New To Car Audio...

1)You're an idiot. 2)American bass is a cheap brand made by a bigger company (orion maybe i forget) to appeal to walmart shoppers and the like.

3)there are much better subs than JL.. not that theyre bad, its just they arent "the best" i like RE's but im too broke to get em myself.

4)For the past few years (maybe 5 or 6) Rockford's amps have been complete garbage. Since they started REALLY mass producing them they **** and dont put out poop for power. Go with something like Alpine, viper, some kenwoods are good, theres a lot of good amps that ppl use here... i just cant think of any.



Look, There was no need for insult here, you just have different opinions on what you like.

1) American Bass is not sold for ordinary "walmart" shoppers and it most definitely is not cheap. It is more expensive than most of the Kenwood, Memphis, and Kicker stuff I have looked at.

2) American Bass did set a world record in 2003 with 174.4 dbs. Most definitely not a "cheap brand."

3) I said JL is some of the best i personally have heard. Go listen to the W7's; its pretty high quality stuff. Almost anyone will agree with that. I havent heard RE's first hand but ive heard from people that they are pretty good.

4) The Fosgate amps from about 8 or 9 years ago were pretty incredible, but that doesnt mean they are crap now. 8 or 9 years ago it was common to find a Fosgate amp that put out as much as 3 times as much wattage as it was rated. Now, they have cut back and a typical Fosgate amp doesn't put out but maybe 15% more than its ratings say. Im sorry man but Rockford Fosgate is a well respected brand; they are durable and definitely not garbage. Most people will agree with that as well.

But I dont know, maybe your experiences have been different than mine. Do you have any suggestions on what you think is good?

 
Ok, so I have taken some things into consideration and here is the system I have compiled. Please give me some opinions on it:
HEAD UNIT: Alpine CDA-9847 ($180)

SPEAKERS: (4) Alpine SPR-17LP 6.5" 2-Way 250W Speakers ($210)

SUBWOOFER: (1) JL Audio 12W3v2 12" 600W Dual 4-Ohm ($200)

SPEAKER AMP: Kenwood KAC-8402 4-Channel 60W X 4 Amplifier ($167)

SUBWOOFER AMP: Kenwood KAC-9102D 850W Mono Amplifier ($188)

Now opinions on that would be appreciated. I guess my questions about that set up would be... will the Amps power their components correctly? Will the sound quality all around be crisp, clear, balanced and yet powerful? Basically will this be a good system for the money I am spending?

If everything looks ok I would like help with the next things on my list:

Wiring - What will I need to hook everything up and what kind of cables should I select to get quality sound.

Subwoofer Box - What is better for a cleaner sub sound, Closed Enclosure, Bandpass Enclosure or a Ported Enclosure?

Crossover - Even though the Amps have built in crossovers should I bother getting a separate component or should the built in's be able to handle the filtering just fine?
1) If a 4 channel amplifier costs $160, it is not a good one, especially if it's brand new. You want that onboard crossover to do it all for you once you set it. An amplifier with bandpass filters atleast on each front and rear pair is what you should be looking for and I'm more than positive that the Kenwood amp does not have that.

2) What is the reason for ditching the factory head unit? Does it not play all of the MP3's that you burn to CD or do you just want more buttons to push with the flashy stuff? Reason for asking is: you could still have an excellent sounding system and have a completely stock dash which is the ultimate theft deterrent aside from not playing your system loud anywhere near your home.

3) If you don't want your subwoofer much louder than your mids and highs, it won't take a 10" subwoofer, much less a 12" subwoofer to do that. So for your taste in subwoofer output, the question really is "How much room do you want your subwoofer to take up in your trunk? Don't forget you still have to mount the amp(s) back there, so add those to the displacement of that subwoofer enclosure. If you opt to use the factory head unit, you save quite a bit of change and can disperse that amongst the other pieces and possibly make them a tad better. Most people on forums are what you call "bass-heads", they like to listen to their music with a subwoofer banging out 140dB+ constantly. Those people need a single 12" sub. All it sounds like you need is a little 8" subwoofer in a .75 cubic foot vented box. It won't take much power to get it loud either. 300w roughly for a subwoofer amplifier.

