B&w Vs Svs

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

Well his saying his sub is better then mine so whats so hard with posting a picture of it?

My god you're an idiot.

It doesn't matter who owns what. He posted driver measurements of a different driver. Doesn't matter if he owns it or if Al Gore owns it. The point was that the driver displayed significantly better distortion performance. Yes, he happens to own the driver.....but even if he didn't it wouldn't change the point he was making.

I am not saying his a bad guy or an idiot, but how am I suppose to trust a word he says without knowing anything about him? Or am I suppose to just trust any stranger on the net?

He told you where he got the graphs (Zaph & Npdang).....it's not hard to simply look on the site and see the information posted there yourself.

The rest of what he posted was the physics of acoustics type information. Very easily something you could research for yourself to find out whether the information was accurate or not. And dear god....you might learn something in the process //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/eek.gif.771b7a90cf45cabdc554ff1121c21c4a.gif

I still fail to see how his credentials have anything to do with the conversation. Or why you think you have any credentials upon which you can judge his, should he provide them.

I can post my stat's and pictures of my setup with a complete FR graph and the whole build... and about me buiding my own boxe's or designing them, I can show you an ish load of pictures of box's I have built in the front of the house.. so often it killed the grass somehow (mdf dust)

OMG Butt than how wood eye no it waz reely u ?? U must like, post up a scan of ur driverz license. Cuz I still woodnt bleeve.

Honestly, nobody gives a shit.

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

My god you're an idiot.
It doesn't matter who owns what. He posted driver measurements of a different driver. Doesn't matter if he owns it or if Al Gore owns it. The point was that the driver displayed significantly better distortion performance. Yes, he happens to own the driver.....but even if he didn't it wouldn't change the point he was making.

it matters cause he said his sub was better performer but we all know you can have the best driver in the world and put it in a crappy box....

He told you where he got the graphs (Zaph & Npdang).....it's not hard to simply look on the site and see the information posted there yourself.

Ok well I am having a hard time reading those graphs.. can you help me understand how much thd it has at 20 hertz so I get an idea of how to read that graph cause honestly I dont understand it one bit, and please no nonsense of "oh you should be able to understand it" I am asking nicely....

The rest of what he posted was the physics of acoustics type information. Very easily something you could research for yourself to find out whether the information was accurate or not. And dear god....you might learn something in the process //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/eek.gif.771b7a90cf45cabdc554ff1121c21c4a.gif

Physics? LMFAO dam book worms need to get out and actually build something.... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/redface.gif.62fdbfe1a101588a808c4cff71bcb942.gif

I still fail to see how his credentials have anything to do with the conversation.

I know you do, just come out the closet...//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/uhoh.gif.c07307dd22ee7e63e22fc8e9c614d1fd.gif

OMG Butt than how wood eye no it waz reely u ?? U must like, post up a scan of ur driverz license. Cuz I still woodnt bleeve.

Honestly, nobody gives a shit.

This is the funniest part of the whole post...

Someone spends a good amount of time replying to a post which he says "I don't give a shit about what you say" but if you didn't you would ignore it and move on.... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/redface.gif.62fdbfe1a101588a808c4cff71bcb942.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/nerd.gif.c6fa51ddf7ff75f1c0371fbc648f70ae.gif

Ps He should just post some pictures and get it over with LMFAO

I want to see how HIS box looks cause he said HIS sub was a better performer then mine, I know just by looking at it I cant tell if it is, but for all I know it could be in a cardboard box... I wouldn't doubt it //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/uhoh.gif.c07307dd22ee7e63e22fc8e9c614d1fd.gif

maybe he has no camera? someone let the poor man borrow one //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/redface.gif.62fdbfe1a101588a808c4cff71bcb942.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[joetama 5,000+ posts]

it matters cause he said his sub was better performer but we all know you can have the best driver in the world and put it in a crappy box....

The best driver in the world in a crappy box would probably have better results than a crappy driver in a great box. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

But who knows... It is just complete speculation, because what makes the best driver and what makes the worst box?

Ok well I am having a hard time reading those graphs.. can you help me understand how much thd it has at 20 hertz so I get an idea of how to read that graph cause honestly I dont understand it one bit, and please no nonsense of "oh you should be able to understand it" I am asking nicely....

Meh, you would probably tell us we were reading them to you wrong...

Physics? LMFAO dam book worms need to get out and actually build something.... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/redface.gif.62fdbfe1a101588a808c4cff71bcb942.gif

This makes no sense at all... Wouldn't you rather understand how something is going to work and build a system that works together to get the desired end result than just guess?

