Wolfram w-4500.1 Pre-order $600

[Boomin_tahoe 5,000+ posts]

Did USA run out of ideas for car audio? Subs and amps in general?

 

[wew lad 5,000+ posts]

I can see your point. However I will say, the R&D from Korea actually seems to be from the buildhouse nowadays instead of the OE companies.... I almost consider the Importers and their brands as a Distributor for companies like Zenon rather than Brands themselves... But that's a fault of the market in this country. Car Audio is dying here so companies in this country are not investing in it. Think of the BIG companies and where their focus is... RF, Kicker, Harman (JBL, Infinity), etc... CES used to be chock full of new products from them... Now.. hardly anything ever new.. A practical ghost town... Why because their innovation is on the OEM new vehicle side...
BUT, In Brazil and South America, and to a degree Russia the car audio market is thriving, which is why you are seeing so much innovation in Amp technology from Brazil and subwoofers and specialty products from Russia.

Hell Sounddigital just showed off the most ridiculous demo of a marine amp I have ever seen. They fully submerged it, pulled it out of the water and it continued to work... Now that is innovative.

You've been able to submerge some mmats amplifiers for a while, if you've ever looked at the design of mmats amplifiers you'd see they do a lot of what I like, but the price is that of a sound quality snob with money much more abundant than that of the average person looking to put money into the industry. they also dont really seem to care about increasing in size, they're happy with brick and mortar, what little of it there is.

i guess im just more expecting of the companies to source out the engineers in the world and invest in true forward looking designs instead of looking for the most profit immediately. the growth of this technology vs other electronics has been relatively slow. it's almost as if it doesn't abide by the rate at which electronics seem to reduce in size and price loosely related to moore's law

 

[bigblank69 10+ year member]

You've been able to submerge some mmats amplifiers for a while, if you've ever looked at the design of mmats amplifiers you'd see they do a lot of what I like, but the price is that of a sound quality snob with money much more abundant than that of the average person looking to put money into the industry. they also dont really seem to care about increasing in size, they're happy with brick and mortar, what little of it there is.
i guess im just more expecting of the companies to source out the engineers in the world and invest in true forward looking designs instead of looking for the most profit immediately. the growth of this technology vs other electronics has been relatively slow. it's almost as if it doesn't abide by the rate at which electronics seem to reduce in size and price loosely related to moore's law

Problem is there is no money to be made in order to recoup the R&D costs. Therefore they don't put in the investment to move the industry forward. OEM Systems for new cars is where the money is and where the innovation is.

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

money hungry companies taking the easy road.

You really think these guys are making a killing selling Korean 4K amps for 600$? Call up Zenon and order a couple hundred and see how you make out.

If you can’t jump on the pre sale don’t worry about it. There will be a new company next month with the same thing.

Pretty much this.

Did USA run out of ideas for car audio? Subs and amps in general?

No. There's engineers with plenty of great ideas but few consumers are willing to pay so very few companies are willing to pay to implement the new ideas. Consider also intellectual property theft if you outsource manufacturing. Get a great idea, have China manufacture, and in 2 months your "proprietary" design will be on Alibaba.

You've been able to submerge some mmats amplifiers for a while, if you've ever looked at the design of mmats amplifiers you'd see they do a lot of what I like, but the price .....i guess im just more expecting of the companies to source out the engineers in the world and invest in true forward looking designs

So you want Mmats R&D and first world manufacturing at Chinese copycat prices. Yep, it's the greedy corporations that are the problem here, not cheap arse bottom feeder consumers.

Don't look now, but it's not like the Brazilian full bridge amps are "new" or "cutting edge" they've been building these for 20 years almost so just like Koreans it's just slight revisions on the same old circuit.

 

[wew lad 5,000+ posts]

You really think these guys are making a killing selling Korean 4K amps for 600$? Call up Zenon and order a couple hundred and see how you make out.


Pretty much this.

No. There's engineers with plenty of great ideas but few consumers are willing to pay so very few companies are willing to pay to implement the new ideas. Consider also intellectual property theft if you outsource manufacturing. Get a great idea, have China manufacture, and in 2 months your "proprietary" design will be on Alibaba.

So you want Mmats R&D and first world manufacturing at Chinese copycat prices. Yep, it's the greedy corporations that are the problem here, not cheap arse bottom feeder consumers.

Don't look now, but it's not like the Brazilian full bridge amps are "new" or "cutting edge" they've been building these for 20 years almost so just like Koreans it's just slight revisions on the same old circuit.

