why that was nice

[JayRich 10+ year member]

no the cost of goods or cost of living is no different than here. With that theory the gov't only gets the money from what they tax people from. They do print money and have other sources of income. If that is the case then the GDP would be soley reliant on the taxes of the workers of the country and if that were the case the higher the taxes the greater the GDP which is not the case. Where you allocate the money that you do have makes the difference. These multi billion dollar companies continue to **** the patients in premiums without any penalties, and the gov't contnued to give these same companies tax breakes rather than the working class, thats how you end up in our situation. These private health care entities are the ones that are increasing these costs of health care. and if the gov't lets them govern themselves what is to stop them from keep increasing the charges. Thats why they send these people to these town hall meeting to try and use proproganda to shoot it down b/c they would not be able to get away like bandits they way that they have in the past 8 years.

in a nutshell it matters more of how you and where you use the money. if it doesn't flow correctly im writing this at work while doing my work

 

[JayRich 10+ year member]

As P.J. O'Rourke so aptly put it many moons ago, "If you think health care is expensive now, just wait until it is free."

Nothing is "free" coming from the government...WE pay for it in taxes. Period.

I take it that you've never been to canada huh??

 

[JayRich 10+ year member]

Why give tax breaks to those companies who are making record profits and giving these ridiculous bonues to the top execs and not give the middle class a tax break

 

[JayRich 10+ year member]

I'm not saying that I agree with the gov't taking control of health care, but these private entities need to have some form of accountability. Without it there is no competition and they can drive prices up as high as they want, just like the oil companies are doing.

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

no the cost of goods or cost of living is no different than here. With that theory the gov't only gets the money from what they tax people from. They do print money and have other sources of income. If that is the case then the GDP would be soley reliant on the taxes of the workers of the country and if that were the case the higher the taxes the greater the GDP which is not the case. Where you allocate the money that you do have makes the difference. These multi billion dollar companies continue to **** the patients in premiums without any penalties, and the gov't contnued to give these same companies tax breakes rather than the working class, thats how you end up in our situation. These private health care entities are the ones that are increasing these costs of health care. and if the gov't lets them govern themselves what is to stop them from keep increasing the charges. Thats why they send these people to these town hall meeting to try and use proproganda to shoot it down b/c they would not be able to get away like bandits they way that they have in the past 8 years.
in a nutshell it matters more of how you and where you use the money. if it doesn't flow correctly im writing this at work while doing my work

1. I am certain you are incorrect about the cost of goods and services. There has to be some way they are making up the difference. There is significantly less defense spending. Perhaps that is it.

2. A government's income is through various forms of taxation. Printing money is not income.

3. GDP is not based on government income (to a degree), only government spending. It's a function of all the goods and services produced in a country. Gross Domestic Product. GDP = C + I + G + (X − M). Consumption + Investment (savings) + government spending + net foreign.

4. There is a ceiling to what they can charge. They cannot possibly charge more than one's income.

5. I have no obligation to the insurance or pharma companies, thus, why would I support it?

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

I take it that you've never been to canada huh??

I am not sure what you quoted here? I didn't say that.

Why give tax breaks to those companies who are making record profits and giving these ridiculous bonues to the top execs and not give the middle class a tax break

I agree with this.

 

[JayRich 10+ year member]

1. I am certain you are incorrect about the cost of goods and services. There has to be some way they are making up the difference. There is significantly less defense spending. Perhaps that is it.
2. A government's income is through various forms of taxation. Printing money is not income.

3. GDP is not based on government income (to a degree), only government spending. It's a function of all the goods and services produced in a country. Gross Domestic Product. GDP = C + I + G + (X − M). Consumption + Investment (savings) + government spending + net foreign.

4. There is a ceiling to what they can charge. They cannot possibly charge more than one's income.

5. I have no obligation to the insurance or pharma companies, thus, why would I support it?

first off i was not stating that printing money was a form of income, I was making two seperate points. The cost of goods and services is right in line with the US. Gas, food, shelter etc. Like I said, its where you spend the money you have. Not to mention how much money you make abroad through trade and services.

What i meant with GDP is that the Gov't does not soley rely on tax money to pay for everything and is not the sole source of its wealth. That was in response to your statement about canada where they must be getting the money from the taxpayers.

there is no ceiling, but they can charge someone $200k for 4 DAYS IN A HOSPITAL!!! thats way more than my income

 

[faulkton 5,000+ posts]

No one would be starving to death if they got off their *****. You're assuming that people would rather starve than work, which I think is bull.
And there are plenty of people who take my money to live in government housing and use food stamps. That is what you would call a minimal discomfortable level of living, yet people are perfectly content to do so, and nothing more. So how do you get them to get off their ***** and pay for their own lifestyle?

How much federal tax do you pay as a college student? I bet no one is taking YOUR money and instead YOU take other people's money all the time!

Further the portion of people willing to live a shit life on welfare (including all the people whom you already conceed should be given a minimum amount to live):

VERY FUKKIN SMALL

 

[JayRich 10+ year member]

I am not sure what you quoted here? I didn't say that.


I agree with this.

I was quoting you from the quote regarding see how expensive it gets when health care is free. Thats when i said I take it you've never been to canada.

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

It takes 10 seconds of math to show that there is positive correlation. Proving causation is beyond the scope of most members of this forum. That process is much more demanding. Correlation, on the other hand, can be done in excel in the time it took to write this post.

I didn't say there was no positive correlation. I said no positive correlation relevant to the discussion. Read the post.

It's easy to show a positive correlation between fat people and cheeseburgers but that correlation doesn't mean if you eat cheeseburgers you will be fat. It has fallacy stamped all over it, just like the op study and its implications.

 

[JayRich 10+ year member]

Just imagaine you never pay that much for health care, you think your supporting everyone else who is freeloading the system. Then GOD forbid you or a family member gets sick real sick, and that insurance company you've been paying your premiums to for years tells you, well its a pre existing condition so you are not covered for this, so now that $300k bill is your responsibility and you have to take a lien out on your home just to cover it. Not everyone who is suffering in this system are freeloaders. There are people out there with families where the sole provider gets sick, so not only do you lose your income to pay your bills, now you have medical bills on top of that. What's the solution???

it seems irrelevant until it happens to you or one of your loved ones

 

[JayRich 10+ year member]

In a nutshell canada is doing worlds better than us on the issue of health care, b/c they dont have people losing their homes due to liens for medical bills or have to sell their homes just to pay for the bills. Im sure there system has flaws as nothing is perfect but its way better than what we have here

 

[AlterEgo99 5,000+ posts]

In a nutshell canada is doing worlds better than us on the issue of health care, b/c they dont have people losing their homes do to liens for medical bills or have to sell their homes just to pay for the bills. Im sure there system has flaws as nothing is perfect but its way better than what we have here

Wow, yeah, I see your point. It's so hard to believe all those U.S. citizens crossing the border into Canada so they can get the health care in Canada that they can't get here. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crazy.gif.c13912c32de98515d3142759a824dae7.gif

 

[AlterEgo99 5,000+ posts]

It's free if you are willing to live in squalor.

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/iagree.gif.15d6c075ee8d3913ba26866d06993068.gif

 

[fasfocus00 5,000+ posts]

its the conservative spin machine funded by the insurance companies waging a successful propaganda campaign .. stupid people are scared easily.

couldn't have said it better.