if a FI fully loaded is the way to go, then why dont they call come fully loaded...

You need to think about it in a bigger picture, I fully understand what you are saying but you need to have $$ signs in your eyes. Say they do ONLY sell subs fully loaded...business is fine, but....what about those people out there that want to spend 80$ less on a sub and don't need all the extra specs (and yes there are people out there that are like this, its a fact). Well those people go to a different company to buy a sub, thus FI looses potential business. SO the solution is make a sub that is not fully loaded, thus creating more business, aka more $$$$$$$$$$$.

People's first tenancy is to find the lowest price for what they need, and that is what this is all about. Sure they can sell subs that are only fully loaded, but they would make MORE money by offering a sub that comes NOT fully loaded. And everyone, and yes I mean everyone would like to have more money.

So to sum this up, it's all about the Benjamins baby //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/cool.gif.3bcaf8f141236c00f8044d07150e34f7.gif

 
for example a DD 3500 series WOULD get louder than a 9500 series on 2000 watts? So for example id assume believe it or not (im not an FI dealer and have not mastered the brand); that the BL would get louder on 2000 watts than a unloaded BTL simply because the motor is so massive that it takes 2500+ watts for it to meet the effieciency to "catch up".
Not even close to the truth. It's a common misconception that a lot of idiots claim. "x sub needs y watts to get it moving". That's total bs and people who say it do not know what they are talking about. My 2 DD 9515's in a street box with the same power beat 4 dd 3518's in a street box. Efficiency is only going to vary with frequency.... not increase as power is applied. If you want to get technical, as more power is applied and the coil travels out of the gap, the speaker loses efficiency.... so no matter which way you look at it you're DEAD WRONG.

 
Your not understanding what im saying, why not just offer another series?!?!?! This sub for this power, this sub for this. Do you realize that for example a DD 3500 series WOULD get louder than a 9500 series on 2000 watts? So for example id assume believe it or not (im not an FI dealer and have not mastered the brand); that the BL would get louder on 2000 watts than a unloaded BTL simply because the motor is so massive that it takes 2500+ watts for it to meet the effieciency to "catch up".
Forget 60 pound woofers that need 3500+ watts to reach maximum efficiency when the thermal handling cant even handle it for an extended period of time (15 minutes full tilt).
With all the options available, and multiplying that time the number of models they have, it would mean a lot more models. I suspect this would actually end up being more confusing than simply offering different options for each model.

 
Not even close to the truth. It's a common misconception that a lot of idiots claim. "x sub needs y watts to get it moving". That's total bs and people who say it do not know what they are talking about. My 2 DD 9515's in a street box with the same power beat 4 dd 3518's in a street box. Efficiency is only going to vary with frequency.... not increase as power is applied. If you want to get technical, as more power is applied and the coil travels out of the gap, the speaker loses efficiency.... so no matter which way you look at it you're DEAD WRONG.
Really? Then why does your 9500s efficiency **** at 1000 watts vs a 2500 series? You misunderstand efficiency. Excursion only matters to a certain point, YOUR woofer gives about 70% of its power in its first 1"-1.5" of excursion and then can give the other 30% at 2.5"-3" excursion, however at that point your just causing alot of strain on the suspension.

Ill mention my 9515G beat 4 l7 15" on the mic, however in person on music its a whole different ball game... I highly doubt you beat 4 3518s if they were in a box built to even their minimum required specs on the same power... Im calling BS.

I stay off the forum for a year and half and come back to jailbirds running the jailhouse... This is messed up.

 
eh yea audioholic, i was just saying they should only offer the current series fully loaded. If you cant afford that series, go the next under. Not have a chopped down version. These people are just going nuts.

 
Really? Then why does your 9500s efficiency **** at 1000 watts vs a 2500 series? You misunderstand efficiency. Excursion only matters to a certain point, YOUR woofer gives about 70% of its power in its first 1"-1.5" of excursion and then can give the other 30% at 2.5"-3" excursion, however at that point your just causing alot of strain on the suspension.
Ill mention my 9515G beat 4 l7 15" on the mic, however in person on music its a whole different ball game... I highly doubt you beat 4 3518s if they were in a box built to even their minimum required specs on the same power... Im calling BS.

