Sundown SAZ-3000D Vs. Tru H-1

[94z28stroker]

One dude commented that at 4KW it doesn't make a differance what you use... I beg to differ on this subject and if you agree with that statement you've never done a good SQL install and all that rattle you experience from a poor install is definately annoying! 145+ DB no rattles, no noise, no harshness at all at 20'+ outside the vehicle with the T-Tops off. Yes, your ears will freaking hurt inside the ride and yes, it will sound harsh if you can sit in the car at all and the inside of the ride will get hot from the heat produced from the mid and high soundwaves and if it gets much louder than that it might even catch the car on fire with the heat produced by the soundwaves on the interior. Take off the T-Tops and let that sound out (who nees SPL inside a car full range anyway) so everyone can enjoy your SQ install! Then the only rattle you hear will be the car sitting next to yours rattling from your system... When you do that come back and tell us how you did it and post some pics of your install.

Yeah, the Linear Power smacks down the TRU when it comes to in car efficiency as well as any other amplifer I have ever used. I have no clue how the efficiency of the amps are rated from the factory or by design but I guarantee you when you feel my Linear Power it will be cold and you'll be looking for the hidden amp that runs my sub but there isn't one!!! Compared to a JL 1000/1 though the JL amp was too hot to touch, pulled enough juice to stall my car almost, yet only posted a 138DB rating on the audio control. Swap out nothing but the amps and the Linear Power never dimmed a headlight once, runs cold and posted a 145+ on the audiocontrol playing the same GodSmack tracks. Both amps were run to the same single Cerwin Vega Stroker 15D2 subwoofer at the same 4 ohm impedance and the Linear Power manhandled the Stroker to the point I was in fear of losing it without even getting warm enough to detect it was on, here in FL. I cannot tell you how well it does in the cold but if you really want to know, I'll be freezing my arse off this winter before I compete for the 1st time in 25 years of doing this as a hobby but I've seen the apples and the oranges and I know what I am running for my install needs. BTW Retro is definately in these days! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/cool.gif.3bcaf8f141236c00f8044d07150e34f7.gif

 

[gunz4me 10+ year member]

Now, I remember you.... You are the guy who had the 8002SWs for sale a while back //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

ETA: Those 8002SWs are the ultimate when it comes to cone control from their "servo" drive system, or active global feedback control as it is better known in the industry!

 

[94z28stroker]

Right on, I have 4 of 7 known Linear Power 8002SW that have been to Mr. Rayfield for SQ and Power Supply modifications. The internal voltage was increased and parts swapped out so that they don't even get warm at all or draw any noticible power from the car electrical system yet they still manage over 145DB where it counts and sound clean doing it too. I've owned no less than 2500 Amps in 25 years and have found nothing that could even stand in the same ballpark as of yet. Fact is someone told me how much they loved their Tru amps so I picked up 4 of the SH-1s and an H-1. Because I know these are Power eating bastards. I'm sending them out to be looked at and will be having them modded too to make full power into a 4 or 8 Ohm load. If this happens maybe I'll flip the cover and put a Linear Power Logo on them too! LOL

What is up with this facination with low impedances and big freaking boxes with a big spike in the resonce at a tuned frequency? Did a few guys win a contest and every one copy? I've got $500 cash that says there is not a Class D amp out there than can produce the same power I am getting from my Class A/B amps at the same amp draw or even within 20% of my amp draw.

Seems stupid to waste all that money and space on batteries and electrical systems when you can get an amp that does not require this and post the same or better numbers on the AudioControl. Then toss out the big box and do something no one else does like mounting a sub that requires 8 cubic feet a small 2 cubic foot box bringing the rear wave in phase with the front wave. Call it the ported T-Top baffle, horn loading or whatever you want to. Fun part is the frequency resonce is flat not tuned to a certain frequency like a ported box is and it's louder than a ported box with the same driver troughout the full range of the driver. You might get a little bump at tune frequency of the ported enclosure over this design but it's hardly worth mentioning.

You got to love it when you do something well that everone says will not work.

As far as this question about amps goes. It's simple hook them both up and pick the one you like best. Who cares what I think or anyone else for that matter if you are happy. Things I said about resale are true however and you stand to lose most of your investment in a few years with a chinkaneese product vs the TRU US made product. We all know however there were some USA made products that were not worth buying too. I won't name brands...

