EDead deadening = good price

[theothermike 10+ year member]

i concur and i also say that Ant is one of the most respectable guys in this buisness along with Rick, each are remarkable and offer amazing service with answering ?'s and i love seeing how u two market for the other when u both no what the buyer is looking for based on different needs. Without a doubt if i were a grown man with a steady income id buy some second skin but i bought raammat based on its budget and a 16 yr old being broke =]. both great companies both great products but in this situation when cost is concern raammat ur best option imo.

I still applaud u Ant for ur character.

 

[Rudy 10+ year member]

I really thought the old asphalt mat had some butyl in it, are you sure it didn't Don? Im confident that was an excuse used by Ben... at least one of the excuses... that their mat had slightly more butyl in it than 'standard' asphalt mat, hence he made the butyl claims.

I can't swear that there wasn't a single drop of butyl in the old eDead/Peel & Seal asphalt. It certainly would be tough to prove that the drop isn't there. It's sort of like getting a sandwich made with 100 grams of shit and 1 gram of turkey. I wouldn't call it a turkey sandwich myself, but apparently ED and their supporters might.

At the same time, both of the old eDead versions were listed on the ED Web site with inflated specs - not just a tiny bit here or there, but 25% across the board. Interestingly enough, the inflated weights lined up perfectly with competing products. These weren't random errors. I e-mailed ED and asked them to correct the numbers. When I got no response, I started publicizing the real specs any time a thread mentioned eDead. Finally, in this bit of insanity, Mandos entered the discussion to explain that he was to blame because he had weighed the products, on the cardboard core, in the box, on a broken bathroom scale. Despite this being a really poor explanation for how these bad results magically came out as even numbers that exactly matched other products on the market, ED supporters not only accepted this incompetent instead of crooked defense, but attacked me for bring the issue up in the first place. I seriously doubt that these people would be as forgiving if they discovered that their gas station was charging for a gallon and only delivering 3.2 quarts.

Here's the real issue as far as I'm concerned. There are plenty of companies out there that really care about sound deadening. They do the research and quality control needed to deliver effective and reliable products. If something goes wrong, they don't blame the customer or some amateur tester (me) for bad results.

Then there are the companies that have repeatedly demonstrated that they either don't care what they are selling or have no idea what makes a decent sound deadener. They claim user error and irrational hatred at the drop of a hat. These companies suggest that since their products are a few pennies cheaper per square foot, that they are better values. Turns out that when you evaluate performance, they may be cheaper per unit of area, but when you look at how much it costs to achieve a comparable level of deadening, they might even cost more.

It's an easy choice. Deal with the companies that have proven themselves. Save money and get better results.

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

Dynamat Extreme, Damplifier Pro and Cascade V-Max > than all other deadeners.

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

I can't swear that there wasn't a single drop of butyl in the old eDead/Peel & Seal asphalt. It certainly would be tough to prove that the drop isn't there. It's sort of like getting a sandwich made with 100 grams of shit and 1 gram of turkey. I wouldn't call it a turkey sandwich myself, but apparently ED and their supporters might.

If you remember correctly Don. I was around for this fiasco... you and I spoke several times via PM's about the situation. Very enlightening I might add.
Ive looked for Ben's specific claims of having butyl rubber in his asphalt based mat, here's what I found...

"eDead is butyl with asphalt. That's totally correct. However guys in this thread remember some things. Specifically with eDead. eDead was always built on a value base.

 

Butyl is more expensive. That's a reason why TRUE butyl mats are more expensive. It costs more. Materials do. That's all there is to it. While we can use it in eDead to a degree to have certain advantages here or there to change it completely would mean doubling the price."

- http://www.caraudioforum.com/vbb3/showthread.php?t=229139&page=5&pp=15

I also found where you mentioned them lying about having butyl in their mat - "

I am saying that claiming high heat resistance is deceptive. I am saying that only mentioning the rubber content and not the asphalt content is deceptive.

I am saying that the current versions of eDead contain butyl is a lie.

Im unable to find Ben's words claiming it specifically (beyond the very deceptive comments from him I quoted above that heavily imply it), but you can see what I DID find. Clearly, this tactic worked, people were confused if it had butyl or not. I remember reading their website with my own eyes and seeing edead V1 claimed to be 'rubberized mat'... in a time when butyl rubber mat was taking over the idustry and leaving asphalt mat in the dust, the deceptive implication of the words 'rubberized mat' were clear... they were claiming it at least had butyl in it. This initial confusion on my part is what lead me to seek you out, and learn the truth.

Looks like the closest Ben ever came to admitting the truth was stating "eDead is butyl with asphalt", which of course is deceptive AT BEST. I guess I was wrong, on second thought, ben never considered Edead to be a aspahlt mat with some butyl rubber in it... he considered it a butyl rubber mat with some asphalt in it. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

And lastly, you gotta love a company that gets out of looking like crooks by making themselves out as incompetent. Amazingly, its working pretty well for the eD crew. Im simply stunned every time I see people making excuses for buying junk from these sleaze bags.

 

[na_rsx 10+ year member]

edead se2, with the forum discount, 80 something shipped for 60 sq ft. i just got my order, plan on deadening the doors and hatch with that, then paint over it with v3.

