Midbass lacking!! Subwoofer LPF and amplifier question.

[ladysmanfelpz 10+ year member]

I have a 10" kicker cvx on 400 watts and my 2 way co-ax speakers on 35 watts each. I've been lacking mid bass bad. Only way I can describe it is if you listen to the song "Still in this *****" by B.o.B. and T.I. the mid bass to bass drop is pretty dramatic. It sounds like a puff puff BOOOOOOM!! The amp clips with bass up to high so I keep the eq at -1 for 100 hz and when I am really bumping have to turn it to -2 to avoid clipping. With my old 4 channel amp I had the sub lpf at 120 hz and speakers above that and it sounded pretty good except that the speaker amp was trash and whiny. The new amp has an hpf of 80 hz and is non-adjustable, so I set it up with 80 hz and above to speakers and sub lpf at 85 hz (through deck). I've been thinking of how to resolve this lack of midbass issue that I am having and my idea is to set up filter at 100 hz. I can exchange my old mtx amp for a new model for less than $100 and would give at least 10 more watts to the speakers and have an adjustable hpf. Well I wanted to try before I buy and good thing I did. I set the amp lpf to 100 hz and turned the decks up to 120 hz (amp would override deck correct?) to let the sub take all the way up to 100 and although having some crossover between speaker and amp, get to hear more of the higher bass notes. Hey it is a 10 btw so it should do pretty good up to 100 hz right? Wrong. I don't know if it was just my interpretation, but my sub did not sound near as good. Can 15 hz really take that much quality out of the sub? Was it the crossover between sub and speakers that made it sound not as good?

So I guess overall question is, is should I invest $100 for a new amp to get 10+ watts to each speaker?

Would this be enough power to get more midbass from the speakers?

If I do should I set filters at 100 hz or is 85 hz better for a 10" sub set-up?

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[LosIsATool 5,000+ posts]

You won't get to much out of the coax. Sorry

 

[neo_styles 10+ year member]

Midbass is more about your install rather than power to the speakers. Consider looking at your door panels and seeing if they're properly sealed off between the inner and outer door skin. Another thing you can do is put CCF weatherstripping around the front of the speaker in enough layers to seal off to the door card. Try that first before you consider another amp to get 10W extra. There won't be a perceivable difference in volume.

 

[winkychevelle 10+ year member]

Fix your door speaker install. Your doors should easily play 80hz and above and your subs should be crossed at 80 or lower. Ever notice how easy it is to blow a speaker with high frequency bass where as it is harder with low notes. This is due to the sub being able to cool itself better when moving farther.

Personally I cross my subs at 63hz and my speakers at 50hz

 

[ladysmanfelpz 10+ year member]

I have some hushmat in the doors and the install looks pretty good. Nothing to disrupt backwave though. Wouldn't the 10 watts give it the extra power for down low for the harder midbass notes and elminate all clipping as well?

 

[blazeplacid 10+ year member]

sounds like to many crossovers.

are you wanting your door speakers to get low like a sub???

turn off the crossover on your amp. Set it to all pass or whatever is similar.

put your headunits filter to 80hz on the mids as a starting point then go up or down as you see fit

id put the sub crossover at 80hz and go from there. again....turn off the amps crossovers and use the headunits crossovers

 

[ladysmanfelpz 10+ year member]

My headunits high pass is retarded. Its on or off only and gives no control of frequency and actually cuts out all bass control when on. So 80hz it is for me. So sounds like only way to get more mid bass is put a 6x9 in its own enclosure somewhere in the cabin. Can someone please explain to me or post a link on what I should look for in my speaker installs to have a good seal and get good punch out of them?

 

[maylar 10+ year member]

I have a 10" kicker cvx on 400 watts and my 2 way co-ax speakers on 35 watts each. I've been lacking mid bass bad. Only way I can describe it is if you listen to the song "Still in this *****" by B.o.B. and T.I. the mid bass to bass drop is pretty dramatic. It sounds like a puff puff BOOOOOOM!! The amp clips with bass up to high so I keep the eq at -1 for 100 hz and when I am really bumping have to turn it to -2 to avoid clipping.

How do you know the amp clips? Have you put a scope on it? You might be hearing the speakers hitting xmax.

 

[av83 10+ year member]

Midbass is more about your install rather than power to the speakers. Consider looking at your door panels and seeing if they're properly sealed off between the inner and outer door skin. Another thing you can do is put CCF weatherstripping around the front of the speaker in enough layers to seal off to the door card. Try that first before you consider another amp to get 10W extra. There won't be a perceivable difference in volume.

This. Times eleventy billion. A proper installation will net you infinitely more than ten measly watts.

 

[keep_hope_alive Premium Member]

i agree with the above comments on seals and installs. midbass requires isolation of rear wave and careful control of seals. a bit of effort goes a long way.

sounds like you can get back to what you like by just increasing the sub LPF to 125Hz again. an 80Hz HPF on the speakers is fine. it is just fine to overlap - there is no rule saying you cannot. i run my door woofers with a 50Hz HPF and the subs with an 80Hz LPF (sometimes 125Hz LPF).

 

[hispls 5,000+ posts]

I have some hushmat in the doors and the install looks pretty good. Nothing to disrupt backwave though. Wouldn't the 10 watts give it the extra power for down low for the harder midbass notes and elminate all clipping as well?

The difference between 35 and 45W should be nearly inaudible..... assuming both amps are doing what they claim.

Your problem is more likely phase issue, crossover problem, or lack of proper door traeatment.

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

A possible reason your sub sounded bad with the LPF at 100 Hz is your gain is too high. To get a good blend between the sub and the speakers you will have to turn the sub down to the level of the speakers. If you had better options for setting your crossovers and slopes that would be helpful, but you've gotten some good suggestions to try without changing equipment.

 

[Jroo 10+ year member]

I know install is going to play much to this, but how much midbass is he going to get out a coax on 35 watts? I hear guys with 200 rms playing to 8" saying they are having issues getting the midbass they want. At a certain point, equipment is going to play just as much as the install. Some speakers just cant do under 100 hz no matter what you do for them.

 

[ladysmanfelpz 10+ year member]

Well I'd like to see what I can do first. So how and what do I do to the door speaker to get a proper door seal? If someone has a link explaining that would be great.

 

[ladysmanfelpz 10+ year member]

K what about this. I am ony using the front channel as my speakers are wired up in parallel, so what if I bought that amp, hooked it up to the rear rca's, bridged it and had it powering a shallow mount 6.5 subwoofer under my seat with lpf at 200 hz. Has anyone done something similar? It would definitely cover my midbass and give me some more kick in the cabin.