2008 Highlander Bad Install?

[greynolds 10+ year member]

I took my Highlander to one of the few local shops earlier this week. The goal was to replace the factory head unit and speakers, and then add a 5 channel amp and pair of subwoofers into the rear compartment where the 3rd row seats OR cargo storage area (depending on what options are in the Highlander) are located. I ended up going with a Kenwood DNX812 plus nav, Sirius, and iPod interface, Boston Acoustics speakers, and a Boston Acoustics 5 channel amp.

I left how to handle the install of the amp and subwoofers up to them as this is presumably what they do, but made it clear (I thought) that whatever they did needed to have a floor above it that was level with the rest of the existing flooring and would need to be capable of having items placed on top - whatever I was able to carry before whether it be groceries, luggage for a trip, a TV, and any other cargo I might typically carry.

When I picked it up, everything looks fine at first glance and the system sounded fine, though they didn't cycle through every source with me to make sure everything worked. I later discovered the following problems:

1) It looks like they forgot to connect AM/FM antenna as strong local stations (like WBZ 1030 AM and WBCN 104.1 FM from Boston are barely coming in and came in fine on the factory radio).

2) Around the edge of the radio mounting kit, there are a number of tool marks - it almost looks like they used screwdrivers to pry things out. They aren't major, but definitely noticeable.

3) The cover they put over the amp and subwoofers in the back is totally unacceptable. It looks nice, but... They made a removable panel over the subwoofers that has no support in the middle, so very lightweight objects cause it to bend down. The rest of the flooring has no support toward the front of the vehicle and is only made of 1/4" partical board. So there's no way I can even carry groceries home, nevermind carrying more substantial items. I didn't discover this problem until I gave the inside a good vacuuming job today (no, they didn't clean up their mess when they were done). Part of the reason I didn't discover this problem right away is that they had left a decorative trim panel supporting the front of the cover (but not actually secured), so it had enough support for my initial inspection. While I was vacuuming, I noticed that the decorative trim panel was loose and then noticed the other problems.

I called them yesterday about the radio antenna and they said to stop by pretty much any time next week and they'll take care of it. I'm not too bent about the antenna as they did have to take the head unit in and out a few times because the wrong iPod interface arrived, etc.

I'm very upset about item 3 though as this currently leaves me with a SUV with the U completely removed. I'll certainly give them a chance to resolve this and won't name the shop until they either fix it or refuse to do so, so please don't ask me to name the shop yet. I can post some pictures at some point, which should be able to illustrate the problem if needed. I'll obviously take this up with them when I go back to get the antenna fixed.

Am I correct in assuming that I'm not being unreasonable here? They had quoted me around $3800 for the entire job including the equipment, cabling, labor, etc. Given the equipment chosen, a pretty good percentage of that total is for the labor, so I expected a quality job.

It's tough choosing a shop though - there are only a few choices reasonably close to me (other than going to Circuit City, Best Buy, or Tweeter) and since this really isn't my area of expertise, it's tough to evaluate the shop options. I had asked on here a while back for local recommendations and got absolutely no replies, so I picked the shop the carried the closest match to the equipment I wanted. It looks like I probably should have gone with Sound In Motion, but their location is a PITA for me to get to.

This has turned into a pretty stressful week. The day I dropped the Highlander off at the shop, my mom called to let us know my dad went into the hospital via the emergency room. He came home yesterday afternoon, but had to go back via ambulance tonight. It doesn't appear to be a life threatening problem, but is very upsetting regardless. I really didn't need a botched audio install on top of that.

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[TurdFergueson2 5,000+ posts]

You may have got no responses because no one is really in that area.

You'll hear a million times how 3800 is a lot for the parts plus instal, and you'll get critics saying they couldve did it cheaper, but that's neither here nor there. If you were fine with paying it, that's all that matters. I have the biggest problem with you leaving the shop unhappy. But then again, even that is understandable. I got my alarm put in, but I looked it over after my doors stopped locking and saw the shoddy job they did. They more than likely installed your stuff and demoed it while you were there and you left. But as you looked it over after the feeling wore off, you noticed all of the imperfections.

My best advice is to not touch or change anything, take a bunch of pictures and bring it back to them. I would hope a damm near 4000 dollar job would come with some sort of warranty.