Just suggestions and questions.

 
Wiring kits normally come in 2 channel versions. All you'd need to do is buy another identical set of RCAs for the rear channels of your 4 channel amp. If you get a sub amp with a remote gain control, you don't HAVE to get a 3rd set of RCAs just for that amp, you can use the RCA outputs from your highs amp to run the subwoofer amp signal input. Get an amp kit that has power and ground wire sufficient enough to flow the amperage required of both amps at FULL OUTPUT RATING. Most shops will sell you the correct power wiring kit for the job. You will not need two of them though, if they try to pull that one on you. Just one and a few extra little pieces.

 
1) If a 4 channel amplifier costs $160, it is not a good one, especially if it's brand new. You want that onboard crossover to do it all for you once you set it. An amplifier with bandpass filters atleast on each front and rear pair is what you should be looking for and I'm more than positive that the Kenwood amp does not have that.
2) What is the reason for ditching the factory head unit? Does it not play all of the MP3's that you burn to CD or do you just want more buttons to push with the flashy stuff? Reason for asking is: you could still have an excellent sounding system and have a completely stock dash which is the ultimate theft deterrent aside from not playing your system loud anywhere near your home.

3) If you don't want your subwoofer much louder than your mids and highs, it won't take a 10" subwoofer, much less a 12" subwoofer to do that. So for your taste in subwoofer output, the question really is "How much room do you want your subwoofer to take up in your trunk? Don't forget you still have to mount the amp(s) back there, so add those to the displacement of that subwoofer enclosure. If you opt to use the factory head unit, you save quite a bit of change and can disperse that amongst the other pieces and possibly make them a tad better. Most people on forums are what you call "bass-heads", they like to listen to their music with a subwoofer banging out 140dB+ constantly. Those people need a single 12" sub. All it sounds like you need is a little 8" subwoofer in a .75 cubic foot vented box. It won't take much power to get it loud either. 300w roughly for a subwoofer amplifier.

Just suggestions and questions.
I *thought* that I might need a new Head Unit to be able to control all of the controls for the sound. Like I said, I'm very new at this... so if it really doesn't matter if I get a new Head Unit or not then I'll opt with not.

Since you say I only need an 8" Subwoofer, do you have any suggestions for a GOOD QUALITY 8"er?

Since we are on the topic of the Subwoofer... is a 12" or 10" really going to take away from the crisp balanced sound between highs, mids, and lows that I am looking for?

I think I'm going to go with the 5-Channel Memphis Belle 16-MCH600 b/c I think it'll be able to power everything nicely, or am I wrong?

 
Since we are on the topic of the Subwoofer... is a 12" or 10" really going to take away from the crisp balanced sound between highs, mids, and lows that I am looking for?

i say no. just make sure to use a sealed enclosure. I think a 10" sub would be right up your alley.

 
Shamefully I am that annoying newbie who is probably the 1,000th person to post a topic like this...
I have tried to do some research on my own but compiling a good car audio system seems like a complicated process, one that I don't think I'd like to rest in my hands on figuring it out on my own. I'd like some help from you guys, whom which I would assume are educated on this subject,

I have a 2005 Nissan Altima 2.5S. I have a standard cd player and standard audio set up. Since I LOVE listening to music and I want to treat myself, and my car, to having a decently nice system. I mainly listen to dance music.. all sorts. Trance, D&B, House, Progressive etc. Most dance music has a good combination of all frequencies, all of which I like to hear. I am looking for an audio set up that will be powerful yet balanced. I don't want the bass drowning out my mids and highs but I don't not want to feel the power of the bass. I would like to feel the bass, hear all the lows and get to hear the highs, mids and vocals nice and crisply without distortion.

My budget is anywhere from $1,300 - $1,500 and I'd ideally like to have that being included with installation. I have no idea what to look for or what to even consider. I'm totally lost in all of this. If anyone would be kind enough to help me out in making some choices I would be very greatly appreciated.
Hey man, thought I'd weigh in here. You've gotten quite a spread of advice but here is what I've found building my last three systems (look at my sig for the current two, my g/f's was only $500 and has amazing SQ)

First off don't buy locally, unless you want them to do the install, because markup is 100% (double their cost). Second, do your own install, it's very satisfying and saves a ton of money. Third, the consumer level stuff in *MOST* audio stores is overpriced and not worth your money in speakers and subs. While they can be quite decent you can do better with some research. Now for suggestions:

HU: Alpine, Pioneer, Kenwood, Eclipse. This would be a good thing to buy used. Get one that is a year old and TOP of the line. This way you get all the features at a decent price. I've owned several kenwoods and love them all. Also they've never failed me.