I stay off the forum for a year and half and come back to jailbirds running the jailhouse... This is messed up.
It doesn't **** at 1000 watts. You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. That's why I was able to beat the 4 3518's on the same power.

I'm not misunderstanding efficiency. You are. You made the claim that 2 subwoofers with the same soft parts (DD 3500 and 9500 series) but with different motors that the one with the stronger motor is less efficient than the weaker one. It is not true no matter how you word it.

Bottom line is more power applied results in more excursion. You have a self-defeating argument and you're not smart enough to know you're had and you're too narcissistic to admit it even if you were smart enough.

 
LOL call DD and ask them whats more efficient with 1000 watts and would get louder, a 3500 or 9500. Eat your words. Even pete at hexibase has said that he would use a 2500 series over any other including the 9500 if 1000 watts was being used. Again letme guess it was a meter and the 4 18s were alot louder in person... Also i have no idea what this "street box" is... I doubt the 4 18s had the minimum of 24cubes required and your 2 15s had 10cubes.

 
I don't know why the OP is so hard headed. As much as you don't want to relate speakers to cars in terms of fully loaded or not they are relative. How many 5 series bmw's are there? why not just the M5? Is the M3 not faster than all the 5 series except the M5? So if you can't afford a M5 i guess just get a M3? Why have anything in between right? So why can't FI(and they're not the only ones doing this fyi) have different options for their speakers. I wouldn't put 2500 watts into a FI BL but i could put that in a BTL that's not fully loaded. Even if you're in the top 10% qualified for posters here, does that mean you can't ask dumb questions?. You ask a question(which was stupid but people were still willing to give you their insight) and because someone told you it's a stupid question you got all defensive and insulted the guy, grow up. If you really need to come here and posts a question like that without thinking logically than yes, it's a stupid question. Does everyone have to break down how many watts each series can handle with what options and why you would jump up in series for you to understand why FI subwoofers have different options or are you intelligent enough to figure that out for yourself. Maybe you should have done that before making this thread.

 
LOL call DD and ask them whats more efficient with 1000 watts and would get louder, a 3500 or 9500. Eat your words. Even pete at hexibase has said that he would use a 2500 series over any other including the 9500 if 1000 watts was being used. Again letme guess it was a meter and the 4 18s were alot louder in person... Also i have no idea what this "street box" is... I doubt the 4 18s had the minimum of 24cubes required and your 2 15s had 10cubes.
Actually, he had 26 cubes in the back of a plymouth voyager. The fact that you do not understand what a street box is shows your lack of knowledge. Also no they sounded pretty similar since there was 1 db difference. What does "in person" even mean?

I talk to DD on a regular basis. The 9500 is their most efficient Ferrite based motor. Everyone... but you apparently knows that. YOU call them and ask. The only reason they might tell you to get a sub with a lower power rating vs it, is because they know you're an idiot and would crank your gains because you couldn't make it bottom out. They have the same soft parts... what about that don't you get? Seriously call DD and ask them.

 
Your not understanding what im saying, why not just offer another series?!?!?! This sub for this power, this sub for this. Do you realize that for example a DD 3500 series WOULD get louder than a 9500 series on 2000 watts? So for example id assume believe it or not (im not an FI dealer and have not mastered the brand); that the BL would get louder on 2000 watts than a unloaded BTL simply because the motor is so massive that it takes 2500+ watts for it to meet the effieciency to "catch up".
Forget 60 pound woofers that need 3500+ watts to reach maximum efficiency when the thermal handling cant even handle it for an extended period of time (15 minutes full tilt).
You just proved you are a moron.

It doesn't take the BTL motor 2500W to start moving because of the motor, but because of the spiders. A stronger motor will ALWAYS be more efficient than a weaker one with the same soft parts, but when you put stiffer soft parts on a stronger woofer (which is required to prevent the speaker from ripping itself to pieces) it makes it much less efficient.

So yes, that explains why a 3500 will be louder than a 9500 on lower power levels; because the suspension is much stiffer on a 9500, and it requires more power to move the suspension.

You'd probably know this if you actually did own your own shop as you claim.

