Working with a Bose (circa 1990) system... tearing it all out vs. reusing some parts?

[maldecido33 10+ year member]

Wow, I never would have expected such a thorough response... on most forums, the newbies will get a hearty 'get out until you know what your questions even mean' and thats the extent of it. I really appreciate it!

I didnt really read the rest of your post, but in response to the first paragraph, it's all about how a newbie addresses their questions. You did so in an intelligent, respectful manner and as such go those replies. You also accepted criticism to your original ideas and showed that you learned from what some of the more experienced members had to say.

The ones that get shot down are the ones who either pose questions in a holier-than-thou tone, or unable to accept and implement criticism or pose a question that is unreadable because it has such bad grammar and/or spelling.

By the way, //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/thumbsup.gif.3287b36ca96645a13a43aff531f37f02.gif for engineers! I'm a EE about to enter grad school.

 

[SadbutTrue 10+ year member]

Rick

I had a few more questions pertaining to the caddillac...

I have the Haynes manual for my car. It gives general instructions on how to remove the stereo but I don't beleive it gives the sizes it takes. I'll check again. What does DIN 1.5 mean (i see 'DIN' a lot on this site)? I guess it has to have something to do with the HUD chassis size but beyond that no clue.

FWIW, my car definitely has door speakers. The owners manual says it 'may' have tweeters in the dash but I can't see them.

How much do HD radio modules usually run? I don't think I can see myself paying for a sirius/xm subscription, but now that I think about it the LCD idea is probably a waste of money. If I want to watch TV while I tailgate I can just... bring a TV and rabbit ears.

Do you know a good website for the sub boxes? I see used boxes here and there and at general auto stores and online, but I have no idea what makes it good or worthless.

As far as the antenna goes, maybe I'll just stop in at the caddy dealership and see how much they'd want to replace it with a stock power unit.

I will agree with you, these Cadillacs have a certain charm. I got mine for 200$ 2 years ago (the car was originally worth almost 40k in 1989!!!), and its running strong and hasn't given me too much trouble and it just passed 200k. Comfortable car, quiet, smooth... can't complain. Its hard to justify spending a lot of money on it because I got it so cheap, but eh... its a good daily beater.

Current plan I think will be:

HUD (w/ ability to play mp3/wav cds, get HD radio, and have an mp3 player jack)

4 channel Amp for speakers (roughly equivalent to the Pioneer you mentioned)

2 6.5" front speakers

2 6x9 rear speakers

- General consensus I've heard is you want your speakers rated at an rms wattage slightly higher than the rms wattage your amp is gonna put out, so I'll do that.

2 channel bridged Amp for sub

Not sure how big the amp or sub should be

I'll install it all and see how it sounds then mess with the sound deadening if I can't hear the sub. If its easy to yank whatever deadening happens to be behind the rear seats, then I'll go ahead and do that while I'm at it.

So, outside the few questions above... I guess thats it unless some people want to recommend some components for me //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

Thanks again to Rick and everyone else.

maldecido33 wrote:I didnt really read the rest of your post, but in response to the first paragraph, it's all about how a newbie addresses their questions. You did so in an intelligent, respectful manner and as such go those replies. You also accepted criticism to your original ideas and showed that you learned from what some of the more experienced members had to say.

The ones that get shot down are the ones who either pose questions in a holier-than-thou tone, or unable to accept and implement criticism or pose a question that is unreadable because it has such bad grammar and/or spelling.

By the way, for engineers! I'm a EE about to enter grad school.

One of my strengths... I know when I get into a realm and have no idea what is going on. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

Congrats. I couldn't do more school for the time being,so I'm trying to be a productive human being for the time being (and here I am at work on the internet doing nothing... ). What school you go to?

 

[1991Brougham 10+ year member]

Look for the factory service manual on eBay. It's the same one that would be found at a dealership's service department and it's the best way to go.

DIN 1 means standard size dash radio opening. DIN 1.5 means 1 1/2 times that size and DIN 2 means twice the size.

Alpine's HD Radio module retails for $160. The newest one for the newest HU's comes out in May and I don't know what those units will retail for.

Sub boxes are largish and relatively heavy so shipping can be high. Go to a local car audio shop and buy one there. Over here in Coos Bay I can get them for around $50. They're nicely carpeted and have the wiring outlet in them as well. I'd imagine with you living in California, the last thing you should have a problem with is in getting a sub box!

