question about surround foam/rubber.

[brian84corvette 10+ year member]

hey guys,

im Brian Scarbs

and im basicly a car audio newb, sort of...

ive always had a crappy system in my ride of some sorts for the past 7 years,

and now im taking my bass a bit more seriously.

big question here,

the surround of the speakers - foam vs rubber.

whats the deal.

it looks like most all the super top of the line subs are using the rubber surround, instead of the foam.

im personaly biased against foam, but it works fine I guess, until it gets ripped or poked thru or something like that,

I would also imagine that the foam surround is more prone to failure using a sealed box, due to the preassure pushing out on the foam from the cone displacing the air inside the box, it would seem that the foam surround would fail before a rubber surround would in that situatuion yes? no?

im looking to find some subs to browse thru with the rubber surround,

I just dont know off hand what they are, and whats good and what sucks.

there was a video I saw on u tube about a tc sounds sub that was suposed to be a "w7 killer" that had a beautyful looking rubber surround on it. and that sub was playing "free air" with about 2" of cone movment.

are there other subs with the same type of rubber on them?

where do I find them?

thanks for helping a newb out.

im learning,.....

I hope.

Click to read more...

 

[Fast1one 10+ year member]

Mostly strength and durability...after a while foam rots out...

 

[denim 5,000+ posts]

Actually, there have been some advances in foam surrounds that are more then just foam. They last longer, don't crack and dry out like the old foam surrounds, and don't fade in color like the old ones did.

 

If you look deeper, most of the smaller companies who have to put the best product out there they can are using foam surrounds. I used to prefer rubber, but have seen the advantages of foam and the performance improvements.

 

 

[02parkave 5,000+ posts]

rubber is heavier, does last longer, and looks better (imo) is it superior? absolutely not. foam is light, strong, and very durable as well. is it superior? nope. its all in what you are trying to get out of the woofer. a few points here- don't base your sub buying decision off of a video on youtube (or any site) and with current technology- i would venture (and actually, i would put a small amount of $$$ on) the fact that the surround would detach from the cone before breaking because of pressure in the box, be it a foam or a rubber surround. neither is likely to happen... and also- many "foam" surrounds have rubber impregnated (or mixed) into them anymore, anyways.

 

[sqhertz 5,000+ posts]

my fi Q has a foam surround and it has been fine in the hot *** florida weather. its not drying out at all and holds up fine.

i used to think that it would do terrible in the hot and dry conditions in my truck but its the opposite. both have thier pro's and con's , i guess.

 

[djr1423 10+ year member]

my fi Q has a foam surround and it has been fine in the hot *** florida weather. its not drying out at all and holds up fine.i used to think that it would do terrible in the hot and dry conditions in my truck but its the opposite. both have thier pro's and con's , i guess.

how does that fi Q sound? sood SQ? pretty loud?

 

[sqhertz 5,000+ posts]

friggen excellent.

ive only owned a handful of subs , and this is my favorite.

i had a single 8" assassin , pair of tc-1000 8"s , single tc oem 10" (another one of my favorites but didnt have enough power to get it to my liking), pair of alum12q's (girlfriends car) and played around with quite a few sony xplodes. thats all i can remember right now , but i think thats it.

 

[Electrodynamic 10+ year member]

It all depends...and it depends on a few things.

A lot of manufacturers use whatever they think looks the best. Sadly, they know little about the compliance, weight, or sonic affects of using the different types. However, there are many mfg's that know what they're doing too. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

Foam has come a long way. Back in the day foam was good for only 5 years or so. Foams now-a-days are treated and formed differently (usually multiple layers heated and then pressed together to form the final surround) which makes them "stronger" than rubber (mainly because the multiple-layer foam surrounds are much thicker than rubber), which makes them less-likely to invert under extreme SPL applications (read: over 2k watts per driver). Rubber does last longer than foam though even with all the advances that foam has made.

A lot of foam used today is less compliant (more stiff) than rubber is. Rubber is more compliant. Sensitivity-wise they are close now-a-days. Back when foam was making a comeback the mfg's of foam harped about it's sensitivity advantage over rubber (when single-layer, thin, foam was used for surrounds). That all came to a screaching halt when "Santoprene" rubber came out which had the sensitivity of foam but with the physical properties of rubber.

Whether you desire a stiff or "loose" surround depends on the design goals and what the driver is intended for. A lot of the time you either account for a foam or rubber surround in the design process (meaning you account for the compliance of the surround you want to use), or you use a surround that provides you with the desired compliance.

For a SPL monster that is going to see 2k watts in a big ported enclosure, you'll want to use a foam surround due to how much stiffer and stronger it is over rubber.

For a normal driver, you can pretty much use either foam or rubber. Again, it all depends on what your goals are (looks, performance, T/S's, or all 3).

But again, unless it's an intense SPL application, either material will work. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[ThatChevyGuy 5,000+ posts]

Powerbass Es series subs use rubber surrounds, and are now really cheap on ebay. I love them.

 

[Fast1one 10+ year member]

Actually, there have been some advances in foam surrounds that are more then just foam. They last longer, don't crack and dry out like the old foam surrounds, and don't fade in color like the old ones did. 

If you look deeper, most of the smaller companies who have to put the best product out there they can are using foam surrounds. I used to prefer rubber, but have seen the advantages of foam and the performance improvements.

 

Touche, very true...

 

[revrider1 5,000+ posts]

I prefer Rubber surrounds

 

[rhdintegxsi 10+ year member]

the only gripe i've had about rubber surrounds is that after time ive noticed my rubber surround speakers i had had in the past (ie: eclipse aluminum, rf power hx2) have seemed to sag because of the rubber surround deforming. idk wheither it is just supension sag or surround i havent had any problems like that with any subs of foam or rubber/foam surrounds

 

[Electrodynamic 10+ year member]

the only gripe i've had about rubber surrounds is that after time ive noticed my rubber surround speakers i had had in the past (ie: eclipse aluminum, rf power hx2) have seemed to sag because of the rubber surround deforming. idk wheither it is just supension sag or surround i havent had any problems like that with any subs of foam or rubber/foam surrounds

Sounds like overall suspension sag to me - probably not attributed to the surround alone. Not too many rubber surrounds are stiff enough to account for most of the compliance of the subwoofer (except the tall TC unit).