 
Also, anyone can have a vehicle with four 18's or own their own shop. All that takes is MONEY, not SKILL. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/fyi.gif.9f1f679348da7204ce960cfc74bca8e0.gif

I'd be more impressed if you told me you did 150+ out of a trunk with two 12's. Anyone can put four 18's in an SUV and do 50's on the meter. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif

 
cdimic25-Ok so you are a dealer and love DD. We got that, its in any thread you jump in. I agree DD makes one of the best subs on the market period. From what I have seen from you, you put down almost any brand that is not DD. Here you are doing it again with a different twist.

Fi makes some of the best subs on the market as well. Who cares how they market their subs. DD does the same thing. You know as well as I do that DD has many options that can be done to their subs. So why does DD not just offer all that up at the same price. Why should I have to pay to upgrade parts on a DD?

Every company needs to make money and DD, Fi ect. all offer upgrades. Some are on their website some are a phone call. Either way they both can and do the same thing.

Don't get it twisted I like me some DD and have helped build a vehicle for one of the guys on their team here local in OK. Vehicle did great and the DD product was excellent. It is one of the brands I tell people to take a look at often before buying something.

Give it a rest though as it is not all about how DD does stuff. If everyone was just a like we would only need a couple brands but this would make for higher prices and that is why we have options.

 
cdimic25-Ok so you are a dealer and love DD. We got that, its in any thread you jump in. I agree DD makes one of the best subs on the market period. From what I have seen from you, you put down almost any brand that is not DD. Here you are doing it again with a different twist.
Fi makes some of the best subs on the market as well. Who cares how they market their subs. DD does the same thing. You know as well as I do that DD has many options that can be done to their subs. So why does DD not just offer all that up at the same price. Why should I have to pay to upgrade parts on a DD?

Every company needs to make money and DD, Fi ect. all offer upgrades. Some are on their website some are a phone call. Either way they both can and do the same thing.

Don't get it twisted I like me some DD and have helped build a vehicle for one of the guys on their team here local in OK. Vehicle did great and the DD product was excellent. It is one of the brands I tell people to take a look at often before buying something.

Give it a rest though as it is not all about how DD does stuff. If everyone was just a like we would only need a couple brands but this would make for higher prices and that is why we have options.
Yeah, at least Fi's upgrades have a purpose, instead of just charging $400 for a carbon cap and cone //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/confused.gif.e820e0216602db4765798ac39d28caa9.gif

 
Yeah, at least Fi's upgrades have a purpose, instead of just charging $400 for a carbon cap and cone //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/confused.gif.e820e0216602db4765798ac39d28caa9.gif
It's really more like $200.00 but yeah... it's pricey. Even though it's real carbon fiber and dyed certain colors it still is overpriced.

 
Your not understanding what im saying, why not just offer another series?!?!?! This sub for this power, this sub for this. Do you realize that for example a DD 3500 series WOULD get louder than a 9500 series on 2000 watts? So for example id assume believe it or not (im not an FI dealer and have not mastered the brand); that the BL would get louder on 2000 watts than a unloaded BTL simply because the motor is so massive that it takes 2500+ watts for it to meet the effieciency to "catch up".
Forget 60 pound woofers that need 3500+ watts to reach maximum efficiency when the thermal handling cant even handle it for an extended period of time (15 minutes full tilt).
You are incorrect in assuming that a lower level sub will perform better on lesser power levels. Most, if not all, street class guys run 9500 series because they are stronger and more efficient with the same power. A good friend of mine has a street b CRX and swapped out his 9510's for 3510's and lost over a dB. The same goes for a couple street A guys I know.

I can even tell you for a fact that my 9512 has smoked EVERYTHING on EVERY power level from 400 watts to 4000. Subs on that list include an HD3, Fi BL, and a Fi Q.

You are making very general assumptions.

As for the motor thing, I think that's been covered fairly well. Options are there for what the driver is going to be used for. SPL guys want a tighter gap so they will not get the cooling or other options because it makes the motor weaker. Daily driver guys want the cooling because they plan on beating on their subs for extended periods of time. You have to give people options so they can custom tailor the sub to their install.

A fully loaded sub is NOT always the way to go.

 
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