SQ sub w/ tight responce...

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

Sound quality is not subjective, it is accuracy of a reproduction to that of the original. The problem is, human's measure this subjectively. There in lies the crux of all the turmoil and arguements that erupt from the subject.

 

[newusername 10+ year member]

Sound quality is not subjective, it is accuracy of a reproduction to that of the original. The problem is, human's measure this subjectively. There in lies the crux of all the turmoil and arguements that erupt from the subject.

For the most part, humans don't hear it is nearly as subjectively as many people think...it's the interpretation of what matters (in terms of distortion) that is too complex and too recent for many to understand. Dr. Toole said himself that there is a strong correlation between what we are able to measure and what we interpret negatively.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

Sound quality is not subjective, it is accuracy of a reproduction to that of the original. The problem is, human's measure this subjectively. There in lies the crux of all the turmoil and arguements that erupt from the subject.

every source will not reproduce the input the same this is why we get this highly arguable subject... like the ago old argument that tube amps sound better... when clipped they present a much more plesent sound. no arguning low disortion is good, but look at some b/l curves and KMS curves plotted in a lab with next to no power isn't always the best solution... many people didn't and don't like the sound of the XXX, why not because its the lowest distortion driver, but the fact that its not ideal for every application... honestly i think that the barhma does sound better than many many woofers some having lglc some sglc some under hung.....

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

For the most part, humans don't hear it is nearly as subjectively as many people think...it's the interpretation of what matters (in terms of distortion) that is too complex and too recent for many to understand. Dr. Toole said himself that there is a strong correlation between what we are able to measure and what we interpret negatively.

Interpretation is an excellent word for it.

every source will not reproduce the input the same this is why we get this highly arguable subject... like the ago old argument that tube amps sound better... when clipped they present a much more plesent sound. no arguning low disortion is good, but look at some b/l curves and KMS curves plotted in a lab with next to no power isn't always the best solution... many people didn't and don't like the sound of the XXX, why not because its the lowest distortion driver, but the fact that its not ideal for every application... honestly i think that the barhma does sound better than many many woofers some having lglc some sglc some under hung.....

If you want to stipulate a source unit inaccuracy, then over all system accuracy goes right out the window.
And I think you missed my point. The speaker or system outputting less distortion is more 'accurate' (not including freq response considerations etc). Someone may prefer the sound of a tube amp with its even order harmonics, or an ungerhung driver with its increased BL distortion, but that does not make it more accurate. Again, accuracy is a tangible fact, our way of measuring it, and as Neil said, our way of interpretting it, is what is subjective here. But many people turn the fact that measuring it is subjectuve into the idea that accuracy itself, and therefore "SQ", is subjective.

SQ is not subjective, personal preference is. Most people are not trained/experienced enough to discern the difference.

 

[helotaxi 5,000+ posts]

every source will not reproduce the input the same this is why we get this highly arguable subject... like the ago old argument that tube amps sound better... when clipped they present a much more plesent sound. no arguning low disortion is good, but look at some b/l curves and KMS curves plotted in a lab with next to no power isn't always the best solution... many people didn't and don't like the sound of the XXX, why not because its the lowest distortion driver, but the fact that its not ideal for every application... honestly i think that the barhma does sound better than many many woofers some having lglc some sglc some under hung.....

You're totally missing the point. Actual accurate reproduction means low distortion and high linearity. As soon as you talk about running amps into clipping, you've just thrown the whole distortion/linearity thing out the window. Distortion is basically total at that point. Who cares if the result is "pleasing," it is no longer accurate.

Next, why would you discuss using a sub other than how it was intended and then say that's why a linear BL design is bad? You can misuse anything and make it sound bad, just like running an amp into clipping. Beating a sub like a rented mule to the point that you ruin the linearity of the surround and the spider is misuse.

I also don't know of anyone who assumed that flattened BL curve subs (using whatever method they use to get that way) are more efficient. In fact I think that most people who know anything know that exactly the opposite is true. Efficiency and distortion have nothing to do with each other though so who cares. Since amp power is so cheap today, efficiency nearly as important as it used to be and if the goal is accurate sound reproduction you want to keep the driver in the linear range anyway so using what a lot of people consider a tiny amount of power is perfect even with the inefficiency of the linear BL design factored in.

 

[tcguy85 10+ year member]

i understand everybodys point but i think some people go overboard and take the fun out of things.

 

[audioholic 5,000+ posts]

Hoffman's iron law states you actually want low efficiency for some situations.

 

[Bruizer 10+ year member]

Polk SR subwoofers. I have 2 12" SR124-DVC subs in a sealed enclosure and those hit very fast, are very responsive and tight. I've only had them in a week so I'm in the break-in process so I have not seen the full potential these subs have to offer. I'm running a Kicker SX1250.1 which is putting roughly 705watts to both subs. But these are not cheap at all. They sell usually for $350 a pc but I got mine from Crutchfield where they had the buy one polk get one half off so it was rougly $262.50 a pc.