edead or fatmat?

And it was also the first deadener I ever used.
Mine too. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif That's what I was lead to believe, anyway.

But, as it turns out......it's not "deadener." //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif

Biggest problem with these threads: no one defines the word "deadener." Without that, anything counts, really. So, on and on and on we go....weeeeeee..................

 
my head is not up anybodies ***, if i buy a product and if it works and never lets me down, i am standing by it 100%.
That's right. Again no matter how many times you've been shown proof that many people were not so lucky as you with their eDead, no matter how many times Ben will be caught lying, exaggerating, stealing... you will back his play because YOU had a good experience. Just like how we have established before that you dont care if eD steals patented technology off competitor's products, so long as YOU get a cheap price from them on it.

also what makes you think rammat and SS never changed theirs? just because they dont say anything does not mean it never happened
Yes you are right, just because we've not heard of them changing, we should still assume that they do... because they were caught using inferior materials/products just like eD, right? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif
Actually iirc raammat has changed from asphalt to butyl in the past few years. Difference was, they did it without lying to their customers along the way and claiming they always had butyl based mat.

 
That's right. Again no matter how many times you've been shown proof that many people were not so lucky as you with their eDead, no matter how many times Ben will be caught lying, exaggerating, stealing... you will back his play because YOU had a good experience. Just like how we have established before that you dont care if eD steals patented technology off competitor's products, so long as YOU get a cheap price from them on it.

Yes you are right, just because we've not heard of them changing, we should still assume that they do... because they were caught using inferior materials/products just like eD, right? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif

Actually iirc raammat has changed from asphalt to butyl in the past few years. Difference was, they did it without lying to their customers along the way and claiming they always had butyl based mat.
Stop yelling at me //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crying.gif.ec0ebefe590df0251476573bc49e46d8.gif:crying:

 
ike_where_this_thread_is_going-vi.jpg
 
Haha I knew it was only a matter of time before Ant joined in //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

I'm telling you, Damplifier Pro FTMFW! Squabble over your inferior products all you like //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

 
I guess it just comes down to install? I have been through all the seasons now with my fatmat in my car and holding up fine. IMO is hard to beat for the price and I haven't doubled up anywhere and seems to be doing just as good as the SS I have in my trunk and the fatmat is verticle in my doors.

Once this summer comes, will get more to finish the back doors and maybe the floors as that is all I have left.

 
I guess it just comes down to install? I have been through all the seasons now with my fatmat in my car and holding up fine. IMO is hard to beat for the price and I haven't doubled up anywhere and seems to be doing just as good as the SS I have in my trunk and the fatmat is verticle in my doors.
Once this summer comes, will get more to finish the back doors and maybe the floors as that is all I have left.
Installation procedure determines whether or not it lasts for a week. Luck and conditions determine how long it will last after that. Nothing compensates for its poor performance - it's just wishful thinking that has you believing it is performing as well as the Second Skin in your trunk. Here's what comparable ALF results look like for FatMat vs Dynamat Xtreme at 200 and 400Hz at 74°F:

FM 0.03 0.0349

DX 0.341 0.414

1.0 is a theoretically (but unattainable) perfect result. Dynamat Xtreme is an order of magnitude better than FatMat. Since there isn't a linear relationship between layers applied and performance, it isn't as simple as saying that it will take 10 layers of FatMat to equal the performance of 1 layer of Dynamat Xtreme (or Damplifier, V-Max, etc), but in my crude testing, 6 times as much FatMat still hadn't reached the damping performance of Dynamat Xtreme - it had just lowered the RF of the test panel to the point where I couldn't compare them with any confidence.

Since using that much more of an asphalt material negates any cost savings, the question of durability really doesn't matter any more. Some people will continue to insist that cost/ft² is the only relevant metric and choose asphalt. I'd urge them to search the boards for posts by Jacob from Sundown on the topic. He used to believe that asphalt could be installed reliably. His procedure involved carefully sized pieces of mat, heat and sealing the seams with aluminum tape. He has had multiple failures since then and now warns against using asphalt. Shon at ROE has reported similar results.

There was a time when using asphalt for sound deadening seemed like a reasonable choice. It was better than nothing in terms of vibration damping and many people were willing to risk the reliability questions. That time has long since passed. We have a much better understanding of why and how asphalt products fail in a car. We also know that asphalt is such a poor vibration damper that the perception of value is just wrong. The best way to save money is to use less of a quality butyl/aluminum foil product. If you planned to spend $100 on asphalt, instead buy $100 of a decent vibration damper and spread it out in a checkerboard pattern. It will take less work, add less weight, incur none of the risk, cost the same and outperform the "cheaper" solution.