Since you aren't pouring a ton of money into a killer competition sub setup, any box that holds the speaker will do the job. The real key is to get the bass ported into the interior. Later on if you get "sub fever", then you can go all-out with el perfecto boxes, massive amps, upgraded alternator/battery/wiring and fill your trunk. From what you've said so far it appears to me that as long as you get some sort of sub action going, you'll be happy.

For a single sub a monochannel amp will do the job.

See if someone here can speak up on component speakers at the price range you're aiming at. You take that 4-channel amp that can be set up as a 2-channel amp to wind up with around double the power, so you'll really be pumping it out of a nice set of front mounted component speakers. Taking this path means not having to buy rear speakers and you then remove the factory speakers so the bass can port in from the trunk. I'd chintz out on the sub/box/amp before I chintzed out on the front component speakers and it's amp though.

A general number to aim for in your situation regarding the sub amp's output would be around 200W RMS. That kind of current draw when combined with the other amp should not overload the alternator on your Cadillac, thus meaning you won't need the upgrades to the alternator and battery. Do run the best wire you can so it's in place for future upgrades.

If you aim your money at the best component speakers and amp you can get, go easy on the sub, go easy on the HU and have the best wire in place you can get for when more money comes in, you'll have the foundation laid for better sounds. I think between eBay and Craigslist you can nail this out for close to $500. Let the HU new tech sort itself out, save money for electrical upgrades, then do them so you'll be ready for a bigger better sub setup and in the meantime enjoy some pretty decent sounds even if not every single option you could do is available at this time.

You'll wind up with the classic component speaker front stage and a sub in the trunk configuration. That's not such a bad place to be and your setup will probably sound better than my current setup!

Rick

 

[SadbutTrue 10+ year member]

Okay, I suppose I might as well get everyone's opinions on this. I went to a local, family owned shop and told them what I was looking for, and he said he could do this for 850 installed (and that he'd try to match competitors if he could.. so I think I can get it down a bit more, I'm guessing 800).

DEH-P4000UB (usb/plays everything/ipod hookup/does hd radio with module.. seems pretty solid)

Amp1: Sony XM-1252GTR

6x9s: Pioneer TS-A6972R

6.5s: Pioneer TS- A1672R

Amp2/Sub/Box - MTX RT12-200 combo (all MTX stuff, didn't get a part # for the amp).

inc wiring harnesses/wires/etc

also includes some basic theft deterrent stuff

and a new antenna

Is that at all a decent deal? Its a 2 channel amp for the 6.5s and 6x9s (as opposed to the 4 channel pioneer you metnioed above). How big a difference does using a bridged 4 channel vs a 2 channel make if their total RMS power outputs are similar (granted, Pioneer's also a better brand than Sony, but I've been told with amps it doesn't make a huge difference)?

I plan on shopping around regardless and getting some other prices and saving a few hundred, just wanted to know what I'm looking at here.

 

[1991Brougham 10+ year member]

The deal sounds fair in terms of price for the pieces. I'm wondering why you would settle for the lesser Pioneer series speakers though. The REV series are a step up in quality and power handling and when you go on eBay, they are around $100 a pair shipped. Sony doesn't get much good press in these forums and it appears they are living on their name more than actually putting out anything decent. Pioneer and Alpine equipment can be found on eBay at good prices.

Go with as good a grade of component speakers up front as you can, skip the 6x9's altogether, try the lower level sub out to see if it suits your purpose or if you want to get a bargain on a sub setup, go used via your local Craigslist to dip your foot in the water for a smaller sum, then see whether you want more bass reinforcement as well as what kind (SQ or SPL) after seeing how the system comes together. New subs/amps/boxes are relatively expensive compared to their used counterparts. I'd only buy an used system if it was hooked up so you could hear how it sounds and verify the working condition.

RMS = RMS. It makes no difference if you bridge an amp to 2 channels, run 4 channels or run a pair of monochannel amps. The output number, if it is the same for all the different setups one could have, is the same per channel, it's really the same...LOL!

Let the local store sell you the HU, the antenna, the wiring, the security stuff and the install, while you get the speakers, amps and sub stuff on your own. Only if you are not familiar with how to deal with eBay and Craigslist, should you shy away from these channels of procurement.

