Acoustic Elegance AV15

[Scoobydoo 5,000+ posts]

I split an atom yesterday and boned a sheep //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

..

 

[bumpin buick 5,000+ posts]

wow I go to a Country USA to get drunk and relax and I come back to this... interesting.

Well guess I have a few things to say. I know very little on SQ compared to most of you guys. I understand about half the terms you use. From an SPL standpoint though I have enough experience to say that I feel this driver is built well, and is suitable for the power it has been rated at. I can not make any claims, such as, this is the best sub ever or the loudest ever. But I will say that for what it is, it did surprise me alot. I am happy with it and if I were building an SQ or even an SQL setup, i would consider one of these easily.

John knows what he is doing, and I dont mean this in a rude way against other sub companies but I think he knows more then any other sub manufacturer presently, at least from the ones I know of. He knows what the sub is made for, im just helping him find out what it can handle //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[bumpin buick 5,000+ posts]

double post sorry

 

[sundownz Pro Seller]

He commented that many drivers have ridiculously stiff suspensions. This allows you to throw massive amounts of power to them without moving them to great distances. That's great if you want to make an indestructible driver that is very inefficient. However if it take a driver 4000W to get the same SPL as another driver with 1000W, what are you gaining? You now have 4x the heat and exponentially higher distortion with the stiffer suspension at the same SPL. The SPL you can get from a system is exactly proportional to how much air you can move. The less power required to move a given amount of air the better.

x2 John.

 

[KOL 10+ year member]

Within the 12+ hrs you spent on here yesterday, throwing up graphs and talking technical, you couldn't take a minute to answer my PM? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif

 

[John_E_Janowitz 10+ year member]

Within the 12+ hrs you spent on here yesterday, throwing up graphs and talking technical, you couldn't take a minute to answer my PM? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif

Sorry, getting to it. A little overwhelming when I got slammed with about 20 similal PM's all yesterday.

John

 

[KOL 10+ year member]

Sorry, getting to it. A little overwhelming when I got slammed with about 20 similal PM's all yesterday.
John

understandable, didn't mean to sound like a needy a$$

 

[dragnix 5,000+ posts]

understandable, didn't mean to sound like a needy a$$

i'd say more douchebaggery than anything else

 

[KOL 10+ year member]

i'd say more douchebaggery than anything else

Yeah, I realised this:banghead:

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

stiffness is used to get a desired fs... tell CS and DD and SJA that....

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

stiffness is used to get a desired fs... tell CS and DD and SJA that....

Mass in conjunction with stiffness.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

Mass in conjunction with stiffness.

the asked why use the stiffer suspensions, i told them why.. also to beable to do something only a few other extreme world champions know.. its not about how peaky the woofer can get, or how much power it can handle.. it is so many varibles.. Im going pull the wooferout and tell the front desk its going to be picked up by UPS..

think about this hw many subs that have a lower FS are used in hte worlds loudest cars? NONE.. by low i mean below 30hz.. 99Z has a fs around 38 so does the APXX/heavyweight, CS woofers etc... you must understand how compliance and damping wrok and how having the proper dampning, phasing and mechanical powerhandling are crutical to high output levels.. im talking walled/extreme cars.. its really not too much different than a daily install...

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

the asked why use the stiffer suspensions, i told them why.. also to beable to do something only a few other extreme world champions know.. its not about how peaky the woofer can get, or how much power it can handle.. it is so many varibles.. Im going pull the wooferout and tell the front desk its going to be picked up by UPS..think about this hw many subs that have a lower FS are used in hte worlds loudest cars? NONE.. by low i mean below 30hz.. 99Z has a fs around 38 so does the APXX/heavyweight, CS woofers etc... you must understand how compliance and damping wrok and how having the proper dampning, phasing and mechanical powerhandling are crutical to high output levels.. im talking walled/extreme cars.. its really not too much different than a daily install...

Are you typing with a corncob in each hand?

I understand compliance and damping for the purposes of making character-free music. I understand thermal compression and the need for drivers to be mechanically limited as opposed to thermally limited to facilitate as constant a load as possible for the amplifier to work with so that dynamics are not robbed of life. This is clearly the type of driver John wishes to offer, not the type you wish it to be.

I understand that you are coming short with a person who is seemingly very willing to help you get what you want. I don't know the full story but from what I've read in the two threads concerning this topic, that seems to be the case and you are coming off a bit hostile and argumentative. Why, I don't know. John has been very forthcoming with his answers and supplying information in addition to what's been asked. The least you could afford him as a tech/engineer is a minimal amount of respect on these boards.

 

[bumpin buick 5,000+ posts]

the asked why use the stiffer suspensions, i told them why.. also to beable to do something only a few other extreme world champions know.. its not about how peaky the woofer can get, or how much power it can handle.. it is so many varibles.. Im going pull the wooferout and tell the front desk its going to be picked up by UPS..think about this hw many subs that have a lower FS are used in hte worlds loudest cars? NONE.. by low i mean below 30hz.. 99Z has a fs around 38 so does the APXX/heavyweight, CS woofers etc... you must understand how compliance and damping wrok and how having the proper dampning, phasing and mechanical powerhandling are crutical to high output levels.. im talking walled/extreme cars.. its really not too much different than a daily install...

Not arguing with you because honestly I dont know a lot about the SQ part of it. Just curious how did we come to talking about 99Z, APXX, HW, and CS subs. I mean now we have a thread about a very SQ based sub, that I was simply testing for power handling and see some scores it could put up while doing that to subs that are being mentioned are obviously in a different price range and power class. I understand the point your trying to make with FS and spider strength but I think you could reach that same FS and not have to have a spider that literally does not bend with me jumping on it. Just to give you an idea of what I am talking about, http://s213.photobucket.com/albums/cc256/usask8er1/15%20Challenge/?action=view&current=MVI_4118.flv

Dont get me wrong the HW and similar subs are crazy for SPL as they have insane power handling but all efficiency seems lost now a days with most SPL subs. The numbers are impressive dont get me wrong but some people want a sub that can put out good numbers and not need to be running 5kw+. That is not the issue with me but for many customers that need something that will take the abuse they feel they need a big sub like these and I dont feel that is always the case.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

john is a great guy, i dont dislike him one bit, but above tuning ported acts alot like freeair, compliance and qms are relied on, not souly the motor. thats the reason many spl woofers have such a low vas... i tried telling him before i pushed it hard that the courrgations on my woofer have a different stifness in each set.. i was wrong about the ottermost its actually the very first 2 right next to the former.. onceits reaches a certian throw it just looses all its stiffness.. it didn't do it the first day, after i dropped the box to 2.8 tuned to 32 and played alot of music(5-6 hours riding,stopping checking excursion etc..) i noticed a decline in output above 50.. so much i got nervious and lowered the xover for 70 to 60 then to 50.. it justdidn't sound good above about 45-50 and i noticed excursion above 50 when crossed higher(recheck changed solpes x over points re donesome wiring checked the amps output) it would act like it was unloading..