Rear fill overkill?

[OdieTRP 10+ year member]

I have a set of Type X comps for the front, was going to buy a set of coax's for the rear fill, but still have another set of Type X's I could use instead. They are going on the rear deck in 6x9 slots but I have an adapter plate that will let them fit easily. Would this be too "good" for the rear fill? They will be powered by a PA 75x4 amp so power is not an issue. Before you give opinions that you wouldn't use a rear stage, please keep in mind that it's not my car and rear speakers are a must. I'm also curious how much more difficult it would be to tune correctly. Thanks for all the knowledge.

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[OdieTRP 10+ year member]

One other thing too; I won't be adding a sub to the system until spring, just fyi.

 

[fossil99ca 10+ year member]

I would consider bridging your amp to give you 150 x 2 (if possible) to the fronts and using the deck amp to power the rear fill. You can always fad out the rear to your liking or kill it altogether. This will make the car owner happy because they still have sound back there. 150 to the front gives you lots of head room and avoids clipping. If the speakers cannot handle 150, turn the gains down or the volume.

If you have speakers lying around, why not install them. Having tweeters in the rear pulls the sounds stage back which isn’t good IMO. But again you can always fad them out when you are in the car. Although the other person driving the car would probably never notice if the fronts sound good enough.

When you get your sub you can always un-bridge the fronts, and use two channels for a sub or get another amp for the sub.

Disclaimer: I do not know all the specs on your equipment so please check the owner’s manual to see if everything is do-able (i.e. bridging your amp, etc)

 

[maylar 10+ year member]

Why is it a "must" to fuk up the imaging?

Rear speakers - run em off the HU. Never amp them. Don't use components.

Unless the front stage is so weak that you have no choice, in which case the rears will be your primary speakers and nothing is "too good".

 

[MetalMaxima 10+ year member]

Why is it a "must" to fuk up the imaging?
Rear speakers - run em off the HU. Never amp them. Don't use components.

Unless the front stage is so weak that you have no choice, in which case the rears will be your primary speakers and nothing is "too good".

I am assuming that everyone downplays rear fill due to the poor imaging provided by OEM speaker locations. Would adding a quality rear fill have an increased effect if you could change the imaging?

I have a large rear backseat and am considering running a set of midbass or comps using a fiberglass panel down the middle of the rear seats OR mounting a set on top of the rear deck using fiberglass pods to point them out instead of up. Would this not create a noticable change in the rear fill? ...or is this just wishful thinking?

 

[OdieTRP 10+ year member]

Why is it a "must" to fuk up the imaging?

Because it's what she wants, plain and simple. She carries passengers and wants rear speakers. It is not up for debate! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smash.gif.499e08a4a35ffaf54f4c8194fb8fe8ed.gif Were it my system there would be no rear stage.

I understand the theory that the best speakers should be up front for staging, imaging, etc. The Alpine Type X's are rated at 70 RMS (2003 models); bi-amping them would fry the tweet wouldn't it? Even bridging the amp would put at least 150 per ch to them which is way more than they're rated for. I got them new for $150/set and bought two sets. I am trying to prevent spending a lot money and could put the other set in the rear. Why should I spend even $50 for a set of Planet Audio coax's or $100 for Type S 6x9's that will sound like shit when I have a good set of speakers to put back there? It's one heck of a dilemma and paradox, can the rear speakers be too good? The HU is a 9830. If I do put coax's back there, can the 4 channels from the HU be bridged to two and run off the rear RCA's to get 36w per channel?

 

[ANeonRider 10+ year member]

I am bi-amping my Type X comps, just keep the gain down on the tweets or use the attenuation circuitry on the crossover.

 

[themainjam 10+ year member]

well i was running 100W to the type R 5.25 and they handled it just fine.....

i have another question though. in my 4 runner i have 6.5 up front which i am going to put some orion p6.2 and in the rear they have enough room for my 5.25 Type R... i was thinking of setting it up like this..

6.5.........6.5

.....S.....S

5.2.........5.2

.....S.....S

the "S" stand for the seats where people sit. so that would give good imaging and shouldnt interfere with the front because the seats will absorb most of it...

 

[fossil99ca 10+ year member]

I don’t think you can bridge a HU because they are not 2 ohm stable. Don’t forget the amps in the HU are like the size of your thumb. Bridging your amp (I believe) should quadruple your power. Like my JBL amp is 40x4@4ohms, 80x4@2ohms and 160x2 bridged only at 4 ohms. At 2 ohms bridged it would be 320, not recommended. So you’re your HU would be 72 watts bridged, again not recommended.

Rear fill is not a paradox, its personal preference. Try it at 70x4, if you like it, keep it. You always have the fader. If not, just disconnect them.

Yes you are taking more of a risk with 150x2 for them blowing but less for clipping them. Depends how much you push your amp at 70 watts.

 

[bri487 5,000+ posts]

ok, here it goes. "Front stage" comes fromt the fact that live music is played in front of you right? how the music was intended to hear is what audiophiles are constantly trying to reproduce. if you have rear fill it only takes away from your front stage. i hope that is helpful

 

[OdieTRP 10+ year member]

Because it's what she wants, plain and simple. She carries passengers and wants rear speakers. It is not up for debate! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smash.gif.499e08a4a35ffaf54f4c8194fb8fe8ed.gif Were it my system there would be no rear stage.I understand the theory that the best speakers should be up front for staging, imaging, etc.

Why is it so **** difficult to get info without people trying to change the system? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/verymad.gif.3f39c5c2fd57527b671fad3efdfac756.gif READ THE POST! I don't care if you think just having a front stage is the best way to do it; for the last f'ing time I KNOW THAT! Now, this has been a great forum for me to learn and get info. But, to be blunt at the risk of being rude, your opinion on whether or not to have a rear stage is irrelevant, meaningless, a waste of time, useless and furthur more lacks common sense because you can't bother to think critically about the problem at hand! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/furious.gif.fc81ca146dbff91fede3ed290dbc4f4c.gif For those of you willing to help with the problem I can't thank you enough and will be more than happy to share any knowledge I have. For those who need to interject their front stage only opinion, stay the hell out!

 

[themainjam 10+ year member]

ok i would try to put the comps in the door (if 4door)and face the tweeters back. but if you cant do this and are going to run them in the rear deck then a cheap set of coaxials might be a better choice then using the comps.

1. coaxials will be just as good if not better than comps(because comps are for imaging while coaxials play good from off camber surfaces.)

2. comps facing up and tweeters facing forwar will mess up the front stage...

3. you can run coaxials off Hu power without worrying about underpowering them....

 

[themainjam 10+ year member]

P.S. hope i helped //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[OdieTRP 10+ year member]

P.S. hope i helped //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

That is very helpful, thank you! I have two sets of comps but will probably now use only the one in this car. Anyone have a set of decent coax's (6x9 or 6.5) for cheap?

 

[nosaj070 10+ year member]

I have to agree with the topic starter, this did go way off. Look, I see absolutely no problem making a baffle and sticking the tweet and the midrange next to eachother on it. Obviously keep the gain a bit lower than the front so its not completely pulling the stage back. Also it can be turned down quite low, because all the passengers heads are going to be less than a foot from the speaker. I say do it //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif