Serious Clipping problem

[Sierra Nate]

I believe there is an issue with these radios. Shop said I was clipping with almost no gain when we first installed my amps. Went and brought the SMD DD1 just to be sure and yeah. I've never seen a radio clip so early with almost nothing set. Want to get rid of it but it was nearly a grand (I believe in supporting brick and mortar when I have the funds to). Next radio will definitely not be a pioneer. I even had to loop filter to stop feedback. Even the rca grounding trick didn't work.
Well let me clarify. The deck doesn't clip at all up to 38 of 40 volume. Soon as amp are connect and gains are adjust from min, clip.

That doesn't fit with my explanation. As I said in the OP, I get absolutely no clipping from HD Radio Source. I only get clipping from USB2 or BT. Both of which source from my phone. And we've already found the problem to be in the settings of the app. The Head Unit is not the problem.

I'm in no position to defend Pioneer. But I can say definitively that I love MY Pioneer 4200NEX head unit.

 

[Sierra Nate]

reason why you dont want any crossovers set on your amp is because your head unit already will put a filter in place. With a both head unit and amp together thats a double filter, you are cutting waaay too much and that leads to the tinny sound.

I did not get a chance to play with the settings as planned last night. However, before heading home I did turn off everything in the head unit and left the crossover setting on the amp as described above. Music sounds much better.

I'm heading over to the funny side of the hill this weekend, parking my RV at my In-Laws house. Will have two solid days to play around with settings. The real test now will be to see if the amp or the head unit provides the better crossover filters. I'm also going to try and find a decent sub to add to the system to fill in some of the filtered bass. Doesn't that seem to make some more sense?

 

[Sierra Nate]

Holy cow. I turned off all crossover on the amp. Went to settings in the head unit, speakers, crossover, hpf on front and rear. Set to 80 with a 12 db curve. It sounds way better! I don't even feel like I need to add a sub now. But I probably will.

Thanks for all the help folks. You guys are awesome.

 

[Jeffdachef 5,000+ posts]

[quote name='Sierra Nate']I did not get a chance to play with the settings as planned last night. However, before heading home I did turn off everything in the head unit and left the crossover setting on the amp as described above. Music sounds much better.

I'm heading over to the funny side of the hill this weekend, parking my RV at my In-Laws house. Will have two solid days to play around with settings. The real test now will be to see if the amp or the head unit provides the better crossover filters. I'm also going to try and find a decent sub to add to the system to fill in some of the filtered bass. Doesn't that seem to make some more sense?[/QUOTE]

As said before, you never use the amp crossovers. Everything should be done at the head unit turn the amp to full pass and set the crossovers on the head unit. Source control is always superior than amp processing due to precise accuracy and signal manipulated at the source rather than a cheapo head unit crossover.

nvm glad you tried it and saw the difference.

Try an 8 or 10 inch subwoofer in a Transmission line enclosure. Not sealed or ported or anything pre-packaged or made. Has to be a transmission line box. Why? because of your music choice you have provided so far. That box will sound best. Sub brand or choice doesnt matter anywhere as close to what the box design will be. @CSCStang customs can provide you with a design and you can build it or have someone local build it or if he's not too busy, he can build and ship as well.

 

[Sierra Nate]

I have a space problem to deal with. My truck is a daily driver as well as a weekend warrior. I keep work related stuff under the seat on the drivers side and off-road gear under the seat on the passenger side. My 4 channel amp is mounted under the front pass seat. Drivers seat has no room for anything. I have kids and grand-kids that sit in the back. Behind the seat has no space at all.

Bottom line...not much room for a transmission line box. If I make one it's going to need to be super small. Will it still be effective?

So here's my thought.... I'll get a slim mounted powered sub that slips under the rear seat above the drive shaft hump. That will be my daily rig. I'll build a separate transmission line sub with a 10 inch sub that can go in the pickup bed when I go to the beach. I'll store that in my camper...and have a hookup for the camper stereo too. Which brings me to my next project. I just bought a 32 foot Iconic Toy Hauler that has a "decent" stereo in it. It has a factory installed JWB HU and a factory installed Kicker sub mounted in the cabinet below the refrigerator. 4 speakers in the cabin area, 2 outside and 2 more in the bedroom. The whole things sounds OK at low volume but sounds like complete garbage when you turn it up. So...now that I'm learning about this stuff I'm planning to put about 2 grand into a new system for the camper.

Funny story,...I bought the camper thinking the stereo was awesome...then upgraded my pickup based on it having a lesser system than my RV...Now I'm going to upgrade the RV to a better system than the pickup. Dog chasing his tail?

 

[Jeffdachef 5,000+ posts]

upload some pictures of your vehicle and possible space you have and we can design a sub setup for it to get you the most bang for buck.

If possible measure length x width x height.

 

[wew lad 5,000+ posts]

really glad we were able to help you get better sound. its nice when people listen to good advice!

something as simple as a ppi900.4 (or even two!, theyre cheap enough) with gain set somewhat low will improve your campers sound at volume tremendously. it sounds terrible at higher volume because your headunit can only put out so much power and you lack headroom

 

[Sierra Nate]

really glad we were able to help you get better sound. its nice when people listen to good advice!
something as simple as a ppi900.4 (or even two!, theyre cheap enough) with gain set somewhat low will improve your campers sound at volume tremendously. it sounds terrible at higher volume because your headunit can only put out so much power and you lack headroom

That would be a quick cheap fix. There is room in the cabinet the head unit is installed in to add the amp. Just need to run power. Off to the audio store for a quick weekend project.

 

[Sierra Nate]

really glad we were able to help you get better sound. its nice when people listen to good advice!
something as simple as a ppi900.4 (or even two!, theyre cheap enough) with gain set somewhat low will improve your campers sound at volume tremendously. it sounds terrible at higher volume because your headunit can only put out so much power and you lack headroom

So...let's discuss this...I'm interested.

The head unit has setting for Speaker A, Speaker B, Speaker C. A is the living room, B is the bedroom and C is outdoors. Then the kicker sub. I can use one 4 channel for the living room which has four speakers. I wonder if they are in series or parallel or individually run...guess I have to put an ohm meter on them. But lets say I run one four channel; for that room. One four channel with fronts going to the bedroom and rear going to the outdoors? Then I need a mono sub for the kicker. Now I need three amps. Obviously, without opening up the cabinet to see what's behind the head unit I'm just guessing, but does that sound right?

 

[wew lad 5,000+ posts]

So...let's discuss this...I'm interested.
The head unit has setting for Speaker A, Speaker B, Speaker C. A is the living room, B is the bedroom and C is outdoors. Then the kicker sub. I can use one 4 channel for the living room which has four speakers. I wonder if they are in series or parallel or individually run...guess I have to put an ohm meter on them. But lets say I run one four channel; for that room. One four channel with fronts going to the bedroom and rear going to the outdoors? Then I need a mono sub for the kicker. Now I need three amps. Obviously, without opening up the cabinet to see what's behind the head unit I'm just guessing, but does that sound right?

sounds right, but you really wont need THAT much power so im going to actually recommend a ppi 900.5 so you can get all your stuff on one amp. and if you need to because the channels are on the same wire (as in two 4 ohm parallel to a 2 ohm load) youll still have plenty of power for both

start by figuring out how its wired, and how you can wire an amp and its power/ground wire. then get an amp and the wiring you need.

you may need a 9 wire conductor to relocate the speaker wires to the amps location. its hard to say without seeing it in front of me but you're on the right track

 

[Sierra Nate]

So just for S&Gs I installed a low profile sub woofer that a friend had in his coat closet. Alpine PWE-s8. Ran 6 gauge wire from the battery post and RCAs to the HU so when I decide on a real sub it's just plug and play. But for now...this thing fills that missing bass and now the system sounds (opps...I may have just sprayed a little) good. But I know it can sound better based on what I learned from you all about the amp and HU crossover adjustments.

So...I turned the Gain all the way up, turned the LP filter up to 150Hz (Max Setting). Turned the volume on the HU up all the way and then turned gain down until distortion went away...about 1/10th of the way from max. Now I go into the HU and set the Sub Woofer crossover to filter everything above 80 since the front and rear is filtering everything below 80? Is that correct? Or do I want a gap between the crossovers? The default for the HU was 125...is Pioneer smarter than me? Probably?

 

[Jeffdachef 5,000+ posts]

set it to 80hz. you should turn the gain down a bit and raise the sub level on the head unit.

dont have any high expectations on what that subwoofer can do. What you hear now is most likely completely tapped out.

Only way to gain a little output is to have the subwoofer load off a solid wall aka having the sub fire towards the back 2-5 inches away from the back wall. if thats not possible than you are at your limit with that sub and enclosure. you cant expect a single 8 on 120 watts to be a lot louder than your door speakers. It'll just slightly fill the void but thats all.

 

[Sierra Nate]

Can't point it at the back wall without removing the back seat. If I do that I may as well build a real sub enclosure. Lol

I was a little surprised how low the volume was. Expected a little more volume. But at the end of the day I probably would have turned the sub volume down if it was louder. I'm not real big on loud thumping bass.

Do I want more? Yes. But not a lot more. I'm still looking at designs on a transmission line that would fit the space I have. It would need to be a smaller speaker. I was able to move some of my gear around and freed up the space under the drivers side of the backseat so maybe that's more feasible now.

But this little sub told me what I was wondering. It definitely sounds better.

 

[wew lad 5,000+ posts]

i had a friend in college who was completely content with a little prefab kicker setup in his tiny f-150 so if thats all the bass you need then so be it lol not all of us are into flexing doors