Rick

 

[SadbutTrue 10+ year member]

The deal sounds fair in terms of price for the pieces. I'm wondering why you would settle for the lesser Pioneer series speakers though. The REV series are a step up in quality and power handling and when you go on eBay, they are around $100 a pair shipped. Sony doesn't get much good press in these forums and it appears they are living on their name more than actually putting out anything decent. Pioneer and Alpine equipment can be found on eBay at good prices.
Go with as good a grade of component speakers up front as you can, skip the 6x9's altogether, try the lower level sub out to see if it suits your purpose or if you want to get a bargain on a sub setup, go used via your local Craigslist to dip your foot in the water for a smaller sum, then see whether you want more bass reinforcement as well as what kind (SQ or SPL) after seeing how the system comes together. New subs/amps/boxes are relatively expensive compared to their used counterparts. I'd only buy an used system if it was hooked up so you could hear how it sounds and verify the working condition.

RMS = RMS. It makes no difference if you bridge an amp to 2 channels, run 4 channels or run a pair of monochannel amps. The output number, if it is the same for all the different setups one could have, is the same per channel, it's really the same...LOL!

Let the local store sell you the HU, the antenna, the wiring, the security stuff and the install, while you get the speakers, amps and sub stuff on your own. Only if you are not familiar with how to deal with eBay and Craigslist, should you shy away from these channels of procurement.

Rick

It isn't a big shop, and he was just picking things he actually had on the shelves, he coudl probably order the higher end speakers if I asked.

I love ebay, and have used craigslist some. With car electronics its almost a bit overwhelming (searching any of the major audio brands yields 2-5,000 hits, its tough to keep track of on ebay), but yeah, probably the way to go.

 

[1991Brougham 10+ year member]

To search for speakers on eBay, enter the size (6x9, 6.5, etc.) and the brand. You won't get overwhelmed by large numbers that way. Bring up each brand individually. Check the background of the seller by looking at the rating number to see how many and what kind of negatives are being posted.

To search for head units, put in the brand name and the phrase car stereo.

For research, check out each of the forums here that handle a particular aspect of a system (HU's, speakers, subs, wiring, etc.) to gain some insight into the strengths and weaknesses of the items in question. I can give you great insight on what works for me but it gets even better when you get many insights from the entire community. The forums are full of great info here!

Rick

 

[SadbutTrue 10+ year member]

Just to give everyone an update...

I ended up with:

Pioneer DEH4000UB head unit

Infinity 5 1/4" front speakers (forget part #, but 50 W RMS)

Pioneer 6x9s (same, again 60 W RMS though... couldn't quite pull the REV series)

Kicker CVR 12" sub

Hiphonics Zeus 300 W RMS amp for sub

Kenwood 60 W RMS x 4 amp for speakers

Plus a box, standard antenna & installation.. for $700. Feel like I got a decent deal, it sounds good and I've been blasting it and messing around with it nonstop since I got it (and its crystal clear at the highest volumes I've been able to tolerate so far). Was definitely able to use what I learned on these boards to negotiate better parts from the shop, specifically with the amps and speakers.

Thanks again for all your help!

 

[Atimm693 10+ year member]

Sounds nice, but you should've ditched the Rear speakers and just got a set of REV's for the front.

But all in all it only matters if you are happy with it.

 

[1991Brougham 10+ year member]

Just to give everyone an update...
I ended up with:

Pioneer DEH4000UB head unit

Infinity 5 1/4" front speakers (forget part #, but 50 W RMS)

Pioneer 6x9s (same, again 60 W RMS though... couldn't quite pull the REV series)

Kicker CVR 12" sub

Hiphonics Zeus 600 W RMS amp for sub

Kenwood 60 W RMS x 4 amp for speakers

Plus a box, standard antenna & installation.. for $700. Feel like I got a decent deal, it sounds good and I've been blasting it and messing around with it nonstop since I got it (and its crystal clear at the highest volumes I've been able to tolerate so far). Was definitely able to use what I learned on these boards to negotiate better parts from the shop, specifically with the amps and speakers.

Thanks again for all your help!

You got a decent price and if you like the sounds coming from it, then it's an all's well than ends well situation. Declare victory and hit the road!//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

After a few months of using your new system and reading posts here as well as what is in mobile audio magazines, you'll have some new ideas for your next step. Until then, have fun with what you have and later on, have fun with what you get!

Rick