kinetik *****

[outsideshot23 10+ year member]

i googled what you said in case I have been wrong all my life as an ASE tech and didn't find anything that supports your statement..
i found the opposite..

modern automobile has a 12 volt electrical system. A fully charged battery will read about 12.5 volts when the engine is not running. When the engine is running, the charging system takes over so that the voltmeter will read 14 to 14.5 volts and should stay there unless there is a heavy load on the electrical system such as wipers, lights, heater and rear defogger all operating together while the engine is idling at which time the voltage may drop. If the voltage drops below 12.5, it means that the battery is providing some of the current. You may notice that your dash lights dim at this point. If this happens for an extended period, the battery will run down and may not have enough of a charge to start the car after shutting it off. This should never happen with a healthy charging system because as soon as you step on the gas, the charging system will recharge the battery. If the voltage is constantly below 14 volts, you should have the system checked. If the voltage ever goes above 15 volts, there is a problem with the voltage regulator. Have the system checked as soon as possible as this "overcharging" condition can cause damage to your electrical system.

If you think of electricity as water, voltage is like water pressure, whereas amperage is like the volume of water. If you increase pressure, then more water will flow through a given size pipe, but if you increase the size of the pipe, more water will flow at a lower pressure. An ammeter will read from a negative amperage when the battery is providing most of the current thereby depleting itself, to a positive amperage if most of the current is coming from the charging system. If the battery is fully charged and there is minimal electrical demand, then the ammeter should read close to zero, but should always be on the positive side of zero. It is normal for the ammeter to read a high positive amperage in order to recharge the battery after starting, but it should taper off in a few minutes. If it continues to read more than 10 or 20 amps even though the lights, wipers and other electrical devices are turned off, you may have a weak battery and should have it checked.

What can go wrong?

There are a number of things that can go wrong with a charging system:

Insufficient Charging Output

If one of the three stator windings failed, the alternator would still charge, but only at two thirds of its normal output. Since an alternator is designed to handle all the power that is needed under heavy load conditions, you may never know that there is a problem with the unit. It might only become apparent on a dark, cold rainy night when the lights, heater, windshield wipers and possible the seat heaters and rear defroster are all on at once that you may notice the lights start to dim as you slow down. If two sets of windings failed, you will probably notice it a lot sooner

It is more common for one or more of the six diodes in the rectifier to fail. If a diode burns out and opens one of the circuits, you would see the same problem as if one of the windings had failed. The alternator will run at a reduced output. However, if one of the diodes were to short out and allow current to pass in either direction, other problems will occur. A shorted diode will allow AC current to pass through to the automobile's electrical system which can cause problems with the computerized sensors and processors. This condition can cause the car to act unpredictably and cause all kinds of problems.

Too much voltage

A voltage regulator is designed to limit the voltage output of an alternator to 14.5 volts or less to protect the vehicle's electrical system. If the regulator malfunctions and allows uncontrolled voltage to be released, you will see bulbs and other electrical components begin to fail. This is a dangerous and potentially costly problem. Fortunately, this type of failure is very rare. Most failures cause a reduction of voltage or amperage.

thats just 1... out of 30 or so pages they all say the same thing... an alternators regulator doesn't control low voltage only high voltage...

can you show me where it says it differently please?

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/fyi.gif.9f1f679348da7204ce960cfc74bca8e0.gif

 

[SicAudio 5,000+ posts]

How is that right? Lol it will never make sense no matter how many times you say it. The only way people like you get away with it is duty cycle. If you played songs with heavy bass throughout with a little clip, your batts would never last because they aren't charging enough. Supply is ALWAYS the answer if it's an option. When it's not an option, you get reserve and reduce your duty cycle. For SUSTAINED play, supply is where it's at. The answer is ALWAYS supply. You simply can't argue that.

so how much "supply" does 460ah of battery have? cuz 135 amps of alternator will sustain that easily in my experiance..with over 300 amps of draw lol

