Any high end deck users in here???

[ngsm13 5,000+ posts]

Bottom line is, Eclipse makes high end decks, as well as clarion. The one's squeak are talking about a EXTREME high end audiophile, NEVER attainable or realisticly useable for anyone on this site. They are just rediculously EXTREME hi-end audiophile decks, i put them in a different league all together. So, IMHO...eclipse does make high-end decks. peace

NG

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

Eclipse's flagship isn't what I meant by high end when I started this thread. Whether many people on this forum can afford them or not is irrelevant. I was only trying to see how many people had these "high end" and yes EXPENSIVE decks. You can argue this til' the cows come home but Eclipse is NOT in the same class as Denon, McIntosh, the older Premier ODR line, Clarion's DRZ-9255, Nakamichi's flagship, Premier DEX-P9, or Alpines CDA-7990. There is a significant price difference between these decks and the 8454 for a reason.

The 8454 is an excellent deck and I would recommend it to anyone looking for a great sounding deck so don't think I'm trying to hate on Eclipse or anything. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/nerd.gif.c6fa51ddf7ff75f1c0371fbc648f70ae.gif

 

[3.5Max6spd 10+ year member]

Eclipse's flagship isn't what I meant by high end when I started this thread. Whether many people on this forum can afford them or not is irrelevant. I was only trying to see how many people had these "high end" and yes EXPENSIVE decks. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/nerd.gif.c6fa51ddf7ff75f1c0371fbc648f70ae.gif

That didn't make alot of sense.....

Although high end stuff can run pricey- i wouldn't make it a rule that it has to be expensive to be considered high end- true audiophiles know where its at and price

is not an issue

I own a Denon AVR-2805 that ran me a pretty penny and itsthe backbone of my home stereo system, its an astounding receiver and I dont regret ditching my perfectly fine 5+ yr old Yamaha for it- but when it comes to the car decks I know the reason they are so pricey, its not that they are out of this world, its that Denon has a home audio cult following thats willing to shed that kind of $$ -

My intrigue in Squeeks adoring of the Z1 is that he mentions the DAc and alpha processing to be something out of this world- like Denon is the only one to offer it in its $2K deck, whereas Eclipses 5v/8v decks that run between $450-600 have all that- and they specialize in car audio

I''m not saying the Eclipses are better, but those points are irrelevant in how one is better than the other when they both have these specs- now a $1500 difference in quite a lump of $$, so again what makes the Z1 so special that a $500 unit cannot be regarded in its class?

Now the McIntosh in another hand can compensate because its truly unique, designed from scratch, , and hand built by some of the finest technicians in car audio, who arguably hand build the finest amplifiers in the world, both home and car audio

And please, when you mention high end, build quality should be a characteristic of such, and we all know Pioneer has the worst build quality of all the decks mentioned in this thread.....my dealers shop is a junk yard for Pioneer decks, and these are decks that come directly from Pioneer themselves- - not trying to hate on Pioneer or anything, just a fact:nerd:

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

I own a Denon AVR-2805 that ran me a pretty penny and itsthe backbone of my home stereo system, its an astounding receiver and I dont regret ditching my perfectly fine 5+ yr old Yamaha for it- but when it comes to the car decks I know the reason they are so pricey, its not that they are out of this world, its that Denon has a home audio cult following thats willing to shed that kind of $$

Now you are just using personal bias to argue your points. How many Denon decks have you personally used to qualify you to make that statement?? Specific models??

Now the McIntosh in another hand can compensate because its truly unique, designed from scratch, , and hand built by some of the finest technicians in car audio,

And for some reason you seem to think that the Denon is just some OEM unit that they pulled off of a shelf............what you just said about the Mc also applies to the Denon. So if you hold the Mc in such high regard, then you should hold the Denon in the same high regard, otherwise your just being hypocritical.

And please, when you mention high end, build quality should be a characteristic of such, and we all know Pioneer has the worst build quality of all the decks mentioned in this thread.....

6yrs and absolutely zero problems with any of my Pioneers........which includes the "infamous" 840MP

 

[3.5Max6spd 10+ year member]

Now you are just using personal bias to argue your points. How many Denon decks have you personally used to qualify you to make that statement?? Specific models??



And for some reason you seem to think that the Denon is just some OEM unit that they pulled off of a shelf............what you just said about the Mc also applies to the Denon. So if you hold the Mc in such high regard, then you should hold the Denon in the same high regard, otherwise your just being hypocritical.