One factor has confused people about the performance of asphalt. In those situations where applying a mat eliminates rattles by immobilizing adjacent panels instead of damping vibrations, asphalt will work as well as buyl/aluminum foil, as would a piece of duct tape, a 10 cent shot of silicone or even a piece of chewing gum.

You can't conclude anything about performance by comparing the FatMat in your doors and the SS in your trunk. To make a real comparison, you'd have to treat equivalent areas of the car and compare. Even then, it is tough to make a judgment in such a complex environment. Much better to do your testing outside the car, where you can control as many variables as possible. Anything else is anecdotal and really shouldn't be used as the basis for choosing or recommending.

 
You can't conclude anything about performance by comparing the FatMat in your doors and the SS in your trunk. To make a real comparison, you'd have to treat equivalent areas of the car and compare. Even then, it is tough to make a judgment in such a complex environment. Much better to do your testing outside the car, where you can control as many variables as possible. Anything else is anecdotal and really shouldn't be used as the basis for choosing or recommending.
A very good point that I hope everyone reads and considers.

 
In those situations where applying a mat eliminates rattles by immobilizing adjacent panels instead of damping vibrations, asphalt will work as well as buyl/aluminum foil, as would a piece of duct tape, a 10 cent shot of silicone or even a piece of chewing gum.
Ever try this stuff? http://www.hardwarestore.com/pop-print/larger-image.aspx?prodNo=40435

Works great as decoupler. Silicone is kind of wimpy sometimes, for me.

 
I am gaining quite a lot of useful insight //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

Installation procedure determines whether or not it lasts for a week. Luck and conditions determine how long it will last after that. Nothing compensates for its poor performance - it's just wishful thinking that has you believing it is performing as well as the Second Skin in your trunk. Here's what comparable ALF results look like for FatMat vs Dynamat Xtreme at 200 and 400Hz at 74°F:
FM 0.03 0.0349

DX 0.341 0.414

1.0 is a theoretically (but unattainable) perfect result. Dynamat Xtreme is an order of magnitude better than FatMat. Since there isn't a linear relationship between layers applied and performance, it isn't as simple as saying that it will take 10 layers of FatMat to equal the performance of 1 layer of Dynamat Xtreme (or Damplifier, V-Max, etc), but in my crude testing, 6 times as much FatMat still hadn't reached the damping performance of Dynamat Xtreme - it had just lowered the RF of the test panel to the point where I couldn't compare them with any confidence.

Since using that much more of an asphalt material negates any cost savings, the question of durability really doesn't matter any more. Some people will continue to insist that cost/ft² is the only relevant metric and choose asphalt. I'd urge them to search the boards for posts by Jacob from Sundown on the topic. He used to believe that asphalt could be installed reliably. His procedure involved carefully sized pieces of mat, heat and sealing the seams with aluminum tape. He has had multiple failures since then and now warns against using asphalt. Shon at ROE has reported similar results.

There was a time when using asphalt for sound deadening seemed like a reasonable choice. It was better than nothing in terms of vibration damping and many people were willing to risk the reliability questions. That time has long since passed. We have a much better understanding of why and how asphalt products fail in a car. We also know that asphalt is such a poor vibration damper that the perception of value is just wrong. The best way to save money is to use less of a quality butyl/aluminum foil product. If you planned to spend $100 on asphalt, instead buy $100 of a decent vibration damper and spread it out in a checkerboard pattern. It will take less work, add less weight, incur none of the risk, cost the same and outperform the "cheaper" solution.

One factor has confused people about the performance of asphalt. In those situations where applying a mat eliminates rattles by immobilizing adjacent panels instead of damping vibrations, asphalt will work as well as buyl/aluminum foil, as would a piece of duct tape, a 10 cent shot of silicone or even a piece of chewing gum.

You can't conclude anything about performance by comparing the FatMat in your doors and the SS in your trunk. To make a real comparison, you'd have to treat equivalent areas of the car and compare. Even then, it is tough to make a judgment in such a complex environment. Much better to do your testing outside the car, where you can control as many variables as possible. Anything else is anecdotal and really shouldn't be used as the basis for choosing or recommending.
Got too technical for me lol. Bud good point.

*** At any matter, I have used Dynamat Xtreme in my trunk and it did a fairly good job. ANybody care to comment of Dynamat Xtreme vs RAMAT, Second Skin, Fatmat etc....

 
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