 

[ahole-ic]

i googled what you said in case I have been wrong all my life as an ASE tech and didn't find anything that supports your statement..
i found the opposite..

modern automobile has a 12 volt electrical system. A fully charged battery will read about 12.5 volts when the engine is not running. When the engine is running, the charging system takes over so that the voltmeter will read 14 to 14.5 volts and should stay there unless there is a heavy load on the electrical system such as wipers, lights, heater and rear defogger all operating together while the engine is idling at which time the voltage may drop. If the voltage drops below 12.5, it means that the battery is providing some of the current. You may notice that your dash lights dim at this point. If this happens for an extended period, the battery will run down and may not have enough of a charge to start the car after shutting it off. This should never happen with a healthy charging system because as soon as you step on the gas, the charging system will recharge the battery. If the voltage is constantly below 14 volts, you should have the system checked. If the voltage ever goes above 15 volts, there is a problem with the voltage regulator. Have the system checked as soon as possible as this "overcharging" condition can cause damage to your electrical system.

If you think of electricity as water, voltage is like water pressure, whereas amperage is like the volume of water. If you increase pressure, then more water will flow through a given size pipe, but if you increase the size of the pipe, more water will flow at a lower pressure. An ammeter will read from a negative amperage when the battery is providing most of the current thereby depleting itself, to a positive amperage if most of the current is coming from the charging system. If the battery is fully charged and there is minimal electrical demand, then the ammeter should read close to zero, but should always be on the positive side of zero. It is normal for the ammeter to read a high positive amperage in order to recharge the battery after starting, but it should taper off in a few minutes. If it continues to read more than 10 or 20 amps even though the lights, wipers and other electrical devices are turned off, you may have a weak battery and should have it checked.

What can go wrong?

There are a number of things that can go wrong with a charging system:

Insufficient Charging Output

If one of the three stator windings failed, the alternator would still charge, but only at two thirds of its normal output. Since an alternator is designed to handle all the power that is needed under heavy load conditions, you may never know that there is a problem with the unit. It might only become apparent on a dark, cold rainy night when the lights, heater, windshield wipers and possible the seat heaters and rear defroster are all on at once that you may notice the lights start to dim as you slow down. If two sets of windings failed, you will probably notice it a lot sooner

It is more common for one or more of the six diodes in the rectifier to fail. If a diode burns out and opens one of the circuits, you would see the same problem as if one of the windings had failed. The alternator will run at a reduced output. However, if one of the diodes were to short out and allow current to pass in either direction, other problems will occur. A shorted diode will allow AC current to pass through to the automobile's electrical system which can cause problems with the computerized sensors and processors. This condition can cause the car to act unpredictably and cause all kinds of problems.

Too much voltage

A voltage regulator is designed to limit the voltage output of an alternator to 14.5 volts or less to protect the vehicle's electrical system. If the regulator malfunctions and allows uncontrolled voltage to be released, you will see bulbs and other electrical components begin to fail. This is a dangerous and potentially costly problem. Fortunately, this type of failure is very rare. Most failures cause a reduction of voltage or amperage.

thats just 1... out of 30 or so pages they all say the same thing... an alternators regulator doesn't control low voltage only high voltage...

can you show me where it says it differently please?

Lol sure, but how about we use logic. Why does the alternator voltage drop when you exceed the amount of current the alternator can provide? By what black magic does this happen?

 

[SicAudio 5,000+ posts]

Bueller? Bueller?

 

[outsideshot23 10+ year member]

Lol sure, but how about we use logic. Why does the alternator voltage drop when you exceed the amount of current the alternator can provide? By what black magic does this happen?

i would take my chance with what is already in print and proven then your so called "logic"

 

[ahole-ic]

i would take my chance with what is already in print and proven then your so called "logic"

Lol you're just a troll. Answer the question then.

 

[ahole-ic]

Bueller? Bueller?

answer the question.

