Sealed box for two DD 2010 series


Radiospank

Senior VIP Member
Mar 27, 2012
222
12
los angeles
Happy with the box so far, def blends better with the midrange and pretty good linear response as expected from a sealed. Roughly 3 cube net

22522
 

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Radiospank

Radiospank

Senior VIP Member
Mar 27, 2012
222
12
los angeles
Just an Update and Review.

# Sealed
the subs take all the 2000 ish watts I presume and will start to complain and heat up at the very max level. They hit pretty clean and accurate, noticeable hump in the 50 hz region and dip in the 70 hz. These are DDs SQ range of subs so I was curious to try them out and they get loud and perform well in sealed; however, they still cannot compete with my Morel ultimo in terms of detail and accuracy. This even when Morel is in a horn enclosure and not a sealed box.

# Ported
Built a Ported box per DD specs 3 cubes net with 31 hz tune and 48 sq in of port area, it def was louder than the sealed but not mind blowing loud nor more accurate. Many claim that ported is accurate and can generate great SQ but in this case it was not very good for my listening, it lacked some detail that the sealed box had and just sounded slightly muddled even at lower listening levels.

So is this SQ? maybe for some, just not for me and I'd rather go with a tried and true SQ sub over these such as Jl w6, audiofrog gs, morel ultimo, etc.
 
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OP
Radiospank

Radiospank

Senior VIP Member
Mar 27, 2012
222
12
los angeles
3 cubes is on the large side for a pair of 10s. If you're after sq try smaller like 2-2.25cf. That will tighten up the sound and most likely lower group delay.
I was going with DDs recommendation and that was 3 cubes or 2.5 cubes on the low end. I will try adding some bricks or similar and see how it sounds with a smaller box ported, but don't expect it to sound much better than the sealed in overall detail. Also the group delay really doesn't start to deviate until around the 31 hz or so, and so lowering the box volume will help and group delay decreases with lower output, but that kind of defeats the purpose of ported. I've mulled over this many diffferent ways when modeling box designs, the sealed and ported low tune of 25 hz yield a similar result in output and response.
 

Jeffdachef

Gunz That Turn on Nunz
Feb 5, 2013
18,470
772
South Coast Metro, CA
I was going with DDs recommendation and that was 3 cubes or 2.5 cubes on the low end. I will try adding some bricks or similar and see how it sounds with a smaller box ported, but don't expect it to sound much better than the sealed in overall detail. Also the group delay really doesn't start to deviate until around the 31 hz or so, and so lowering the box volume will help and group delay decreases with lower output, but that kind of defeats the purpose of ported. I've mulled over this many diffferent ways when modeling box designs, the sealed and ported low tune of 25 hz yield a similar result in output and response.
i'm pretty sure your assessment is right. A lot of people on here think these SPL brands trying to bring out SQ designed subwoofer lineups like SSA, FI, DD would make decent SQ subs, they are dreaming lol. They are all SPL/daily gound pounder brands so unless you hit the golden holy grail of enclosures and alignment, you arent going to get much actual SQ and detail in the bass. SQ subs are designed a different way and sound completely different due to the balances and tradeoffs they do. If you never heard the morel, you would have been fine with the DDs but once you hear actual SQ, anything else feels like noise. But once you go back to the SQ, you gonna miss having your lungs crushed lmao.
 
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Jeffdachef

Gunz That Turn on Nunz
Feb 5, 2013
18,470
772
South Coast Metro, CA
Just an Update and Review.

# Sealed
the subs take all the 2000 ish watts I presume and will start to complain and heat up at the very max level. They hit pretty clean and accurate, noticeable hump in the 50 hz region and dip in the 70 hz. These are DDs SQ range of subs so I was curious to try them out and they get loud and perform well in sealed; however, they still cannot compete with my Morel ultimo in terms of detail and accuracy. This even when Morel is in a horn enclosure and not a sealed box.

# Ported
Built a Ported box per DD specs 3 cubes net with 31 hz tune and 48 sq in of port area, it def was louder than the sealed but not mind blowing loud nor more accurate. Many claim that ported is accurate and can generate great SQ but in this case it was not very good for my listening, it lacked some detail that the sealed box had just sounded kind of muddled even at lower listening levels.

So is this SQ? maybe for some, just not for me and I'd rather go with a tried and true SQ sub over these such as Jl w6, audiofrog gs, morel ultimo, etc.
One suggestion for the sealed is to have a 50hz EQ drop/cut if your head unit/dsp has that band, narrow the Q factor a bit. Thats pretty much your cabin gain/resonant frequency you are at the mercy of in your prius. Making the box smaller will make this hump even larger tbh.