 

[Saint211 10+ year member]

This is very unfortunate. As an installer... I would love to see more jobs like this.. especially where a customer has money to work with(not trying to sound greedy).. has a plan but trusts your expertise enough to make it happen. The more shops like this discourage people... The worse it is for every installer.

I could say things about the price and so on and so forth but it will do no good. I am sure you could have got a better job done with less moolah, but that isn't the point here.

When I get a customer who wants to do stuff like this... I treat every car like it is my own. I actually get excited about doing cool stuff in peoples vehicles.

And the shelf over the install should have been built out of higher quality materials... particle board? No bracing?

Like said above... take pictures... document it... and take it back to the shop. Eventually theyll realize that it would not be a good thing for them to let you leave unhappy again. Hopefully rhey realize their error, re-do the shelf and fix the antenna and that will be the end of it....

 

[andrewmoore13 10+ year member]

Thats shitty. What shop? I'll make sure I never give them any business.

I'm from Ipswich BTW.

 

[greynolds 10+ year member]

You may have got no responses because no one is really in that area.
You'll hear a million times how 3800 is a lot for the parts plus instal, and you'll get critics saying they couldve did it cheaper, but that's neither here nor there. If you were fine with paying it, that's all that matters.

Since I don't know how to do some aspects of the install, I don't have much choice other than to pay what it takes.

I have the biggest problem with you leaving the shop unhappy. But then again, even that is understandable. I got my alarm put in, but I looked it over after my doors stopped locking and saw the shoddy job they did. They more than likely installed your stuff and demoed it while you were there and you left. But as you looked it over after the feeling wore off, you noticed all of the imperfections.

I left the shop pretty happy as I hadn't noticed the problems yet. Also keep in mind that my mind was largely focused on worrying about my dad. They demoed some of the system with me there. The Sirius wasn't activated yet, but they showed me that the weather channel worked and showed me how to get the Sirius ID I would need to activate. They didn't demo the iPod interface (and I didn't realize that my older iPod Photo can't be controlled by it so I'll need to get a new iPod - mine needs a new battery and I've run out of space on it anyway). They did demo the CD player working. They did demo the radio briefly on a local station that happened to be coming in - I noticed on the drive home that the scan feature was skipping over known STRONG local stations. They helped me get my Blackberry synced with the head unit. So they gave a reasonable walk through, but not a complete demo of everything either and I do feel they should have caught the antenna problem but can forgive them for it. Like I said, I'm not too upset about the antenna connection, that should be simple enough to fix.

I probably should have given the rear compartment a more complete going over before I left, but like I said my mind was on my dad and everything LOOKED ok there. The damage to the dashboard wasn't immediately apparent - good light is needed to really see it - and I'm not going to make a huge fuss over it but will definitely mention it to them.

My best advice is to not touch or change anything, take a bunch of pictures and bring it back to them. I would hope a damm near 4000 dollar job would come with some sort of warranty.

That's my intent and it does have a warranty. I'll certainly give them a chance to make it right and won't name them here unless it seems appropriate to do so - I just needed to vent.

 

[greynolds 10+ year member]

This is very unfortunate. As an installer... I would love to see more jobs like this.. especially where a customer has money to work with(not trying to sound greedy).. has a plan but trusts your expertise enough to make it happen. The more shops like this discourage people... The worse it is for every installer.

I would expect that for a shop that's been in business for 10+ years, the install they did for me wouldn't be all that complex. The head unit and speaker installation should be easy for them. Constructing the box in the back shouldn't really be new ground either when they advertise that they do custom work. I definitely hear where you're coming from - I would also think that allowing the installer to use their imagination on exactly how to do the project would be something any good installer would love.

I could say things about the price and so on and so forth but it will do no good. I am sure you could have got a better job done with less moolah, but that isn't the point here.

I hear you on the price and did feel that it was expensive, but I was willing to pay it for a quality job. I just wish I had gotten a quality job. Like I said earlier, it's tough when one doesn't have the skills to do the entire job themselves AND there are limited options in the area. I'm not too far outside of Boston, but there really aren't many places that do this kind of work around here (or they don't advertise) and I don't have any friends who are into this sort of thing.

