What Wattage is too expensive?

[mat3833 10+ year member]

That's the thing I need to read up on. 6s could handle my charge voltage (>= 15V for a long time after cranking) but I am always worried I'll be too close to the minimum charge for the cells. Clearly you aren't having problems.

I still don't know exactly whats going on. I know bursts like starting cars and such require alot of current, but not much overall power. With my 14.4v I'm probably only getting 60ah of capacity from my bank or so? Someone did the math on here. I don't believe there is really a minimum charge. LTO is a bit weird. It will run down to 1.5vish per cell or 9v for a 6s, and that's pretty much empty. But from what I've read they are happy anywhere from 1.7v-2.7v. Still reading about all the little details.

Matt

 

[audiobaun 5,000+ posts]

I still don't know exactly whats going on. I know bursts like starting cars and such require alot of current, but not much overall power. With my 14.4v I'm probably only getting 60ah of capacity from my bank or so? Someone did the math on here. I don't believe there is really a minimum charge. LTO is a bit weird. It will run down to 1.5vish per cell or 9v for a 6s, and that's pretty much empty. But from what I've read they are happy anywhere from 1.7v-2.7v. Still reading about all the little details.

Matt

Deff something Id like to read up and learn about. Im going to need to find out what and how many I will need to run at least 8-10k on substage and approx. 2-3 on front stage, with enough to keep my truck happy with my 3oo amp alt or 255. I have both Alts already. I plan on putting my GP 300 amp alt. in this summer

 

[mat3833 10+ year member]

Deff something Id like to read up and learn about. Im going to need to find out what and how many I will need to run at least 8-10k on substage and approx. 2-3 on front stage, with enough to keep my truck happy with my 3oo amp alt or 255. I have both Alts already. I plan on putting my GP 300 amp alt. in this summer

That's about double what I'm running, so I'd guess 160-200ah of yinlong.

Matt

 

[metalheadjoe 10+ year member]

I still don't know exactly whats going on. I know bursts like starting cars and such require alot of current, but not much overall power.

Maybe you misspoke: You can't have relatively high current at any given voltage and not have relatively high power. Cranking is the highest load most batteries encounter, which is why batteries are rated in cranking amps, and also why it drains your battery so fast.

 

[audiobaun 5,000+ posts]

That's about double what I'm running, so I'd guess 160-200ah of yinlong.

Matt

Thanks for the Info for sure. I guess Ill look into pricing it up now.

 

[Jake321]

My Sub dealer said my Sub probably only uses 1000 Watts.

So would a 130 Amp Work?

Also could a 130 Amp be used for a second Battey if 1000 Watts is all that's necessary?

Think I'm only using 12 Amps constantly with my Sub.
10Amps for the Car?

130 Amp Alternator would be enough for the 2 Capacitor, Battery?

 

[Water Bear]

My Sub dealer said my Sub probably only uses 1000 Watts.

So would a 130 Amp Work?

Also could a 130 Amp be used for a second Battey if 1000 Watts is all that's necessary?

Think I'm only using 12 Amps constantly with my Sub.
10Amps for the Car?

130 Amp Alternator would be enough for the 2 Capacitor, Battery?

If you're only using 1k on your sub 130 amp alt is fine. If you see yourself going up at some point in the future, may as upgrade now.

 

[Original wis]

I got the cells from Hispls on here. Buss bars, case, and balancer were Jim's standard bars, Loud AF battery case, and Amazon.

Matt

Hispls?

 

[Water Bear]

Maybe you misspoke: You can't have relatively high current at any given voltage and not have relatively high power. Cranking is the highest load most batteries encounter, which is why batteries are rated in cranking amps, and also why it drains your battery so fast.

You are right of course. I think he's just observing that batteries have low average power relative to their output while cranking (like how their AH rating is tiny compared to their CCA).

 

[Water Bear]

Hispls?

Guy on here. @hispls

Edit: if you search the forum you'll find some old threads by him discussing lithium in great detail.

 

[Jake321]

If you're only using 1k on your sub 130 amp alt is fine. If you see yourself going up at some point in the future, may as upgrade now.

Can I still use the Capacitor and 2nd Battery with the 130 Amp?

Thanks!

 

[Water Bear]

Can I still use the Capacitor and 2nd Battery with the 130 Amp?

Thanks!

You can. If one battery is a lot older than the other or a different make use an isolator. It's basically a giant relay (switch). Stinger makes one that'll take 500 amps. It's important not let one die though. A digital voltmeter is advised.

 

[metalheadjoe 10+ year member]

Hispls?

@hispls . He's one of the top dogs on this site.

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

Hispls?

I was about the first person in the USA to get into LTO cells. At the time we did this the only other people who were using those for car audio was a team in Russia.

Lithium Titanate (LTO) battery bank build.

This is a thread for progress and results of the LTO battery banks I'm going to be building for my Jeep and my brother's Civic. So far so good. It was pretty scary sending a bunch of money to China but the cells arrived and the fella at the company was very helpful and on the ball with...

www.caraudio.com

So far so good, these are still performing admirably. I did a lot of research on this because none of the car audio "brands" would give me straight answers but only sales pitches.

Currently I do have some YingLong 40AH cells and some Toshiba 10AH cells. I do not think anybody is doing ready made banks for the Toshiba cells but YingLong 40 has become very popular so off-the-shelf options for busing are easy to come by. Without a well kitted out metal shop you'll definitely struggle building your own bus bars. I did a 5s bank of Toshiba last summer for my 4 wheeler using just 8 gauge wire and some ring terminals and that works the balls; I still haven't got around to building a car audio sized bank of those, small terminals make it a bit intimidating and IMO definitely limits you to copper if you don't have a very good machine shop to counter-sink aluminum thick enough to carry big currents. Really I think for a powersport battery 5s Toshiba will be impossible to beat in price and longevity, those fill with liquid ones are 90-100$ and barely last a year, parts store lithium for those are over 200$ and I got about 3 years out of the one I auditioned.


Anyway, the only thing I'd take exception to that has been posted here is claims of charging 6s banks up over 15.5V. The Russian dudes and my source in China did not suggest this and I can say charging at normal car voltage (14.4-14.8) seems to provide ample performance for those of us doing so.

 

[mat3833 10+ year member]

Maybe you misspoke: You can't have relatively high current at any given voltage and not have relatively high power. Cranking is the highest load most batteries encounter, which is why batteries are rated in cranking amps, and also why it drains your battery so fast.

Yes, you are correct. Power is volts times amps. But 12v X 300a for 5 seconds is less than 12v X 100a for 30 minutes. My point was simply a simple 5 second jump isn't the same power as 30m of my system at decent volume. Yes, starting is alot of current, but part of that is due to battery resistance and wire loses causing voltage drop. Lower voltage means more amps for the same power output.

I'd love to get some kind of meter and find out how much power my jetta takes to turn over, I highly doubt it's anywhere close to the "950cca) the factory battery was rated for. When starting my car now, my voltage doesn't even drop from the resting 14.3 or so.

Matt

Edit: also, lithium batteries are MUCH better suited to heavy load situations. Most AGM or lead-acid batteries only support 50 percent depth of discharge. That means your 40ah battery is only good for 20ah in real world use. Lithium are generally good for upwards of 80 percent, and they maintain their voltage in a much flatter discharge curve. Lithium is all aroind just better.