Speakers: Get components. It makes installation more of a pain but it's worth it especially if your speaker mounts are low and you leg would cover the path from the speaker to your ear. With the seperates you can move the tweeter somewhere where it isn't blocked by your body and it will sound much better. You don't have to worry about the mid-bass. Also ditch the rear speakers, it costs more and takes more time to install for minimal return to you. If you have passengers in the back say f***'em, they didn't pay for the stereo! Some suggestions on companies:

Focal (expensive but very nice, also easy to find), DLS, Rainbow, JL (high end lines), RE, Adire

Amps: There are LOTS of choices but it's hard to sort out the good from bad, especially when so many companies make a big splash then are bought up and start making crap. Here is a list of current top of the line amps (yah I'll forget a few):

Zapco, Diamond Audio, JL, Memphis, Tru, uhh there are more. You can also find oldies that rock. Old stuff like Audio Art, Zapco, Orion, US AMPS etc is good stuff even if it's used.

You'll spend alot of time picking the right amps. You can get two or a 4 Channel to run the fronts and a sub. Make sure you look at how much power they make (RMS) at different ohm levels, this will be important when picking a sub. My best advice here is get Zapco i-force amps. They are silly cheap on ebay when they come up and will blow away amps that are much more expensive. Case in point: my g/f runs a smaller set of the same comps I own off a Zapco i-force, I run mine on a Diamond audio. Her's sound much richer and deeper even though they are smaller. Part of the advantage is the BMW quailty and sound deadning but that little Zapco rocks and it was 1/2 the price new than my diamond was used. Also remember you don't need 100,000,000W to get loud. My shiva is running on 200W and it's plenty loud.

Subs: There are TONS of options. For you I'd get a single 12" and put it in a sealed box. I tend to move towards the online specialty companies like Adire, elemental designs, soundsplinter, Ascendant audio etc etc etc. I personally run a single 12" Adire audio Shiva. It's only $125 new and it's in 1cu/ft sealed. It makes my ears hurt fast and drops much lower than my 10" JL 10W4 ever did. A basic rule here is the bigger the cone area the lower it goes. Of course this isn't always true but it's just a guide.

Now remember to budget for install accessories too: you'll need a wiring kit. I like the JL kits I found on ebay for $40 or so. They included all the small stuff and every little part was quality. You'll need 8ga or 4ga depending on the power of your amps. Finally if you have any money left get some sound deadning from http://www.secondskinaudio.com It's expensive but do you doors, and trunk to start then your whole floorpan. You'll get better sound (because of less road noise) plus the added weight to your doors will give them that quailty mercedes feel when they close. Ohh and you'll need plenty of MDF. Say a 4x8 sheet of 3/4" to make the sub box and mounts for the amps etc. When you are ready for the install reading up here and asking lots of questions will get you through the install, it's easier and harder than you might think. Schedule at least a weekend of you car being torn apart and undriveable on your first install; or do it in stages.

Anyways that's my $2 worth of typing...

 
I *thought* that I might need a new Head Unit to be able to control all of the controls for the sound. Like I said, I'm very new at this... so if it really doesn't matter if I get a new Head Unit or not then I'll opt with not.
Since you say I only need an 8" Subwoofer, do you have any suggestions for a GOOD QUALITY 8"er?

Since we are on the topic of the Subwoofer... is a 12" or 10" really going to take away from the crisp balanced sound between highs, mids, and lows that I am looking for?

I think I'm going to go with the 5-Channel Memphis Belle 16-MCH600 b/c I think it'll be able to power everything nicely, or am I wrong?
Memphis makes great amps. Also for simplicity get a single 12". That way if you ever want to rattle your brain you can. The bigger subs generally hit lower freqs... at least they sound like they do //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif.. However if you are looking for a "Stealth" install or a space saving install 8"s are fine. I plan on using 8"s in my 4Runner.

