My thoughts on the detriot big 3

[Lugnutz 10+ year member]

I just got to reiterate how retarded the OP is.

 

[duece212 5,000+ posts]

I was supposed to get a pension when I retire and got boned out of it. For existing workers they can stop it if the UAW would let them. For retiree's they have to pay up which they agreed to do in 2010 for the legacy part, and is part of the negotiations to equitize part of it (which I don't agree with)

The new hires aren't going to get a pension from the big 3. Why should people who worked there for 30 years and are retired have to give up their pension in which they promised back in the 70's?

Read my post again, I didn't say those currently retired today should be denied. I did say equitizing part of the payment to the UAW for legacy pension costs is a bad idea even though some senators are pushing it.

 

[Lugnutz 10+ year member]

The union already agreed in the last contract to take over the legacy costs. GM and Chrysler apparently don't have the money the UAW needs.

 

[duece212 5,000+ posts]

The union already agreed in the last contract to take over the legacy costs. GM and Chrysler apparently don't have the money the UAW needs.

This I know...but if the big3 go bankrupt the UAW and its members won't see a dime.

 

[Lugnutz 10+ year member]

This I know...but if the big3 go bankrupt the UAW and its members won't see a dime.

The retirees pensions and health care will be paid by the tax payers. My family is all retired from the big 3 so I could care less if the tax payers want to pay our pension and health care.

 

[duece212 5,000+ posts]

The retirees pensions and health care will be paid by the tax payers. My family is all retired from the big 3 so I could care less if the tax payers want to pay our pension and health care.

It looks like they are government-backed by the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corp. Sounds like payments could still be reduced and healthcare and other benefits could be reduced.

Might be time to find your own healthcare or hope Obama hooks you up //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/tongue.gif.6130eb82179565f6db8d26d6001dcd24.gif

 

[Lugnutz 10+ year member]

It looks like they are government-backed by the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corp. Sounds like payments could still be reduced and healthcare and other benefits could be reduced.
Might be time to find your own healthcare or hope Obama hooks you up //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/tongue.gif.6130eb82179565f6db8d26d6001dcd24.gif

Social security pays about $1400-1800 and Ford will pay about $1100-1400, so my dad will at least get about 2k a month and then hop on medicare. If that is what the tax payers want, then so be it. My uncle took the buyout from GM and is in the same position, plus he has the lump sum from GM. I'm 23, almost 24 so I'm close to losing my dad's healthcare. Once I turn 25, I'll get married to my fiance and hop on her plan.

 

[duece212 5,000+ posts]

Social security pays about $1400-1800 and Ford will pay about $1100-1400, so my dad will at least get about 2k a month and then hop on medicare. If that is what the tax payers want, then so be it. My uncle took the buyout from GM and is in the same position, plus he has the lump sum from GM. I'm 23, almost 24 so I'm close to losing my dad's healthcare. Once I turn 25, I'll get married to my fiance and hop on her plan.

Shit, that isn't bad. Ford sounds the most stable of the 3 from the hearings today.

While I'd like to have a pension when I retire I think they are a dumb business move, especially when employees can be had so readily. Its alot smarter to pay employees a sum or dump it into a 401k for the employee every month so the company doesn't get into this situation. Basically the private sectors social security, neither seem to work.

 

[GreenBook 10+ year member]

I wish my pops was smart enough to take those buyouts. He turned down 3 of them from chrysler, then they just laid off his whole deparment. He ended up with a $1200 a month pension & that's it. He's still got a few years till he can claim his SS i believe. Guess that's what he get's for listening to my retarded mom.

 

[Lugnutz 10+ year member]

Shit, that isn't bad. Ford sounds the most stable of the 3 from the hearings today.
While I'd like to have a pension when I retire I think they are a dumb business move, especially when employees can be had so readily. Its alot smarter to pay employees a sum or dump it into a 401k for the employee every month so the company doesn't get into this situation. Basically the private sectors social security, neither seem to work.

Back in 1973 when my dad hired in, if they new then what they know now, I am certain they wouldn't have offered a pension. Also, my dad would've never spent 30 years there. Ford is pretty stable. They have really turned it around. They have the most cars rated in the top 3 in initial quality, and they also received high marks in safety. Ever since Bill Ford Jr. stepped down and turned it over to Alan Mlullaly, they have done well. Ford is basically just along for the ride. The problem is, if GM goes under, their suppliers will go under and screw up Ford's supplier network.

 

[Lugnutz 10+ year member]

I wish my pops was smart enough to take those buyouts. He turned down 3 of them from chrysler, then they just laid off his whole deparment. He ended up with a $1200 a month pension & that's it. He's still got a few years till he can claim his SS i believe. Guess that's what he get's for listening to my retarded mom.

How many years did he have in? My dad retired from Ford's with 30 years and is getting $2800 from Ford till he turns 62 and draws social security.

 

[DaGh0st 5,000+ posts]

i'm fucked

x2

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif

 

[duece212 5,000+ posts]

Back in 1973 when my dad hired in, if they new then what they know now, I am certain they wouldn't have offered a pension. Also, my dad would've never spent 30 years there. Ford is pretty stable. They have really turned it around. They have the most cars rated in the top 3 in initial quality, and they also received high marks in safety. Ever since Bill Ford Jr. stepped down and turned it over to Alan Mlullaly, they have done well. Ford is basically just along for the ride. The problem is, if GM goes under, their suppliers will go under and screw up Ford's supplier network.

The supplier shit being 100% dependant on the big 3's success is a dumb move by those suppliers. If you don't diversify, no matter what the situation, you are a dumb.

Not saying we should let everybody flail down the river though. Unfortunately the big 3 and the companies that depend on them are too important to let go in our economy right now //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crap.gif.7f4dd41e3e9b23fbd170a1ee6f65cecc.gif

One senator did suggest forcing GM and Chrysler to merge as part of approval for their funds. Sounds great to me, but not sure our government should be the one forcing that...

 

[Flipx99 5,000+ posts]

The new hires aren't going to get a pension from the big 3. Why should people who worked there for 30 years and are retired have to give up their pension in which they promised back in the 70's?

Same thing has happened in virtually every other industry. My father's company had to make the choice of losing the job or losing the pension. They threatened to move to Mexico or some shit if they didn't give up their pensions.

 

[Lugnutz 10+ year member]

The supplier shit being 100% dependant on the big 3's success is a dumb move by those suppliers. If you don't diversify, no matter what the situation, you are a dumb.
Not saying we should let everybody flail down the river though. Unfortunately the big 3 and the companies that depend on them are too important to let go in our economy right now //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crap.gif.7f4dd41e3e9b23fbd170a1ee6f65cecc.gif

One senator did suggest forcing GM and Chrysler to merge as part of approval for their funds. Sounds great to me, but not sure our government should be the one forcing that...

I agree that there isn't enough market share for 3 companies to survive, unless they can start pwning in sales overseas. I hear Ford is doing good overseas.