6yrs and absolutely zero problems with any of my Pioneers........which includes the "infamous" 840MP

I've heard my share of Denfords, they are good decks- I have no bias towards the Denon products, I own a freggin $900 home audio receiver by them- Your reference to the Z1's 'alpha processing DAC' in relevance to its exclusivity is faulty,since that technology is available in a $500 deck, so if anything your praise

of it its hypocritical- thats my point

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

I've heard my share of Denfords, they are good decks- I have no bias towards the Denon products

Sorry, big difference between a Denford and the Z1

Your reference to the Z1's 'alpha processing DAC' in relevance to its exclusivity is faulty,since that technology is available in a $500 deck, so if anything your praise of it its hypocritical- thats my point

They both use Crystal DAC's, big whoop. Doesn't mean they are the same Crystal DAC's

 

[3.5Max6spd 10+ year member]

Sorry, big difference between a Denford and the Z1


They both use Crystal DAC's, big whoop. Doesn't mean they are the same Crystal DAC's

Perhaps if Eclipse ***** its customers selling the CD8454 over the $1K mark it would get higher praise and respect, clearly has the technology, the specs and puts out the voltage and SQ necessary to be considered a high end deck, the again if it cost that much I most likely wouldn't be using it-

BTW Squeek, we're just having a discussion.....and I'd bet you haven't heard the Z1 to compare it to your Denford

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

Yup, your right, Denon is raping people.........and you know that because you have looked at the design of the Z1 and know how you would have done it to improve on it's design, and you know where the flaws of it's designs are.........and ofcourse because you have heard one and compared it to your 8454. I mean, after all, it's not like its some custom designed and engineered peice like your beloved McIntosh (when it really is).......it's just some OEM piece that they order from South Korea. Go get 'er tiger //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/thumbsupwink.gif.129404938effda6ad9cca39e7f4b58a3.gif

BTW, I'm not going to respond to this thread again. There is no point to it

 

[3.5Max6spd 10+ year member]

Yup, your right, Denon is raping people.........and you know that because you have looked at the design of the Z1 and know how you would have done it to improve on it's design, and you know where the flaws of it's designs are.........and ofcourse because you have heard one and compared it to your 8454. I mean, after all, it's not like its some custom designed and engineered peice like your beloved McIntosh (when it really is).......it's just some OEM piece that they order from South Korea. Go get 'er tiger //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/thumbsupwink.gif.129404938effda6ad9cca39e7f4b58a3.gif
BTW, I'm not going to respond to this thread again. There is no point to it

You dont have to respond anymore- its obvious even you dont know what makes that deck special other than name/price- you tried to throw '24 bit alpha processing DAC' at me as if its enough to make a point, not thinking that Eclipse incorporates this into a more affordable units (even the 5444 has it)- and I do not own the CD8454 FYI

The Z1 is probably the worlds greatest caraudio receiver, it maybe shyts on the Mac , the F1- Or maybe its just an RFx9420 with a different face, costing +$1500 more- who knows? not you or me thats 4 sure.....

BTW- no need to get bent out of shape, I've in no way disrespected you, clearly just having a discussion.......

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

24 bit alpha processing DAC' at me as if its enough to make a point, not thinking that Eclipse incorporates this into a more affordable units (even the 5444 has it)-

First of all, its 20 bit Alpha Processing. Its been around for a long time and I wasn't aware that anyone other than Denon used such a process. I would like to see some proof of these Eclipse decks using such a process. Not calling you a liar but I see no where in the recent Eclipse lit or on the Eclipse web-site (which is a horrible web-site as far as giving useful info) that mentions this.

Also, squeak wasn't basing his total opinion on the Z1 based on only Alpha Processing. Denon decks have copper plated chassis, very good build quality, and very high quality standards. That is what makes it a GREAT deck, NOT just a couple of features.

One more thing,

we all know Pioneer has the worst build quality of all the decks mentioned in this thread

Have you ever heard touched or seen an older Premier ODR deck? Or what about the P9?? Very solidly made decks. Don't base your opinion of Pioneer decks based on some the lower model decks. Pioneer targets just about every market from the "every day" listener to most demanding "audiophile". So yes some of the lower model decks aren't built the best. But all manufacturers make sub par decks on the lower end.

 

[3.5Max6spd 10+ year member]

First of all, its 20 bit Alpha Processing. Its been around for a long time and I wasn't aware that anyone other than Denon used such a process. I would like to see some proof of these Eclipse decks using such a process. Not calling you a liar but I see no where in the recent Eclipse lit or on the Eclipse web-site (which is a horrible web-site as far as giving useful info) that mentions this.
.

http://memimage.cardomain.net/membe...210_77_full.jpg

you can right click on the bottom right of the page when the icon shows up to view larger

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

http://memimage.cardomain.net/membe...210_77_full.jpg

Linky no worky. I know I said I wouldn't post again......but your post only makes sense if that link works //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[3.5Max6spd 10+ year member]

weird....

Anyways Eclipse is "better at explaining it than I am"

http://www.eclipse-web.com/index_cdchanger.html

you can dowload the pdf file on CD tuners and all the info is there.....pg 4

 

[limitkid7 5,000+ posts]

so i guess we can say

high end deck

affordable high end deck?

 

[adam71 5,000+ posts]

Well, in my opinion a deck with an internal amp is NOT a high end deck. Again, just my opinion. The Eclipse 8053 is a much better deck than the 8454. It has balanced outputs, no internal amp, and a lower THD rating (though not a huge or even audible differnce) but lower none the less.