 

[SicAudio 5,000+ posts]

Lol sure, but how about we use logic. Why does the alternator voltage drop when you exceed the amount of current the alternator can provide? By what black magic does this happen?

it isn't magic it is because you are overloading the alt and it's ability..

 

[ahole-ic]

LOL ok I'll just post some proof.

"Electronic voltage regulators operate by comparing the actual output voltage to some internal fixed reference voltage. Any difference is amplified and used to control the regulation element in such a way as to reduce the voltage error. This forms a negative feedback control loop; increasing the open-loop gain tends to increase regulation accuracy but reduce stability (avoidance of oscillation, or ringing during step changes). There will also be a trade-off between stability and the speed of the response to changes. If the output voltage is too low (perhaps due to input voltage reducing or load current increasing), the regulation element is commanded, up to a point, to produce a higher output voltage–by dropping less of the input voltage (for linear series regulators and buck switching regulators), or to draw input current for longer periods (boost-type switching regulators); if the output voltage is too high, the regulation element will normally be commanded to produce a lower voltage. However, many regulators have over-current protection, so that they will entirely stop sourcing current (or limit the current in some way) if the output current is too high, and some regulators may also shut down if the input voltage is outside a given range (see also: crowbar circuits)."

Voltage regulator - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[SicAudio 5,000+ posts]

sorry was on the phone

even my friend on the phone who is in the field specifically related to automotive electrical said ur on crack about the voltage regulation in relation to a vehicle

he said you are most likely referring to a very large commercial type generator which is very dif than a car...

 

[ahole-ic]

it isn't magic it is because you are overloading the alt and it's ability..

But if it's overloaded, it would just blow up if it couldn't keep up and wasn't regulated. lol are you really this stupid?

 

[ahole-ic]

sorry was on the phone
even my friend on the phone who is in the field specifically related to automotive electrical said ur on crack about the voltage regulation in relation to a vehicle

he said you are most likely referring to a very large commercial type generator which is very dif than a car...

Refer to the previous post. You've already been proved wrong. So has your dumbass friend.

 

[SicAudio 5,000+ posts]

LOL ok I'll just post some proof.
"Electronic voltage regulators operate by comparing the actual output voltage to some internal fixed reference voltage. Any difference is amplified and used to control the regulation element in such a way as to reduce the voltage error. This forms a negative feedback control loop; increasing the open-loop gain tends to increase regulation accuracy but reduce stability (avoidance of oscillation, or ringing during step changes). There will also be a trade-off between stability and the speed of the response to changes. If the output voltage is too low (perhaps due to input voltage reducing or load current increasing), the regulation element is commanded, up to a point, to produce a higher output voltage–by dropping less of the input voltage (for linear series regulators and buck switching regulators), or to draw input current for longer periods (boost-type switching regulators); if the output voltage is too high, the regulation element will normally be commanded to produce a lower voltage. However, many regulators have over-current protection, so that they will entirely stop sourcing current (or limit the current in some way) if the output current is too high, and some regulators may also shut down if the input voltage is outside a given range (see also: crowbar circuits)."

Voltage regulator - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

like me , several others and even my friend on the phone said... you are confusing your field with automotive fact...

they do not work that way in an alternator on a car...

 

[SicAudio 5,000+ posts]

oh btw alternator voltage doesn't drop like you think it does... the only way the voltage in an alt drops in my experience is when the alternator is failing or the regulator is failing...

 

[ahole-ic]

like me , several others and even my friend on the phone said... you are confusing your field with automotive fact...
they do not work that way in an alternator on a car...

Yes they do and you've been proved wrong. You're grasping at straws. Ask them how the diodes don't burn up or how the voltage magically drops once the alt reaches a certain amount of output current if it's not regulated. They can't answer it because they are wrong... as you are. I live and breathe electronics and know what I"m talking about which should be pretty clear to you by this point. You're letting your pride make you look like a fool.