High efficiency sub suggestion

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

single Powerbass 2XL 15D @2 ohm, 4^3@35hz/550w input

Two DCON 12 S4's @2ohm, 4^3 @ 35hz/ 550w input

single DCON S4 @4ohm, 4^3 @35hz/ 400w input

single ICON 15 D1 @ 2ohm, 4^3 @ 35hz/ 550w input

I threw in a ICON 15D1 1250w rms sub in the same environment just for funsies...there is always a trade-off to allow for being able to run 1200 watts through a sub to begin with..lol

That's not one of the accurate parts of winisd //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/fyi.gif.9f1f679348da7204ce960cfc74bca8e0.gif

The curves are alright, but the peaks can't be directly compared to each other.

 

[quackhead 10+ year member]

I know..your response is the reason I hardly ever show that...but it does put things in perspective. do you think I should have showed the gain curve instead?

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

Not really. Some woofers don't mock up like they sound in winisd, and some graphs are skewed for multiple reasons, so a direct comparison like that is inaccurate period. The only comparison you can make is the difference between box sizes and tuning with the same woofer just to see the differences.

 

[quackhead 10+ year member]

Not really. Some woofers don't mock up like they sound in winisd, and some graphs are skewed for multiple reasons, so a direct comparison like that is inaccurate period. The only comparison you can make is the difference between box sizes and tuning with the same woofer just to see the differences.

I totally agree, like the DCON 15 has Fs of 33hz, thus drops like a rock on the graph, the PB needs 5^3 to really shine, the ICON 15 needs alot more juice and another cube or so...the 2 DCON 12's look pretty nice in that environment...i was just throwing a fair comparison out there on paper..it wasn't meant to be a set in stone graph...and we are not even considering real world performance, thus this is the only way to mock up different type of sub's performance in the same environment with available given specs

 

[The_Grimy_One 10+ year member]

iDMax, hands down. If that hasnt been said yet.

 

[quackhead 10+ year member]

here is the gain graph for the same subs and environment posted above.

as far as skewed data, are you suggesting the SSA website may be inaccurate?..i don't know but it would ****, if that were the case

..btw here is my input data that came in the boxes with my drivers:

Powerbass 2XL-15D

VC Impedance (ohms) 4Ω + 4Ω

Test Impedance (ohms) 1.6

Fs (Hz) 24

SD (sqCM) 829.58

Vas (Ltr) 212.81

Cms (M/N) 217.76

Mms (g) 202.02

BL ™ 10.22

Qms 10.771

Qes 0.466

Qts 0.447

No (%) 0.6

Spl (dB) 93

Xmax (mm) 14

Voice Coil Size (inches) 2.5"

Frequency Response Hz.) 23 - 400 Hz

Motor Structure (ounces) 302 oz.

Mounting Depth (inches) 8.6"

Power (Pe-RMS) 500 watts

Power (Pe-Maximum) 1,000 watts

 

[quackhead 10+ year member]

iDMax, hands down. If that hasnt been said yet.

Amen!...if the OP had at least a 1000 to 1500 watts to nail one with...but, we are trying to find something that is going to optimally utilize 400 to 600, depending on wiring

 

[oldschoolboomer 10+ year member]

iDMax, hands down. If that hasnt been said yet.

Great suggestion

 

[oldschoolboomer 10+ year member]

Amen!...if the OP had at least a 1000 to 1500 watts to nail one with...but, we are trying to find something that is going to optimally utilize 400 to 600, depending on wiring

The idmax has 1w/1meter ground plane sensitivity of 94.6 dB from 50-100 Hz.

 

[quackhead 10+ year member]

The idmax has 1w/1meter ground plane sensitivity of 94.6 dB from 50-100 Hz.

good point, and it does claim a lighter moving mass....It would be nice to have the theale small info on that one and run it in it's recommended enclosure size of 2 - 2.5^3..or maybe 2 in the enclosure modeled earlier 4^3 @ 35hz....and get a general idea what you are looking at compared to those 2 DCON 12's...I wonder if other manufacturers use the advantage of measuring at ground plane with their #s?? now that is the question..at free air resonance is one thing...but at ground plane you will automatically gain a couple deebeez.

 

[Buck 5,000+ posts]

here is the gain graph for the same subs and environment posted above.as far as skewed data, are you suggesting the SSA website may be inaccurate?..i don't know but it would ****, if that were the case

..btw here is my input data that came in the boxes with my drivers:

I mean winisd will skew it, and you'd be surprised at how inaccurate some t/s parameters are. I have no idea if ssa's are on or off, but I would be on. I was more referring to the program though.

 

[oldschoolboomer 10+ year member]

good point, and it does claim a lighter moving mass....It would be nice to have the theale small info on that one and run it in it's recommended enclosure size of 2 - 2.5^3..or maybe 2 in the enclosure modeled earlier 4^3 @ 35hz....and get a general idea what you are looking at compared to those 2 DCON 12's...I wonder if other manufacturers use the advantage of measuring at ground plane with their #s?? now that is the question..at free air resonance is one thing...but at ground plane you will automatically gain a couple deebeez.

Don't most manufacturers in fact measure their subwoofers' sensitivity at 1000 Hz to boost the numbers?

 

[quackhead 10+ year member]

yeah, I see your point....what program would do you recommend ....I like Hornresp, but it is definately designed to build horn loaded cabs, I don't care for the bass reflex 2 Pi aspects of it...or I just ain't holding my mouth right..i dunno. But still it is a fair comparison based on the fact that none of the subs I modeled were from the standard database, they were loaded manually....and yes, checked and double checked, so it is still a fair comparison....or I am just too hardheaded to understand the extent of the skew you are talking about, cause I really don't want to argue with you, seeing how you build boxes for a living...I would like to know why you say that for my own future reference.

 

[quackhead 10+ year member]

Don't most manufacturers in fact measure their subwoofers' sensitivity at 1000 Hz to boost the numbers?

It does appear to be a common standard among manufacturers...like I said, do other Manufacturers use "ground plane" to further boost those numbers?, Like with ID, you take a sub with 88.4 db sens from 1w/1m @ 1k and put it at ground plane and report it produced a +6 db gain from 50 - 100hz...that would be my expected result, allowing for the loading effect of being at ground plane to begin with.

 

[The_Grimy_One 10+ year member]

Amen!...if the OP had at least a 1000 to 1500 watts to nail one with...but, we are trying to find something that is going to optimally utilize 400 to 600, depending on wiring

If u put 1500 on an iDMax it will die very quickly. It will get louder than most subs listed on only 500-700 watts. I ran one sealed and it got rather loud.