You can frame it like I'm expecting the prices to be so low with no justification, but lets be real here, the technology is behind and people are still trying to capitalize it. The price of just about everything else that's an electronic drops off sharply as new technology becomes more common. That's just the trend, I want to know why its defying that trend

Why is it brazil, of all places, that's pushing out better and cheaper amplifiers? (better is arguable, but that's not the point)

 

[Boomin_tahoe 5,000+ posts]

This thread certainly turned upside down..

 

[Boomin_tahoe 5,000+ posts]

It's the cost and size, you just can't beat a brazilian in price and size when compared to koreans.
It's also my bias against the ludicrous amounts of people who do literally 0 design work on an amp and just stick their name on it saying things like "In other words, you're not going to find a stronger, harder working amplifier in its class"

I'm irked by the entire lack of development because of money hungry companies taking the easy road. Why would I spend MORE money on something outdated just so the money can go into someones pocket, not the development of better technology? This is the main reason I'd ever consider buying sundown subwoofersQUOTE]

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It's like that everywhere/everything you buy. Why do you think items look so similar to others?! It's been going on for years....Fyi Sundown has some new developments going on, if you have facebook, plenty 'o pics on there.

 

[LosIsATool 5,000+ posts]

Y’all are acting like amps only come from South America and Asia.

 

[bigblank69 10+ year member]

Y’all are acting like amps only come from South America and Asia.

If your talking about the USA, and Europe (Mosconi, Brax, Helix, Genesis etc.. Alphard doesn't count because they use Chinese and Korean Off the Shelf designs) Those companies are even LESS incentivized to innovate than over here. Even SMALLER market for car audio and they still have to compete against the Asian brands.

You want innovation, you need a market starving for what your going to innovate to. There is ZERO money in Car Audio, even if you made a 99% Efficient amplifier, that ran on a whole new class of circuit board, you would have the EXACT same amount of buyers for it that you do currently... No expansion of market.

The innovation in this industry will be how it integrates with Factory systems, not in how much power you can get of the amplifier.

 

[LosIsATool 5,000+ posts]

If your talking about the USA, and Europe (Mosconi, Brax, Helix, Genesis etc.. Alphard doesn't count because they use Chinese and Korean Off the Shelf designs) Those companies are even LESS incentivized to innovate than over here. Even SMALLER market for car audio and they still have to compete against the Asian brands.
You want innovation, you need a market starving for what your going to innovate to. There is ZERO money in Car Audio, even if you made a 99% Efficient amplifier, that ran on a whole new class of circuit board, you would have the EXACT same amount of buyers for it that you do currently... No expansion of market.

The innovation in this industry will be how it integrates with Factory systems, not in how much power you can get of the amplifier.

Not all all. Look at Bewith. Asia does it way bigger than we do when it comes to amazing builds. They just don’t build for bassheads. If you look at a EMMA event all you see is $100,000 builds.

Genesis is no more BTW.

 

[bigblank69 10+ year member]

$100,000 Builds is meaningless, unless your doing 1000 builds of $100,000 or more. Bewith is Japanese... you do know Japan is in Asia right? lol

Again, if you want INNOVATION you need the masses to demand it. Do you know why Car audio was bigger in the 80's and 90's? Because stock systems were horrendous and factory radio's stopped working after a year or two of car ownership, mixed with terrible speakers and lack of placement in the vehicle... You simply don't have that today..

 

[los33]

Not all all. Look at Bewith. Asia does it way bigger than we do when it comes to amazing builds. They just don’t build for bassheads. If you look at a EMMA event all you see is $100,000 builds. Genesis is no more BTW.

Been to one, all SQ cars with beautiful builds.
No spl

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

 

[Darth_Immitis]

$100,000 Builds is meaningless, unless your doing 1000 builds of $100,000 or more. Bewith is Japanese... you do know Japan is in Asia right? lol
Again, if you want INNOVATION you need the masses to demand it. Do you know why Car audio was bigger in the 80's and 90's? Because stock systems were horrendous and factory radio's stopped working after a year or two of car ownership, mixed with terrible speakers and lack of placement in the vehicle... You simply don't have that today..

I never thought of it like this before and it makes sense. I remember when back in the day it seemed like everyone and their mother had a system. Nowadays not so much.

 

[KilluminatiDre 10+ year member]

Im just happy to get good power these days for reasonable prices unlike 10+ years ago where mono amps were outragous .

 

[Darth_Immitis]

Im just happy to get good power these days for reasonable prices unlike 10+ years ago where mono amps were outragous .

Amen to that