Would you like someone who builds jet airlines to just guess? Or someone who builds bridges to just guess? I know I wouldn't....

I know you do, just come out the closet...//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/uhoh.gif.c07307dd22ee7e63e22fc8e9c614d1fd.gif

What he has done or will do means nothing compared to what he is saying. You supposedly have a shit ton of experience and are just speaking jibber jabber, to quote Mr. T.

This is the funniest part of the whole post...
Someone spends a good amount of time replying to a post which he says "I don't give a shit about what you say" but if you didn't you would ignore it and move on.... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/redface.gif.62fdbfe1a101588a808c4cff71bcb942.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/nerd.gif.c6fa51ddf7ff75f1c0371fbc648f70ae.gif

Ps He should just post some pictures and get it over with LMFAO

I want to see how HIS box looks cause he said HIS sub was a better performer then mine, I know just by looking at it I cant tell if it is, but for all I know it could be in a cardboard box... I wouldn't doubt it //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/uhoh.gif.c07307dd22ee7e63e22fc8e9c614d1fd.gif

maybe he has no camera? someone let the poor man borrow one //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/redface.gif.62fdbfe1a101588a808c4cff71bcb942.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

I think he means that no body gives two shits who you are or what you have done... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

this board needs a delete option...

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

Meh, you would probably tell us we were reading them to you wrong...

why would I say that? When I am admitting that I cant read it??

This makes no sense at all... Wouldn't you rather understand how something is going to work and build a system that works together to get the desired end result than just guess?

Would you like someone who builds jet airlines to just guess? Or someone who builds bridges to just guess? I know I wouldn't....

Well who would you rather have you build you a plane...
person a has built 100 planes, and has done extensive modeling

person b has built 0 planes but has modeled 100 plains on his computer. but has never built a plain.

Me I am person 1, I have modeled many boxes but in the end it comes down to hands on experience. Which I got tons of.....I can post many boxes I built if need be where are his box's or even just the current box he is using?

I think he means that no body gives two shits who you are or what you have done... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

Yep thats, thats why I am getting paid $600 for two boxes for a pair of 18"s the buyer honestly doesn't care about my spl experience and he thought my ht sub sucked *** big time... /sarcasm... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/redface.gif.62fdbfe1a101588a808c4cff71bcb942.gif Its also not the first nor the last box I have built for others...

 

[ballstothewall 10+ year member]

Well who would you rather have you build you a plane...

person a has built 100 planes, and has done extensive modeling

person b has built 0 planes but has modeled 100 plains on his computer. but has never built a plain.

Now that is a crappy analogy.

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

Well who would you rather have you build you a plane...
person a has built 100 planes, and has done extensive modeling

person b has built 0 planes but has modeled 100 plains on his computer. but has never built a plain.

I would rather have the person who researches, experiments, and bases his design off reason, rather than somebody who just builds them guessing or without moving forward with fresh ideas.

If we just kept making the same things over and over...never experimented with new designs or thought creatively. We would never progress or move forward as humans. We would still be monkeys chasing animals, rather than using tools.

You have amazed me with that post...way below the intelligence level of this forum, which as a whole is already incredibly low compared to several others i've encountered. That is one of the most close minded and ignorant comparisons

Me I am person 1, I have modeled many boxes but in the end it comes down to hands on experience. Which I got tons of.....I can post many boxes I built if need be where are his box's or even just the current box he is using?

You have been in audio for 7 years...and you have not learned more than designing boxes? Boxes in the car audio world, are probably the most fundamental aspect of speaker design. You could easily be replaced by a modeling program and objective data. Designing an "SPL" box is nothing other than creating an extremely resonant system that operates at the peak of the transfer function, compounding the sound pressure. Any competent person can build a box, hell thats what the uneducated Amish people do around here as their trade.

Please share with the class, what your 7 years of experience have granted you that we as mere physicists cannot comprehend? Are you a carpenter...can you design an enclosure that dissipates the rear wave effectively or has a higher sound transmission loss through the box or has a serious of resonances that damp each other...what exactly do you know that we don't?

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

Designing an "SPL" box is nothing other than creating an extremely resonant system that operates at the peak of the transfer function, compounding the sound pressure. Any competent person can build a box, hell thats what the uneducated Amish people do around here as their trade.

HAHAHAHAHAHA

Yep you are so right, thats why everyone out their with a good box design program is hitting high sound pressure levels....