For the ported box though, thats a lot of port area, definitely a design flaw imo. If you are using winisd for rear air velocity, you need to plug in the power after accounting box rise. So if your amp is 2000 watts at 1 ohm, you need to be looking at 2-4 ohm power because thats what the actual real world power will be. Meaning the amount of port area needed in a box is MUCH less than people think. From my experiences, too much port area makes the bass sound like absolute shit and sometimes you lose output and cone control. Too little is bad but too much is just as bad imo especially for SQ port area has a big effect on bandwidth and accuracy. I have better results shooting for slightly above the bare minimal to medium vs having too much in both SQ and loudness in my builds. I even have interchangeable ports and the big ones keeping the same tuning always perform like shit. sometimes its louder and peakier which is fine for competitions but most of the times the SQ and bandwith and tonality is just awful. A few other times its less loud, and sounds like shit and stinks up the sub so complete garbage results across the board. Just sharing some personal testing.
 
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THATpurpleKUSH

Smoke weed everyday
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Sep 30, 2009
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You can tell an sq sub right away by looking at vas (or cms) fs and mms.

Low vas indicates high stiffness (low compliance) which will yield a high fs and then usually mass is added to lower the fs. That's how most subs are nowadays, not sq oriented. Big heavy coils to handle the cheap power of modern amps.

An sq oriented sub will have a higher vas indicating a softer suspension. A softer suspension (more compliant) naturally has less moving mass and an inherently lower fs. You'll also notice that efficiency is much higher on designs like this.

Compare home theatre subs to the majority of car audio subs and you can see the differences when comparing specs.

Old school car audio subs were mostly softly sprung high efficiency more sq oriented designs because amps were still expensive and gobs of amplifier power werent as easily attainable as they are today.


Some entry level new subs are about the closest you can get to some of the older stuff.


Lastly as much as I love DD, I admit they will never be an SQ company lol.

My .02
 
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OP
Radiospank

Radiospank

Senior VIP Member
Mar 27, 2012
222
12
los angeles
One suggestion for the sealed is to have a 50hz EQ drop/cut if your head unit/dsp has that band, narrow the Q factor a bit. Thats pretty much your cabin gain/resonant frequency you are at the mercy of in your prius. Making the box smaller will make this hump even larger tbh.


For the ported box though, thats a lot of port area, definitely a design flaw imo. If you are using winisd for rear air velocity, you need to plug in the power after accounting box rise. So if your amp is 2000 watts at 1 ohm, you need to be looking at 2-4 ohm power because thats what the actual real world power will be. Meaning the amount of port area needed in a box is MUCH less than people think. From my experiences, too much port area makes the bass sound like absolute shit and sometimes you lose output and cone control. Too little is bad but too much is just as bad imo especially for SQ port area has a big effect on bandwidth and accuracy. I have better results shooting for slightly above the bare minimal to medium vs having too much in both SQ and loudness in my builds. I even have interchangeable ports and the big ones keeping the same tuning always perform like shit. sometimes its louder and peakier which is fine for competitions but most of the times the SQ and bandwith and tonality is just awful. A few other times its less loud, and sounds like shit and stinks up the sub so complete garbage results across the board. Just sharing some personal testing.
Haha yea exactly how you said, the port sounds like meh, but certainly bangs hard. Btw I went with 48 sq ft port area because DD recommended that, but thanks for the insight about Using smaller Port area, i didn’t know it affected the tone and detail of the sound. I always thought it was more for port noise.
 
OP
Radiospank

Radiospank

Senior VIP Member
Mar 27, 2012
222
12
los angeles
You can tell an sq sub right away by looking at vas (or cms) fs and mms.

Low vas indicates high stiffness (low compliance) which will yield a high fs and then usually mass is added to lower the fs. That's how most subs are nowadays, not sq oriented. Big heavy coils to handle the cheap power of modern amps.

An sq oriented sub will have a higher vas indicating a softer suspension. A softer suspension (more compliant) naturally has less moving mass and an inherently lower fs. You'll also notice that efficiency is much higher on designs like this.

Compare home theatre subs to the majority of car audio subs and you can see the differences when comparing specs.

Old school car audio subs were mostly softly sprung high efficiency more sq oriented designs because amps were still expensive and gobs of amplifier power werent as easily attainable as they are today.


Some entry level new subs are about the closest you can get to some of the older stuff.


Lastly as much as I love DD, I admit they will never be an SQ company lol.

My .02
Thanks for explaining that VAS, mms and fs, I do look at fs and mms but never vas, I always just read the descriptions of the sub and avoided the triple spider quad spider subs lol.
 

THATpurpleKUSH

Smoke weed everyday
10+ year member
Sep 30, 2009
7,881
664
Slums of the Shaolin
Thanks for explaining that VAS, mms and fs, I do look at fs and mms but never vas, I always just read the descriptions of the sub and avoided the triple spider quad spider subs lol.
Not only will quantity of spiders affect suspension stiffness, the overall design (whether linear or progreasive roll) will also affect performance.
 

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