 

[Reimers 10+ year member]

i used the tru h1 on my 2 cerwin vega v-max15 subwoofer and it sounded realy good

 

[gunz4me 10+ year member]

Right on, I have 4 of 7 known Linear Power 8002SW that have been to Mr. Rayfield for SQ and Power Supply modifications.

Another cool trick you can perform with the 8002SW is run a 60 Hz sine wave through it and power a shop vac off of the speaker leads.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

I've got $500 cash that says there is not a Class D amp out there than can produce the same power I am getting from my Class A/B amps at the same amp draw or even within 20% of my amp draw.

Be careful with that bet. There are a couple of companies out of Brazil that produce High Voltage class D amps! These new breed Class D amplifiers make insane power between 2 and 8 ohms

 

[(((BOOM))) 10+ year member]

Right on, I have 4 of 7 known Linear Power 8002SW that have been to Mr. Rayfield for SQ and Power Supply modifications. The internal voltage was increased and parts swapped out so that they don't even get warm at all or draw any noticible power from the car electrical system yet they still manage over 145DB where it counts and sound clean doing it too. I've owned no less than 2500 Amps in 25 years and have found nothing that could even stand in the same ballpark as of yet. Fact is someone told me how much they loved their Tru amps so I picked up 4 of the SH-1s and an H-1. Because I know these are Power eating bastards. I'm sending them out to be looked at and will be having them modded too to make full power into a 4 or 8 Ohm load. If this happens maybe I'll flip the cover and put a Linear Power Logo on them too! LOL
What is up with this facination with low impedances and big freaking boxes with a big spike in the resonce at a tuned frequency? Did a few guys win a contest and every one copy? I've got $500 cash that says there is not a Class D amp out there than can produce the same power I am getting from my Class A/B amps at the same amp draw or even within 20% of my amp draw.

Seems stupid to waste all that money and space on batteries and electrical systems when you can get an amp that does not require this and post the same or better numbers on the AudioControl. Then toss out the big box and do something no one else does like mounting a sub that requires 8 cubic feet a small 2 cubic foot box bringing the rear wave in phase with the front wave. Call it the ported T-Top baffle, horn loading or whatever you want to. Fun part is the frequency resonce is flat not tuned to a certain frequency like a ported box is and it's louder than a ported box with the same driver troughout the full range of the driver. You might get a little bump at tune frequency of the ported enclosure over this design but it's hardly worth mentioning.

You got to love it when you do something well that everone says will not work.

As far as this question about amps goes. It's simple hook them both up and pick the one you like best. Who cares what I think or anyone else for that matter if you are happy. Things I said about resale are true however and you stand to lose most of your investment in a few years with a chinkaneese product vs the TRU US made product. We all know however there were some USA made products that were not worth buying too. I won't name brands...

This post is so full of BS, I dont know if it's win or fail.

PS- BVLLSH!TBULLSH!TBULLSH!T

PPS- *cough*ohm's law*cough*

 

[flaboy 10+ year member]

why the fuck is this thread still continuing....i think there is enough talk about which is better...everyone has their opinion about it but ultimately its up to him....no need for the "my shit stinks more like roses than yours" opinions....

 

[vellocet 10+ year member]

This post is so full of BS, I dont know if it's win or fail.

PS- BVLLSH!TBULLSH!TBULLSH!T

PPS- *cough*ohm's law*cough*

Yeah, not to mention that speakers aren't played in just cars. If there was a t-top mini t rex coolaid box, most likely it would have already been engineered. Not saying that new advancements won't be made, but this isn't a brand spanking new field.

Wait, I know, I'll fire up winisd, design one, patent it, and be Rich!!!

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/greedy.gif.5a53e6246569d7ab79867170f3b06629.gif

 

[Safe_Cracker 10+ year member]

Seems stupid to waste all that money and space on batteries and electrical systems when you can get an amp that does not require this and post the same or better numbers on the AudioControl.

WTF is an audiocontrol I guess if you are using one of them then in real life on the TL you are getting 135 db lol. ...//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

Polo..

 

[RetroAudioinc 5,000+ posts]

WTF is an audiocontrol I guess if you are using one of them then in real life on the TL you are getting 135 db lol. ...//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

Polo..

X2

Coming to a SPL event near you "audiocontrol" the new TL... not...