I'm pretty sure I could have handled installation of the head unit and speakers and any of the actual wire connections. I've got a pretty complex home theater system, so I know how to interconnect things (I do realize that car audio has some special considerations that you don't encounter in a home system). Where I get stuck is on routing the wires neatly (battery through firewall, the Sirius antenna, the GPS antenna, under carpets, etc.) and constructing the box in the back for the subwoofers and amp.

When I get a customer who wants to do stuff like this... I treat every car like it is my own. I actually get excited about doing cool stuff in peoples vehicles.

I would expect no less from any installer.

And the shelf over the install should have been built out of higher quality materials... particle board? No bracing?

Yeah, this is the biggest problem with the install by far. I think the material was actually masonite, but either way it's flimsy material that requires significant bracing underneath for it to support any weight.

Like said above... take pictures... document it... and take it back to the shop. Eventually theyll realize that it would not be a good thing for them to let you leave unhappy again. Hopefully rhey realize their error, re-do the shelf and fix the antenna and that will be the end of it....

If they don't make it right, my credit card company will be getting a call to withhold at least part of the payment and/or I'll explore returning the entire system even if I end up having to pay a partial restocking fee and then take my business elsewhere.

Thats shitty. What shop? I'll make sure I never give them any business.
I'm from Ipswich BTW.

Like I said earlier, I'd like to give them a chance to make it right before I name them.

 

[bigbangtheory 5,000+ posts]

First thing is first, sorry to hear about your father and hope everything comes out A OK with that.

About the money thing, yes that is a lot of money, but some people don't have the time and know how or they just don't know how to do it and is there only way to get something done. So for people like that and I guess yourself, then we need to be able to trust the local car shops. Unfortuanate we can not a lot of times. I am sorry you are not a happy customer, but you have every right to be upset with spending that much money and not being satisfied. I would go in there and be nice, calm and relaxed and just say I have spent a lot of money on this and feel this is not how I explained my original theory to you guys. It is nice, but not up to par for the money I paid for. Then point out all that was wrong.

Hopefully they will correct it and you will be a happy customer, that might bring them more business in the future. Some shop owners look foward to that, others can car less. I used to work the front desk at a local shop and I had a boss who cared a lot and bend over back wards for you and it was sad how many people took advantage of that, but you do what you have to do. Point being, do what you have to do to fix your shit! Hopefully the shop owned is cool like my old boss was, to be fair though he is also my friend.

Good luck on your quest in getting it fixed to your standards as it should be and good luck to your dad as well. I am sure everything will work out fine.

 

[greynolds 10+ year member]

First thing is first, sorry to hear about your father and hope everything comes out A OK with that.

Thanks - it doesn't appear to be anything that can't be resolved with proper medical care. Left alone it would have been another matter. Very stressful though especially with how older people get. He had come home on Saturday as they thought he was all set, but had instructions to call 911 if anything didn't seem right. So my parents called me last night to let me know they were going to call 911 because he wasn't feeling well again - yes BEFORE they called 911. I fairly calmly told my mom to call 911 and then call back. Ugh.

About the money thing, yes that is a lot of money, but some people don't have the time and know how or they just don't know how to do it and is there only way to get something done. So for people like that and I guess yourself, then we need to be able to trust the local car shops.

I'm probably somewhere in the middle of the spectrum here. Like I said, I definitely know how to hook everything up and could handle some aspects of the actual physical install, but if I did the whole thing myself, I suspect some aspects of the install (especially the wire routing) wouldn't come out looking very good. Though after seeing what they did in the back I do wonder if I could have done better myself //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif. Time also is a factor as it would take me a LOT of time to do it myself.

Unfortuanate we can not a lot of times. I am sorry you are not a happy customer, but you have every right to be upset with spending that much money and not being satisfied. I would go in there and be nice, calm and relaxed and just say I have spent a lot of money on this and feel this is not how I explained my original theory to you guys. It is nice, but not up to par for the money I paid for. Then point out all that was wrong.

My approach will most definitely be to start out being nice and go from there. The only part of the install that I simply can't live with is the floor in the back - that has to be resolved by them by either redoing it, adding lots of support or giving me a refund on the labor for it. The antenna connection is an obvious thing, so I'm really not worried about that and they've already said to stop by and they'll fix that.

