SQ questions

[Frraksurred 10+ year member]

Ok, I have picked up quite a few things I was clueless about since I started reading this Forum... thanks to all of you! Now I have some more questions.

I hear line drivers will make for much cleaner and louder sound from amps. I want to keep THD to a minimum so I'm assuming these would help? What exactly would an "epicenter" do for me? I have 2 12's in a sealed box now, but they're old and I want to eventually update and build a ported box (most of my musical taste is rock / rap)... just FYI.

Also I've read about people "braiding" their signal wires (RCA's) to cut down on "cross talk". I don't understand that completely, somebody want to fill me in? One of the mags I read showed an install where the guy ran his signal wires thru a copper tupe to block interferance and then wraped his power wires in thick rubber inside a stainless steel channel all the way to his amps. I understand these are extreme measures, but they are also fairly cheap to do if they make a difference. Any comments on that?

If you can't tell I'm trying to fit the best quality music in my car I can on my meger budget. I drive A LOT, and I go thru a car about every 2 yrs. Consequently I spend a lot of time uninstalling and installing, LOL! BTW I already SDed the trunk, doors and floor with eDead v.1 and some Dynamat Extreme I got early on.

Any answers or additional tips you could provide would be much appreciated! I'm still soaking it all in. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

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[chris229 10+ year member]

Originally posted by Frraksurred [Ok, I have picked up quite a few things I was clueless about since I started reading this Forum... thanks to all of you! Now I have some more questions.

I hear line drivers will make for much cleaner and louder sound from amps. I want to keep THD to a minimum so I'm assuming these would help?

NOT louder but MAYBE cleaner depending on what your noise problem is----doesn't sound like you have one------so they aren't going to do anything

What exactly would an "epicenter" do for me? I have 2 12's in a sealed box now, but they're old and I want to eventually update and build a ported box (most of my musical taste is rock / rap)... just FYI.

I don't know good Q------ though I would expect it to sound like just turning up the bass

Also I've read about people "braiding" their signal wires (RCA's) to cut down on "cross talk". I don't understand that completely, somebody want to fill me in?

uuummmm -------- braiding wires I guess is supposed to act like UTP [unshielded twisted pairs] which they don't---------braiding doesn't work-------- UTP's do though

I read showed an install where the guy ran his signal wires thru a copper tupe to block interferance and then wraped his power wires in thick rubber inside a stainless steel channel all the way to his amps. I understand these are extreme measures, but they are also fairly cheap to do if they make a difference. Any comments on that?

can you tell me where you read that--------- hehe-------- he needsa lesson on noise induction. First I don't care who said it------- but physics tells you------- because the freq of the noise is so low around 3000hz no shielding is really possible for car uses. The shield would have to be solid steel and several meters thich nd would weigh couple tons. It would make more sense to reduce noise by routing wire away from a noise source-------------------------- not that your power wires a noise source in the first place anyway-------- so the whole idea is just --------- uninformed and stupidplease tell me were you read that!

If you can't tell I'm trying to fit the best quality music in my car I can on my meger budget. I drive A LOT, and I go thru a car about every 2 yrs. Consequently I spend a lot of time uninstalling and installing, LOL! BTW I already SDed the trunk, doors and floor with eDead v.1 and some Dynamat Extreme I got early on.

Any answers or additional tips you could provide would be much appreciated! I'm still soaking it all in. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif ]

use UTP wires [cat5]- or better-----as in monster cable XLNpros as they keep all channels in agreement not just 2
By and recommend------ low imedance signal drives on HUs and linedrivers------reduces the occurance of noise induction

by and recommend------- high isolation power supplies for processors and amps------- prevents ground loops

if music is to be played on the systems---------- use low esr caps for better power conditions in a car--------- esr must be .0025 ohm or better

run no more than a 3/1 overlap on you final gain to the amps and a 1/1 on all processors and hu---------- lets say that the final siganl voltage at the amp unclipped is 6V you would set the amp for a 2v sensitivity

always upgrade ALL power wire to the same size for safety------ alt to battery, battery to ground, battery to motor, frame ground, amps ground and power wire

am i missing something guys------------?

 

[Frraksurred 10+ year member]

Wow, how's that for an indepth and informative response. Thanks Chris229! Your time and effort are appreciated.

Your right, I don't have a noise problem, but I am into slight overkill. In other words I want to be able to turn it up with no music playing and not be able to tell I've turned it up. No hissing, no static, etc. If a line driver would help do that then noise problem or not I'm interested in one.