 

[gunz4me 10+ year member]

WTF is an audiocontrol I guess if you are using one of them then in real life on the TL you are getting 135 db lol. ...//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

Polo..

Isn't that the old AC microphone that they used to measure dB with?

One of my friends was all proud when he broke 160 with two 18s in a GM full sized extended cab truck being powered with 4 power 1000s. This was on the AC mic. When they switched to the Termlab, he got out of dB drags:laugh:

ETA: I should take 94z28stroker up on his $500 bet too. I am sure I can find a Class D amp that will produce more power while drawing less amperage than that Linear Power 8002SW!

 

[Safe_Cracker 10+ year member]

A true SQ system is less than a 1kw the idea is to be clean and flat on an RTA. Regardless of what you do or how fantastic your install with a 4kw A/B amp body panels will flex causing noise(audible/inaudible) on the RTA, FACT. I guess if I need an expensive trunk heater I would buy an H-1 //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

Polo..

 

[Grinder1989 5,000+ posts]

I've got $500 cash that says there is not a Class D amp out there than can produce the same power I am getting from my Class A/B amps at the same amp draw or even within 20% of my amp draw.

I'll take that bet any day. You're an absolute fool if you think an A/B amp is efficient as Class D. If that were the case, class D wouldn't exist. If I'm drawing a constant 100 amps of current, the class D amp (provided that it is of comparable RMS values at any specific ohm load) will produce more power than the A/B, hands down, all day. The only way an AB could produce more power is if the ohm load was different. You probably don't have $500 anyway you arrogant ***. Class D is more efficient. End of discussion.

 

[gunz4me 10+ year member]

I hate to bring this thread back, but I need to set someone straight regarding his precious Linear Power 8002SW. Not all too long ago, I drank the Linear Power-Kool Aid and bought into the hype and BS.

This is what was found regarding their modifications: http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/742302-post1.html

And this is how well the mighty 8002SW stacked up against other amps: http://www.audiogroupforum.com/csforum/showpost.php?p=455389&postcount=109 and http://www.audiogroupforum.com/csforum/showpost.php?p=455392&postcount=112

I'm ready to take someone's $500 now. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif Also, there is a reason the mighty Linear Power 8002SW only needs a 60SC fuse.... That is because it doesn't even make the power it is rated at! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

 

[James Bang 5,000+ posts]

First up you have a class A/B Audiophile SQ grade amplifier that is capable of doing well over 4KW RMS and if you're slick you can run it in SPL and SQ and compete in two events in the one amp classes of IASCA with the right subs and a little inginuity where you'll run a 4 ohm & 1 Ohm Load on the SH-1 and swap the impedances on the fly! Yeah, I can rig your ride like this... Take a good look inside this amp as well. It looks like good ole American Made Inginuity went into this amp and it sound like it too. Best part is in 10 years or so when they are not to be found this amp will be shipping to Japan for the big bucks just like some of the other elite Old School amps. Funny that orientals would prefer an American Made amp over there own products don't you agree?
Second, you have a class D Chinkaneese amp that looks like it has a transistor package from a 225.2 450 watt Fosgate or something. Are we using any class D amps in SQ at all these days? I sure hope not, every class D amp I have ever had sounded like pure "assk me" in an IB set up... I sure would'nt turst the class D amp to control my subwoofer cone in FREE AIR! I know in SPL, distortion can often be the winning differance, CV knew this too and the Strokers were made adjustable so you could use them in SQ or SPL back in the day... but how many of the SQ vehicles can even run in the same lanes as an SPL vehicle without ducking their head in shame. I would assume if the class D amp is winning anything in SPL it must be this Distortion factor from tossing the cone arround uncontrolably as is the usual in SPL. At least CV took this into consideration when they designed their old school Strokers and made an adjustment on the pole to prevent damage in this distortion. Key is man you need a box if you use that amp period and I don't use boxes at all. You also will not see any resale value in the Chinkaneese amps down the road either and reputable repair shops might not even want to waste time repairing one of them in 5 years. I am not saying that for a cheapo amp that the class D is not good but I am saying that in 5 years it will only be just another cheapo amp and part of the forgotten Car Audio history like so many other amps.

I urge you again to look closely at the guts of both amps. After that if you're still thinking about the Chinkaneese amp contact me and I'll be happy to take the US Made amp off your hands and buy you the Chinkaneese thing. RIP JWF!

WTF..

uber lame post.