Lowest RMS rating a Death Penalty can handle

[power-fanatic07 5,000+ posts]

There is no such thing as under powering...that is all.

Then what the hell is it called? I would seriously like to know.

 

[helotaxi 5,000+ posts]

What is what called?

How would you define/describe what you refer to as "under powering?"

 

[helotaxi 5,000+ posts]

I remember us arguing about this before, but I forgot how it ended. What would you call it then, if not "under-powering"? "Less than optimal/capable powering," or some other euphemism that means the same thing?

How would you define "optimal?" I can assure you that it has nothing to do with power rating. I would define it as enough to provide satisfactory output to the user. For example, for myself about 400w is plenty pretty much regardless of the sub.

To quote Nick from Stereo Integrity "Power handling is not power requirement."

 

[power-fanatic07 5,000+ posts]

What is what called?
How would you define/describe what you refer to as "under powering?"

The question mark is actually supposed to go after the quotation mark...but to answer your question.

Lets take the warden for example. Throw it on a clean 400w, its not going to move but 1/8". Now lets use the SSA Dcon for second example, put it on that same power. Having softer suspension and ALOT less powerful motor structure it's going to be driven to its full potential and IMO would sound far better than the warden on the same power. That is my definition of under powering.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

Holy fuck shit. Too much over explanation ITT //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/fyi.gif.9f1f679348da7204ce960cfc74bca8e0.gif

Use common sense. If a sub is rated at 2500w rms, giving 400 watts at is pointless. There are much more efficient measures to use 400w. Use a sub that will make more output out of 400w. Even if it's not "technically" perfect or correct, it'll get the job done a lot better.

 

[Toone 10+ year member]

I think the myth of blowing subs from underpowering came about from people buying cheap amps and turning up the gain/bass boost sending a super dirty signal.

 

[daboyfrumdabx 10+ year member]

I think the myth of blowing subs from underpowering came about from people buying cheap amps and turning up the gain/bass boost sending a super dirty signal.

But the people with the cheap amps had enough power. 5000watt PEAK Pyle FTW. They didn't know they were underpowering.

 

[RidinSwangaz 10+ year member]

I ran a SAZ 3500 on my death penalty for daily man...All you are doing to it is tickling its balls..

 

[helotaxi 5,000+ posts]

The question mark is actually supposed to go after the quotation mark...but to answer your question.

You got me.

Lets take the warden for example. Throw it on a clean 400w, its not going to move but 1/8". Now lets use the SSA Dcon for second example, put it on that same power. Having softer suspension and ALOT less powerful motor structure it's going to be driven to its full potential and IMO would sound far better than the warden on the same power. That is my definition of under powering.

It would probably sound better than a Warden regardless of power, but output level and sound quality are not related. A pure SQ oriented sub would sound better than either and power is irrelevant. A sub that sounds good is going to sound good regardless of how much power is going to it. For people that only care about output then power the hell out of whatever you want but that doesn't mean that it will sound any better and that also doesn't mean that there is any such thing as "under powering."

And the period belongs inside the quotes.

 

[RAM_Designs 5,000+ posts]

How would you define "optimal?" I can assure you that it has nothing to do with power rating. I would define it as enough to provide satisfactory output to the user. For example, for myself about 400w is plenty pretty much regardless of the sub.

99% of people want output, you know that, and I know that. To say that running 400 watts when they're asking about 18" BTL's and trying to hit 150db in a daily box is not underpowering, then what do you want to call it? It will obviously not be "enough to provide satisfactory output to the user." So since it is not fitting that need, and considering that the sub in question can handle much more power than what is being provided, what would you call it in this case?

Your personal preference does not always match up with what everyone else desires, so using an anecdotal example of running something off of half it's RMS and being happy with it is not relevant to the topic. I can use the same example with what I'm running right now, but I'm not.

 

[helotaxi 5,000+ posts]

My point is that you don't have to provide the exact rated power to a sub. Sending 1kW to a sub rated to handle 1.2kW is not "under powering" that sub. Too many people get way too wrapped up in that last 200w. I used an extreme to illustrate my point.

Additionally in the quest to match the power rating of the subs that some people seem to think that they want they invest in some huge amp and then usually fail to account for the electrical support needed for that kind of power and end up spending way more than they needed to. Instead, being more conservative with the power applied instead of getting all wrapped up in this whole "under powering" myth would save them a ton of money and still get way louder than most people can comprehend. 1kW can be supported by most stock electrical systems and can do justice to most subs as well. I seem to recall someone posting 148.x in the 30's on around 1kW.

BTW you do realize that the theoretical max difference between 400 and 3200W is 9dB. The real world difference is going to be much less. You won't win an SPL comp with 400w, no, but you can still, once again, get louder than most people realize.

 

[RAM_Designs 5,000+ posts]

My point is that you don't have to provide the exact rated power to a sub. Sending 1kW to a sub rated to handle 1.2kW is not "under powering" that sub. Too many people get way too wrapped up in that last 200w. I used an extreme to illustrate my point.
Additionally in the quest to match the power rating of the subs that some people seem to think that they want they invest in some huge amp and then usually fail to account for the electrical support needed for that kind of power and end up spending way more than they needed to. Instead, being more conservative with the power applied instead of getting all wrapped up in this whole "under powering" myth would save them a ton of money and still get way louder than most people can comprehend. 1kW can be supported by most stock electrical systems and can do justice to most subs as well. I seem to recall someone posting 148.x in the 30's on around 1kW.

BTW you do realize that the theoretical max difference between 400 and 3200W is 9dB. The real world difference is going to be much less. You won't win an SPL comp with 400w, no, but you can still, once again, get louder than most people realize.

So since it is not fitting that need, and considering that the sub in question can handle much more power than what is being provided, what would you call it in this case?
I take it that you'd call it underpowering in that situation? I'm not arguing that 1kw can't be loud, I'm not saying that you have to match RMS values with subs/amps(the box used and personal preference determine the power needed, but we both know that most people want to push their stuff to the max). You said that underpowering does not exist, and you have yet to answer my hypothetical question that leads to "it's being underpowered for that application" as the answer. Whether or not you chose to use the term or not means nothing; failure to provide enough power in order to get the results that you desire(assuming said sub can handle the power needed) is "underpowering," plain and simple.

 

[BlactimusCrime 10+ year member]

We had nateberrier's BL 18 on 600w at it was still stupid loud in his chevette... the difference between it and 2k wasnt that great.

 

[RAM_Designs 5,000+ posts]

We had nateberrier's BL 18 on 600w at it was still stupid loud in his chevette... the difference between it and 2k wasnt that great.

Did you guys meter it by any chance? I believe I did that box for him.

 

[BlactimusCrime 10+ year member]

you did do that box for him lol, and i helped build it. we didnt meter it on 600, no