HAHAHAHAHAHA

You are right all I know how to do is build box's, I dont know how to wire a cd player, or mids or highs or even connect a battery, but we all know you do! with all the pictures you have provided....

HAHAHAHAHAHA

I can bet if you have ever competed you never got better then second to last in your class..... Remember first place is still last place if your the only one in your class //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

PS bill gates

MY MONEY> YOUR MONEY

Cause I said so. But I wont prove it or even post a picture of a dollar bill if you asked //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crazy.gif.c13912c32de98515d3142759a824dae7.gif

thadman so do all explorers/crxs peak at the same frequency being the same year and make and model?

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

thadman so do all explorers/crxs peak at the same frequency being the same year and make and model?

No, they don't. It's all about research and experimentation. You measure the transfer function of the specific vehicle and build a box that creates a high resonant peak that complements the vehicles peak. I really fail to see the huge amount of engineering involved with something like that. Creating a high pressure heterogeneous sound field is not crazy...creating a high pressure homogeneous sound field on the other hand would be a lot trickier.

 

[newusername 10+ year member]

Just for the record....

Even the most hard core SPL competitors use a form of "modelling"; it's just that they don't always do it on a computer. To say that everything is totally random and there's no way of predicting behaviour is a falsity in and of itself.

Regardless of who you would prefer, I suppose there's a reason that engineers design planes and laymen don't. This is not to say that engineers have the solution every time, but that's where it starts.

The ability to build something doesn't necessarily mean you have the ability to accurately interpret the data; the inverse can also be true.

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

No, they don't. It's all about research and experimentation. You measure the transfer function of the specific vehicle and build a box that creates a high resonant peak that complements the vehicles peak. I really fail to see the huge amount of engineering involved with something like that. Creating a high pressure heterogeneous sound field is not crazy...creating a high pressure homogeneous sound field on the other hand would be a lot trickier.

but how can you do experimentation without hands on experience? you fail to see it cause you never have done it...

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

HAHAHAHAHAHA
Yep you are so right, thats why everyone out their with a good box design program is hitting high sound pressure levels....

Nope, you failed to read my post. You cannot observe one aspect, creating high sound pressure levels involve an entire system (ie the driver and the vehicle). It also involves objective measurements of the sound field (ie the car), finding the transfer function of the car and exploiting that.

HAHAHAHAHAHA

You are right all I know how to do is build box's, I dont know how to wire a cd player, or mids or highs or even connect a battery, but we all know you do!

Your 7 years of car audio experience have landed you the ability to wire a car? Aren't there people at bestbuy who possess those skills?

HAHAHAHAHAHA

I can bet if you have ever competed you never got better then second to last in your class..... Remember first place is still last place if your the only one in your class //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

I've never claimed to have ever competed in an SPL competition. This is the home audio section and I was commenting on a home audio matter.

PS bill gates

MY MONEY> YOUR MONEY

Cause I said so. But I wont prove it or even post a picture of a dollar bill if you asked //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crazy.gif.c13912c32de98515d3142759a824dae7.gif

I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that you>me or me>you. I was commenting objectively on a specific driver thats available to everyone (they're actually available commercially, you could actually own one yourself)...you made it personal.

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

Just for the record....
Even the most hard core SPL competitors use a form of "modelling"; it's just that they don't always do it on a computer. To say that everything is totally random and there's no way of predicting behaviour is a falsity in and of itself.

Regardless of who you would prefer, I suppose there's a reason that engineers design planes and laymen don't. This is not to say that engineers have the solution every time, but that's where it starts.

The ability to build something doesn't necessarily mean you have the ability to accurately interpret the data; the inverse can also be true.

Yes their is an in between,

You cant be the best at what you do without testing and modeling...you just cant cut out either.

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

but how can you do experimentation without hands on experience? you fail to see it cause you never have done it...

experimentation...I'm referring to a scientific experiment which results in objective data that explains the acoustic environment of your vehicle, not experience in the sense of being an apprentice to a box builder...or best buy car installer...or whatever

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

Yes their is an in between,
You cant be the best at what you do without testing and modeling...you just cant cut out either.

Funny how you change your position so quickly, a few posts earlier you were mocking me for applying science (what you consider testing/modeling) to uncover the solution to the problem.

Please stop posting in this thread, you have no idea what you're talking about. Everyone so far who has posted disagrees with your claims and "Punk0Rama" has just busted your building without science theory...which was your entire establishment of credibility...your "SPL experience"