Hopefully they will correct it and you will be a happy customer, that might bring them more business in the future. Some shop owners look foward to that, others can car less. I used to work the front desk at a local shop and I had a boss who cared a lot and bend over back wards for you and it was sad how many people took advantage of that, but you do what you have to do. Point being, do what you have to do to fix your shit! Hopefully the shop owned is cool like my old boss was, to be fair though he is also my friend.

I've always said that shit happens - it's what you do to fix the problem that REALLY matters in the end. They seemed like nice guys and did say to come back if there were any problems, so I'm not losing sleep over it yet.

 

[greynolds 10+ year member]

I stopped by the shop on the way home from work this evening. I'm a bit surprised at what portions of the discussion went well and which didn't.

Much to my surprise, there wasn't any attempt to justify the shoddy build on the floor that was built above the subwoofers and amp. They looked it over with me and readily agreed that it wasn't up to snuff (the owner wasn't around - not sure if that matters). I can't leave it with them till later in the week (I need a way to get to work...), but the plan is to drop it off Friday evening or Saturday morning and have them work on it Saturday morning.

Also much to my surprise, but not in a good way, the guy who seemed like the junior installer attempted to tell me that the antenna was working correctly. He also mentioned that some Toyota's have 2 antenna cables, one of which is a tiny wire that they can't hook up. I told him that the inability to receive the strongest AM and FM stations in the area - WBZ 1030 AM, WBCN 104.1 FM, WKLB 102.5 FM, WXKS 107.9 FM, etc. (these are all REALLY strong stations that I've never had trouble receiving on any radio, including cheap clock radios) is not acceptable. He then went on to say that it's normal to lose AM reception on an aftermarket radio. At this point (still keeping a calm voice), I lost my patience and called BS. I've never completely lost the ability to tune any of these stations on an aftermarket radio. I've done several simple installs (headunit and speakers only - no external amp or subwoofers) in the past and had a system installed by Tweeter in a Honda Accord a while back, so I'm not completely green //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif.

I also pointed out the tool marks on the dashboard, which he didn't seem interested in.

At this point, we went back inside and spoke with one of the more senior guys. He seemed to more or less agree with me regarding radio reception, though he did mention the part about the 2 cable antenna. He said that when I bring it in this weekend, they'll try an external antenna so they can narrow down where the problem is exactly. He also said that they should be able to do something about the tool marks.

The radio reception thing definitely doesn't leave me with a good feeling at this point. If the 2 cable situation is a common thing in Toyota's they really should have mentioned it to me. However, I know of other people who have installed aftermarket radios in their 2008 Highlanders (some using the same Kenwood headunit I got) and I have yet to hear any complaints about bad radio reception. To me, radio reception is a key feature of a car audio system. It's nice to have satellite, CD, iPod, and whatever else, but AM/FM is an absolute must have, deal breaker type feature.

I'm certainly going to give them a chance to fix it before I resort to anything like calling my credit card company, but I don't have a good feeling about this.

I think I feel comfortable naming the shop at this point for those who are interested. It's Audio Werks in Tewksbury. I'm really wishing at this point that I had picked another shop.

 

[greynolds 10+ year member]

I've prepared a to-do list (see below) for when I drop my Highlander off on Saturday. Based on what I've said before, does my list seem reasonable? Anything I should add? I'll try to get some pictures up showing the problems (and hopefully some good points too) in case people are interested.

Yes, I researched the antenna problem for them - based on what I found, the antenna probably is connected but the power isn't hooked up for the signal amp. This seems like something they REALLY ought to know about. Toyota's aren't exactly rare //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif and lots of them have the diversity antennas these days.

Car Audio Install Punch List

1. Fix AM/FM antenna reception. Research on the internet suggests that this should be resolved by hooking up the power antenna wire to enable the signal amp that Toyota uses on the diversity antennas. The smaller antenna cable can apparently be converted to standard a Motorola connector with a GM to Motorola adapter and the 2 connected with a Y adapter or the smaller cable can be left unconnected if reception is good enough once the signal amp is getting power. Among other sources, this discussion provides useful details:

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=28571

2. Add proper support for the floor above the subwoofers / amp. As originally discussed, this must be capable of handling moderate / heavy loads over the entire floor just as the original floor could.