 

[jblayz1 10+ year member]

i just did my trunk with SS Spectrum over the weekend. great stuff!!!! got some leftover to do the inner panels and the headliner if i'm not lazy. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif

 

[Rudy 10+ year member]

If you remember correctly Don. I was around for this fiasco... you and I spoke several times via PM's about the situation. Very enlightening I might add.
Ive looked for Ben's specific claims of having butyl rubber in his asphalt based mat, here's what I found...

"eDead is butyl with asphalt. That's totally correct. However guys in this thread remember some things. Specifically with eDead. eDead was always built on a value base.

 

Butyl is more expensive. That's a reason why TRUE butyl mats are more expensive. It costs more. Materials do. That's all there is to it. While we can use it in eDead to a degree to have certain advantages here or there to change it completely would mean doubling the price."

- http://www.caraudioforum.com/vbb3/showthread.php?t=229139&page=5&pp=15

I also found where you mentioned them lying about having butyl in their mat - "

Im unable to find Ben's words claiming it specifically (beyond the very deceptive comments from him I quoted above that heavily imply it), but you can see what I DID find. Clearly, this tactic worked, people were confused if it had butyl or not. I remember reading their website with my own eyes and seeing edead V1 claimed to be 'rubberized mat'... in a time when butyl rubber mat was taking over the idustry and leaving asphalt mat in the dust, the deceptive implication of the words 'rubberized mat' were clear... they were claiming it at least had butyl in it. This initial confusion on my part is what lead me to seek you out, and learn the truth.

Looks like the closest Ben ever came to admitting the truth was stating "eDead is butyl with asphalt", which of course is deceptive AT BEST. I guess I was wrong, on second thought, ben never considered Edead to be a aspahlt mat with some butyl rubber in it... he considered it a butyl rubber mat with some asphalt in it. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif

I do remember our correspondence - that thread on CAF was quite an education. What shocked me more than anything else was how much ED's supporters were willing to excuse. The Ben Milne quotes you referred to are in my bookmarks folder called ED lies about eDead. Unfortunately there are 10 other links in there as well.

I agree that the ED Web site's descriptions of eDead were extremely misleading. Here you can see the "rubber impregnated mass layer" phrase:

Here they touted the benefits of an aluminum facing (Hmm) and talk about "Extremely High Temperature Adhesive":

One of the things that distinguishes asphalt from butyl is heat tolerance. Claiming high heat tolerance for an asphalt product is absolutely deceptive. What they certainly aren't saying is that their product was indistinguishable from Peel & Seal. Looked and felt the same. Somehow Peel & Seal had slightly better heat tolerance and adhesion, but you get the point //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[Rudy 10+ year member]

edead se2, with the forum discount, 80 something shipped for 60 sq ft. i just got my order, plan on deadening the doors and hatch with that, then paint over it with v3.

Unlike the v1², nobody that I've heard about has had the v1SE² fall off. I'd be reluctant to paint over it with any water based liquid since the surface is plastic and liquids have a hell of a time sticking to plastic.

 

[DejaWiz 5,000+ posts]

A couple weeks late, but good choice on the BXT, joshs98!

Don and audioholic....

Thanks for taking the time to post the information and links proving, once again, that eD thrives on misinforming and misdirecting the consumer populace. I hope many will learn from your findings.

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

Don, thanks for providing pics of eD's old website. I love it, a walk down memory lane. My favorite part:

"The core layer of eDead uses integrated rubber combination for increased temperature resistance and reliability."

Seems like a fairly innocent claim, albeit marketing hyped and having poor grammar. It fit especially well into what people were looking for in a mat for the time, considering it was just when butyl rubber mat was hitting the market strong (generally called 'rubber mat' back then) and there was still alot of voodoo surrounding it. But when you look back at it now and realize that statement, made by Ben and eD, was for an aspahlt based product almost identical to peel n seal, the absolute bottom of the barrel product imo... its boderline criminal false advertising imo. Criminal.

And now this same crook makes video's with claims like "this subwoofer is THE LAST SQ woofer made... [dramatic pause]... on the market today" and people still lap it up like dogs.

edit: I just wish I could find Ben's statement where he justified the 'rubberized' claims by stating he'd increased the rubber binding agent by like 5%. I know he said it, I just dont remember where anymore.

 

[Rudy 10+ year member]

.. video's with claims like "this subwoofer is THE LAST SQ woofer made... [dramatic pause]... on the market today" and people still lap it up like dogs.

I love that video. Everybody should watch it. Dozens of classic lines that will rip your guts out.

 

[newusername 10+ year member]

The last true SQ subwoofer....yup, definitely from eD. Nothing like a standard overhung driver that is virtually identical to 1000 other designs.

But honestly, eD thrives on this stuff. It draws attention to their brand. They make no bones about how controversial they are....in fact, they use it as a lure in some of their ads.

 

[DejaWiz 5,000+ posts]

I just got done reading through this thread over at CAF and holy sh!t, eD. Holy sh!t...

 

[Rudy 10+ year member]

I just got done reading through this thread over at CAF and holy sh!t, eD. Holy sh!t...

Yeah, I really lost my head in that one - it was my first experience with ED love. I accused them of being a cult //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif Not my proudest moment.