 
Hmmm Thank you guys so much. I pretty much have all of the information I need to make my purchases. The only thing that kinda intimidates me is the installation. I have NO IDEA how to even approach that. Obviously I would like to get someone else to do it for me professionally, BUT that is probably going to cost me a good amount of money. I'm just not sure if I can actually handle the installation process. I'm afraid of damaging my car or hooking things up wrong... What should I do?

 
Hmmm Thank you guys so much. I pretty much have all of the information I need to make my purchases. The only thing that kinda intimidates me is the installation. I have NO IDEA how to even approach that. Obviously I would like to get someone else to do it for me professionally, BUT that is probably going to cost me a good amount of money. I'm just not sure if I can actually handle the installation process. I'm afraid of damaging my car or hooking things up wrong... What should I do?
Read the manuals, ask questions, ask around for some good online tutorials

 
That's a good start but here is what I would recommend. Also if you do ebay I included links to ebay auctions to find stuff at better prices....

Pioneer DEH-P6800MP ($203 Shipped)

http://cgi.ebay.com/PIONEER-DEH-P6800MP-CD-MP3-CAR-RADIO-PLAYER-DEHP6800MP_W0QQitemZ5863951743QQcategoryZ39752QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

AMPLIFIER: Memphis Belle 16-MCH600 ($390)

Buy it where you found it.

SUBWOOFER: JL Audio 12W3v2-2 12" 600W Dual 2-Ohm ($200)

This is a great sub. You could also go with:

RE SX

Adire Audio Shiva

Elemental Designs 13Ov.2

It's hard to say which is best but JL is a well known company that makes great products.

Speakers: Get better! The alpines are ok but trust me they can't touch the likes of Focal, DLS, Rainbow etc.

The access line of Focals are very nice:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Focal-Access-165-A1-6-5-2Way-Component-Speaker-NEW_W0QQitemZ5861233213QQcategoryZ18800QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

or these (which are better):

http://cgi.ebay.com/FOCAL-PolyKevlar-136K-Car-Speakers-New-In-Box_W0QQitemZ5862834796QQcategoryZ32818QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I would avoid getting a prefab enclosure. Try making one yourself or maybe someone on the board can make you one for about the same price but higher quality.

Now assuming you get the nice Focal PolyKevlars and your prices include shipping or are local we are up to $1163. Now you need installation hardware.

Wiring:

http://cgi.ebay.com/JL-AUDIO-XA-PCS8-1-8-GUAGE-AMPLIFIER-INSTALL-AMP-KIT_W0QQitemZ5861543665QQcategoryZ50549QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

RCA's

http://cgi.ebay.com/STINGER-HYPER-SERIES-4-CHANNEL-CAR-AUDIO-RCA-17-SHR417_W0QQitemZ5863959166QQcategoryZ32809QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Sound Deadning if you can scrounge a little more up:

http://www.secondskinaudio.com/cgi-bin/index.cgi?pg=1&p=pr

Get 36sq ft of Damplifier Pro.. Do behind and around the front speakers, the back of you trunk liscense plate and the back of anything that rattles... then save up about $500 to do the sound deadning job right //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

Hope this helps.. I may repost this in the thread for others to offer their opion on... ::EDIT:: or if the PM can't handle such a big post //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif ::EDIT::

 
Speakers: Get better! The alpines are ok but trust me they can't touch the likes of Focal, DLS, Rainbow etc.

The access line of Focals are very nice:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Focal-Access-165-A1-6-5-2Way-Component-Speaker-NEW_W0QQitemZ5861233213QQcategoryZ18800QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

or these (which are better):

http://cgi.ebay.com/FOCAL-PolyKevlar-136K-Car-Speakers-New-In-Box_W0QQitemZ5862834796QQcategoryZ32818QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
What online stores sell a variety of Focal, DLS and Rainbow Speakers. I am having trouble finding online stores and I'd like to avoid Ebay for now...