3. Fix support for the floor cutout for the subwoofers. This must also be able to handle moderate / heavy loads, as originally discussed.

4. The cosmetic panel at the front of the cargo floor should be fastened to something rather than sitting loose OR (preferably) replaced with a carpeted masonite / particle board panel that is screwed to the amp rack.

5. As previously discussed, relocate the USB connectors into the glove box for easy access for firmware updates and using USB jump drives, etc.

6. Replace the trim panel clip on the front passenger door that I found while vacuuming (I believe this was a blue one). Audio Werks appears to have this in their possession as I showed it to the installer on Tuesday and it's no longer in the vehicle.

7. See if something can be done about the marks on the front dashboard around the radio install kit and center air vent areas - they look like tool marks.

8. Find out the location of the navigation unit in case I need to update the maps at some point.

9. Updated receipt reflecting the actual radio / navigation unit I have (DDX812 and KNA-G510) instead of DNX8120.

 

[crunktimes.com 5,000+ posts]

Sounds very reasonable to me, personally I would not say 'if something can be done' about the marks on the dash I would say either make them not appear or replace it. You are giving them a bit of room to get out of it if they can't make it new as it should with a brand new vehicle.

 

[nittanylion64 10+ year member]

I would agree with Toasted- be very specific, there is a possibility that given the wiggle room they can and will do what they can to get out of responsibility. I feel bad about your install, as I am an installer as well, this bothers me. The installer should have been geeked to have been given a clean canvas to work with. I hope it all works out for you, stay calm until you have to start being stern.

 

[greynolds 10+ year member]

I would agree with Toasted- be very specific, there is a possibility that given the wiggle room they can and will do what they can to get out of responsibility. I feel bad about your install, as I am an installer as well, this bothers me. The installer should have been geeked to have been given a clean canvas to work with. I hope it all works out for you, stay calm until you have to start being stern.

Thanks guys. I've changed the wording to (note I've elevated the ordering too):

"2. The marks on the front dashboard around the radio install kit and center air vent areas, which appear to be tool marks, need to be repaired to bring the dashboard back to original as new condition."

I don't think that leaves them any wiggle room. I had left the wording on that one a bit vague as it's actually less upsetting to me than the more serious issues (1-4), but your points that it's completely unacceptable are really spot on. Item 5 is something that they suggested when I took delivery (and they really should have done anyway). Item 6 is minor, but is something I wouldn't have noticed at all if they had cleaned up after themselves when they were done. 8 & 9 are pretty much to cover me in case these guys go out of business and I have a problem (or in the very likely case that I will never go back there once they fix the problems). I also fixed the typo ("to standard a") in item 1 - my brother noticed that.

I'm usually pretty good at remaining reasonably calm until it's clear that a different approach is going to be required. Hopefully I won't have to go there //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif.

Though there's definitely no excuse for the job these guys did, I now wish I had taken a much closer look at some sample jobs from them to get a better feel for the work they do. Naturally though, they're only going to show jobs that came out really well unless they're completely inept.

I definitely have nothing against installers in general, but it seems like (as in lots of other fields) there needs to be a way to know you're going to get a quality job when you pay a place like this to do the install for you (regardless of price). Without any good or bad reviews to go by and not knowing anyone who's done business or even heard of someone who's had experience with the place, about all you can do is go by a gut feeling. I had an install done at the Tweeter in Burlington, MA around 7-8 years ago and though there weren't any problems, it wasn't good enough for me to go back for something I knew would require custom work. That left me with a choice of Audio Werks, MacKenzie Mobile Electronics in Billerica (which I've also heard no feedback on), the Best Buy / Circuit City options (which didn't seem like a good idea for custom work) and other options that are a lot less convenient to get to.

 

[azbass 5,000+ posts]

lets see some pics..

 

[greynolds 10+ year member]

lets see some pics..

Yeah, yeah //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif. It looks like I'll get a chance to leave work early tomorrow (the boss is leaving early and suggested that I should do the same - gotta do what the boss says...) and will plan to take some tomorrow afternoon. Be warned though as it's definitely not going to be as easy on the eyes as your sub setup. Nice job on that.