohm CVR's wired at 2 ohm. The rms rating for CVR's is 400 but I know they can safely take a little over 500rms ea because I have been pumpin 1.1k rms into mine for about a month now. If your aiming for more bass try to get your hands on another CVR and a 3.75-4.0 cubic foot ported box and an amp that does 800-1k rms. You can get another 1 of those CVR's on ebay cheap. The only hard part is making the right box for them unless you can afford the dual 12" kicker box thats made for them. They sound real good in the kicker box though. Mine is the side ported one. Remember some of this is just my opinion and just a heads up a lot of people will probably come in here and talk trash just because we're talkin kickers lol.

I actually did try two 12" CVR's today from my boat wired using all for vc's with a impedance of 4 ohms today as measured on the DVM. The Alpine was very weak. The Kenwood blows the heck out of the Alpine with one CVR 12" with vc's wired at 8 ohms. See what I mean? One CVR 12 wired with both vcs at 8 ohms (Series) has much fuller sound than the Alpine does with two CVR 12's in my son's street wise box which also has a small port by the terminals. So strange. Taking it to the Mexican sound shop up the street to see what they have to say. Doesn't make sense. Thanks so much

 

[Babykinns 10+ year member]

I actually did try two 12" CVR's today from my boat wired using all for vc's with a impedance of 4 ohms today as measured on the DVM. The Alpine was very weak. The Kenwood blows the heck out of the Alpine with one CVR 12" with vc's wired at 8 ohms. See what I mean? One CVR 12 wired with both vcs at 8 ohms (Series) has much fuller sound than the Alpine does with two CVR 12's in my son's street wise box which also has a small port by the terminals. So strange. Taking it to the Mexican sound shop up the street to see what they have to say. Doesn't make sense. Thanks so much

so you have 2 cvr's? and what is the cubic feet of the box?

 

[beech2000]

Not sure but it takes up the whole back seat. I would think 6 Cubic feet but just guessing its 4 feet wide and about 20" tall square. My sons friend is connecting my Alpine up to his system as i write. The results will be interesting.

 

[beech2000]

so you have 2 cvr's? and what is the cubic feet of the box?

Oops in trouble now with neighbors so couldn't play to long. My Alpine was okay but not great. He has two Memphis 15"s in box in trunk mounted backwards. Strange set and not practical to me up but sure easy to experiment. His amp was high end JL and way better than my Alpine. Not sure where I am at now. I'll play with it in the morning. Thanks again.

 

[Side Show 10+ year member]

I see this ending badly

 

[beech2000]

The rms power for the sub is divided between the coils if I'm correct. So in theory yes you could use just 1 vc but you would need to make sure its only getting half the power. As far as comparison for the amps you cant actually compare them with just your 1 sub. You would need a dual 2 ohm wired to 4 ohm to bridged on the Kenwood while your dual 4 is wired to 2 on the Alpine.
Your best bet in my opinion is to just wire the CVR down to 2 ohm and run it on the Alpine just to be safe because the way you were running it on the kenwood will burn up the kenwood. I have 2 Dual 4 ohm CVR's wired at 2 ohm. The rms rating for CVR's is 400 but I know they can safely take a little over 500rms ea because I have been pumpin 1.1k rms into mine for about a month now. If your aiming for more bass try to get your hands on another CVR and a 3.75-4.0 cubic foot ported box and an amp that does 800-1k rms. You can get another 1 of those CVR's on ebay cheap. The only hard part is making the right box for them unless you can afford the dual 12" kicker box thats made for them. They sound real good in the kicker box though. Mine is the side ported one. Remember some of this is just my opinion and just a heads up a lot of people will probably come in here and talk trash just because we're talkin kickers lol.

What is RCA output voltage? Sound sensations down the street agreed with the Kenwood being the better sound and says that RCA out voltage could be a contributor but box size is my biggest problem. So he grabbed an on seat box and installed the CVR temporarly and still have the same problem. We tried wiring the single 12 at 4 ohms with Alpine connected and then again wired sub at 8 ohms for the Kenwood and as I said he was in agreement that the Kenwood wired with vc's in series or 8 ohms sounded better than the Alpine wired at with the vc's in parallel or 4 ohms. I was hoping to use the Alpine in my boat as more power is needed on lake than in my truck. Sound sensations says regardless my under the seat box is way to small for 12" 500 watt mono block amp no matter who makes it but agrees that no change even using a bigger box. I think he got tired of me and realized I was broke and nothing but labor sale so assistance came to an end. LOL oh well. Ugh! unexplainable.