cheater amps? you tell me....

[dreamer33917 10+ year member]

Hmmm this is new to me. However I do think it's cheating. Where's the reward in that? Even though I hate the saving up part, but once u get it, it's worth it. I mean I saved up for a whole to get my sundown. it's like paying dues.

how is it cheating if your not competing ? is it cheating to add a turbo to a car to make it faster ?

 

[dreamer33917 10+ year member]

That makes no sense. Instead of modding one why just save up the cash and buy one that's built that way. Why tear up a amp and void your warrenty? Stupid.

what if the warranty is up and you find out that your 1500 watt amp has the same wiring, mother board etc as the 4000 watt amp 2 series above yours the only thing different is the power supply and larger case why spend all that money on the 4000 watt amp when you can just change power supply's for 1/3 or maybe a 1/4 of the cost

 

[dreamer33917 10+ year member]

lets be honest, if any amp company could easily and reliably (sp) double the power from their amps for as cheap as you are talking, dont you think they would have done it and ship them that way already?

thats what i thought to but there are some companys that use the same motherboards the only difference is thicker gauge wires larger power supplys etc kinda like some of the honda acura engines

 

[dreamer33917 10+ year member]

Wow thanks for all the comments, sorry the post was so long. I am just trying to learn more because alot of what those guys were saying, I agree with, I mean for example, I might want a Honda s2000 but i can only afford a civic, but then i save up a few bucks add a CAI exhaust chip maybe buy a different head and wow i have a car thats almost as fast for only a few bucks more..Now i do not know how many amps are upgradeable that are new ones, seems like the old school ones are.. IMO If I find out that i can send my amp to a shop and spend few extra bucks, I can almost double my power without risking the amp ,why not.

 

[ramos 5,000+ posts]

A lot of people seem confused. There is and was a difference between amps that were underrated ( still happens all the time today) and amps that were classified as "cheater" amps ( zuki's are the only ones that come to mind that are still manufactured today) . "Cheater" amps were made when competition classifications were done using the manufacturers 4ohm power ratings of the amplifiers in the system. Fosgate never made any amplifiers that fell into the "cheater" amp category. They just under rated their amps.

Let's look at the Orion Concept 97.3 a true "cheater" amp

Output Power at 12V:

Stereo

2 x 0.5W @ 4 ohms

2 x 1W @ 2 ohms

2 x 2W @ 1 ohms

2 x 4W @ 0.5 ohms

2 x 8W @ 0.25 ohms

2 x 16W @ 0.125 ohms

2 x 32W @ 0.0625 ohms

2 x 64W @ 0.03125 ohms

2 x 128W @ 0.015625 ohms

2 x 256W @ 0.0078125 ohms

2 x 512W @ 0.00390625 ohms

Bridged

1 x 2W @ 4 ohms

1 x 4W @ 2 ohms

1 x 7W @ 1 ohms

1 x 16W @ 0.5 ohms

1 x 32W @ 0.25 ohms

1 x 64W @ 0.125 ohms

1 x 128W @ 0.0625 ohms

1 x 256W @ 0.03125 ohms

1 x 512W @ 0.015625 ohms

1 x 1024W @ 0.0078125 ohms

It's rated by orion at .5w x 2 at 4ohm. or 2w x 1 at 4ohm. You could throw 50 of them in a car and compete in the 0-100w power class. So you could compete with a supposed 100w of amplification but in reality your looking more at 40-50kw given you had a nuclear reactor under the hood to provide ample power to them. This my friends is what is truly meant by "cheater" amps. I got my arse handed to me by a guy with 4 concept 97.3's on a pair of hcca 12's at my first SPL comp I ever went to. I was running 2 bd1000's a series style heat sinks.He was in the lowest class (0-100w)and I was in the highest (1001+). //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[audioarsonal 10+ year member]

Yes "cheater" amps are usually amps that are rated ridiculosy low at a 4 ohm load but when loaded dowm at half and quater ohms they make crazy power.

Nowadays its really only USACi that these amps would be good for but its fairly common knowledge nowadays and most competitors run them legaly.

Modding an amp is totally differant then cheater amps.These amps where made to use a loophole basically back in the day in competitons.

 

[kush-divinity 10+ year member]

But today, cheater amps are still viable for street bets with uneducated children.

For instance, child A has a Memphis MClass 1kw on a pair of M3 10's, and child B has a Walmart 400w on 2 Sony 12's. Child B is very overclassed by his opponent.

But say, some old dude has a 50w pink amp, with 2 "stupid square subs."

Child B will rapidly bet again, that his 400w is greater than the old man's 50, and go up to the line.

Easily done, for the first few times. And I am uncertain on the output of my old HC50 at 1ohm, but it's almost enough to slap 2 06L7's.... Wish I had dual 2 ohm coils //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[edzy 10+ year member]

what about hacking, say a aq220d into a sony 400 watt heatsink...

 

[gotparts90 10+ year member]

It wasnt exacly like that. This is why the current rules have changed for most audio events. Back in the day, like early 90s the larger manufacturers would make amps that would say 50wx2 at 4ohms, that was the class you entered. When in reality the amp would run at .5 ohm so it would be more like 400wx2. Thats why now the audio events go by batteries, fuses, cone area etc. But i dont recall anyone running 24v amps

that's how I remember it and that is how I got my amps that are rated at 1050 at 4ohm but have been run at 1 ohm for gobs of juice. I bought them off the guy who did that and they had some stickers on them from arc stating arc had modified them and the warranty was still intact and couple cautions about something I forget what. I ran 6 of them for a bit and it was just to much for me.

 

[dreamer33917 10+ year member]

wow

 

[jdawg 5,000+ posts]

that's how I remember it and that is how I got my amps that are rated at 1050 at 4ohm but have been run at 1 ohm for gobs of juice. I bought them off the guy who did that and they had some stickers on them from arc stating arc had modified them and the warranty was still intact and couple cautions about something I forget what. I ran 6 of them for a bit and it was just to much for me.

i means to me like I said running amps way down to like .25ohm per channel to get in a lower power class, but I see what you are saying

 

[gotparts90 10+ year member]

yep run them low and get a ton of juice but it would not sound to hot and the amps would get toasty. I will never run the ones I have left low every again and at 4 ohm they barley feel warm even after a long drive at full tilt

 

[braggpawn 10+ year member]

0.0078125 ohms ......is that even possible

 

[ThatChevyGuy 5,000+ posts]

dude runs lightning audio amps.

Thats the cliff.

 

[PIITB Wut Wut 10+ year member]

if you ain't cheating, you ain't trying.

lol old poast but epic