 
What online stores sell a variety of Focal, DLS and Rainbow Speakers. I am having trouble finding online stores and I'd like to avoid Ebay for now...
They are hard to find... I did find this site:

http://www.woofersetc.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_ID=40&mfg_account_ID=33&sort=account_name&=Update+Selection

Can't say if they are any good...?!?

Part of the problem is that companies like Focal, DLS and rainbow DON'T WANT you to buy them from "unauthorized" sources. ie places that sell thier products for MSRP. You'll also not get a warranty but hey.. it's like paying $150 for a warranty on something you're paying $230 for. Personally I never bother with warranties anyways so it doesn't bother me.

 
As I read through this thread one post really stood out from all the others to me:

1)You're an idiot.
Well! This was really, really helpful to someone just trying to learn about aftermarket car audio...thanks for that!

2)American bass is a cheap brand made by a bigger company (orion maybe i forget) to appeal to walmart shoppers and the like.
When they start selling American Bass gear at Wal-Mart please do let me know. I'm no expert on their gear so haven't a clue who makes them but I do know they aren't cheap crap built to appeal to the masses akin to Legacy, Pyle, etc....

3)there are much better subs than JL.. not that they're bad, its just they arent "the best" i like RE's but im too broke to get em myself.
The same statement could potentially be made about any sub on the market including your obvious preference Resonant Engineering. Depending on the particular application, the desired results, the available power, the specific enclosure, blah blah blah there might potentially always be a better option than what you've gone with. If the man wants JL then let him use JL. Are there subs that are just as good or better for the same or less money? Possibly. Are there many, many options available that would be much, much worse? Absolutely there are.

4)For the past few years (maybe 5 or 6) Rockford's amps have been complete garbage. Since they started REALLYmass producing them they **** and dont put out poop for power. Go with something like Alpine, viper, some kenwoods are good, theres a lot of good amps that ppl use here... i just cant think of any.
Rockford Fosgate, like anyone else, is in the business to make money. Corporate bottom lines are what stockholders care about. So to bolster overall sales figures at the end of the year Fosgate (like any other smart company) makes mainstream, average gear that appeals to people more out of name recognition rather than actual performance. But to counter your generalization that Fosgates amps **** in general and don't put out poop for power I have to ask - seen any of the Power-series amps recently? Every birthsheet I have ever seen on a late-model Power-series Fosgate amp shows the amp to do considerably more than rated power. No one that I have known who owned one ever had a single operational issue with it. And as far as "don't put out poop for power" is concerned...... 3kW @ 1 Ohm, anyone?
I *thought* that I might need a new Head Unit to be able to control all of the controls for the sound. Like I said, I'm very new at this... so if it really doesn't matter if I get a new Head Unit or not then I'll opt with not.
Does the OEM Nissan head unit in the car now afford you with all the features you'd like? If it is suitable for what you're wanting it to do then by all means keep it and save the money! If you're looking for things like: multiple band equalizers, built-in crossover networks, dedicated subwoofer outputs/controls, customizable displays, etc etc etc then likely an aftermarket HU would be your best bet.

Since you say I only need an 8" Subwoofer, do you have any suggestions for a GOOD QUALITY 8"er?
Get what you want and compliments the rest of the system well. You can go buy X, Y, or Zed-brand sub that is capable of doing *orgasmic* levels of output...that doesn't necessarily mean you have to set it up to provide said level of output constantly. You'll see/read a recurring mantra if you stay around awhile: "install dependant" And so, so many things are. Get whatever kind of sub you want in whatever size you prefer and then implement it into the overall setup to where it blends well without taking over.
Since we are on the topic of the Subwoofer... is a 12" or 10" really going to take away from the crisp balanced sound between highs, mids, and lows that I am looking for?
See above //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif It's all in how the sub gets setup whether or not its presence will be known without being annoying or whether or not all you get is bass while the front stage struggles to keep up. There is no rule which states your gear has to be run at full tilt everytime you turn it on. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif
I think I'm going to go with the 5-Channel Memphis Belle 16-MCH600 b/c I think it'll be able to power everything nicely, or am I wrong?
Solid choice on an amp. If you end up with a Dual 2 Ohm subwoofer (which can be parallel wired to a 1 Ohm load) you can feed it 400 watts out of the MCH600's sub output //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 
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