It was an install on SoundDomain.com that had the briaded wires and it was his comment about cutting down on cross talk. I believe it was the guy who had over 200lbs. of Dynamat in his car. The comment just made me curious becuz I'd seen it else where as well. My signal wires are Monster Cable's Interlink 201XLN's and my power cables are MC's Powerflex 4 from the batt. to the distribution block and Powerflex 8 to my amps and H/U. I believe there's a 30amp circuit breaker inline as well. I have not touched any of my factory power or ground wires, but you are the second source to recommend doing that (the other being AS&S Mag). Also, I do not have a cap as of yet, but was considering one so thanks for the heads up.

The article about the install using copper tubing was in the October issue of Car Audio (p. 33). The guy is the 6 year running champ from Finland from their "Champions from around the world" feature. They did comment on it being overkill, but in that bracket I imagine details like that can be just enough to get you the win.

I'm uncertain exactly what you mean by "low imedance signal drives on HUs and linedrivers", is this a feature to look for or an additional product? Same question for "high isolation power supplies for processors and amps". If I understand you correctly you're talking about a feature, so I'm just looking for a little clarification.

Final gain.... that is something I have yet to study so that whole sentence was greek to me. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif It seems I have more to learn then I thought. LOL!

Thanks again for your time and effort, I am indeed grateful. God bless you.

 

[MikeofTulsa Moderator]

if u need some general info check out my sig...good luck

 

[chris229 10+ year member]

Originally posted by Frraksurred ]Wow, how's that for an indepth and informative response. Thanks Chris229! Your time and effort are appreciated.

Your right, I don't have a noise problem, but I am into slight overkill. In other words I want to be able to turn it up with no music playing and not be able to tell I've turned it up. No hissing, no static, etc. If a line driver would help do that then noise problem or not I'm interested in one.

in that case no it isn't going to help------ the hissing is a limitation of your HU

It was an install on SoundDomain.com that had the briaded wires and it was his comment about cutting down on cross talk. I believe it was the guy who had over 200lbs. of Dynamat in his car. The comment just made me curious becuz I'd seen it else where as well.

there are tring to make UTPs. BUT for one the the wire it self must be small. The shields must be thin. and the wires twisted can't be coxial

My signal wires are Monster Cable's Interlink 201XLN's and my power cables are MC's Powerflex 4 from the batt. to the distribution block and Powerflex 8 to my amps and H/U. I believe there's a 30amp circuit breaker inline as well. I have not touched any of my factory power or ground wires, but you are the second source to recommend doing that (the other being AS&S Mag). Also, I do not have a cap as of yet, but was considering one so thanks for the heads up.

yea the factor ground and power wires are meant to be ok for factory current draw. drawing more requires you to need heavier wires on BOTH sides of the loads[+/-]

The article about the install using copper tubing was in the October issue of Car Audio (p. 33). The guy is the 6 year running champ from Finland from their "Champions from around the world" feature. They did comment on it being overkill, but in that bracket I imagine details like that can be just enough to get you the win.

along with it being overkill it isn't effective at all. Tough you might be right about a judge see that and awarding points--------even though it's useless. The judge may not know that though

I'm uncertain exactly what you mean by "low imedance signal drives on HUs and linedrivers", is this a feature to look for or an additional product?

low impedance is meaning ----- the resistance inline with the hu's rca outputs. This is called "output imedance" or something like that on the HU specs. you want no more than couple hundred ohms the lower the better. What this does it make it harder and harder to induct a voltage into a signal wire if it is shorted out by the HU---- see what I mean about lower being better

Same question for "high isolation power supplies for processors and amps". If I understand you correctly you're talking about a feature, so I'm just looking for a little clarification.

this isn't something that companies print on their specs but can be found out by calling them or reading carsound product testing. what it is the is the amount of DC and AC impedance between the audio side of a product and the power supply. IF it's low than ground loops & noise have an easy path into the signal. if the resistance is high [1 meg ohm or better] you never would have to worry about ground loops or other noise thought to come from the ground wire---------- which they don't-------- they come from bad isolation

Final gain.... that is something I have yet to study so that whole sentence was greek to me. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif It seems I have more to learn then I thought. LOL!

Thanks again for your time and effort, I am indeed grateful. God bless you.

the final gain simply ------------- final signal voltage/amp sensitivity
6v signal ----- with the amp set to 2v is a 3/1 overlap ----which is the max you want

all processors should be set to 1/1 meaning they all clip at the same time. They are all at full output at the same time------

 

[Frraksurred 10+ year member]

Thanks to the both of you. I appreciate your help.