How to get better lows?

[DaveWS]

Hi all,

I recently installed a low budget audio system into my car (Toyota MR2), and I'm pleased with the result except the bass drops off a lot below 50hz and seems to peak at 100hz - much higher than I'd like. Any idea what I could do to improve things? Would a different driver make a difference? Would porting it make a difference?

I'm limited to this enclosure only, for space reasons: https://mr2-ben.co.uk/products/811

Here's the sub: SPL10.1 10" Inch 25cm 4Ohm SVC Subwoofer 550w RMS

I've plugged some numbers into a calculator from the specs and I get -3db at 57hz (!): mh-audio.nl - Home

The amplifier setup I'm using is also super simplistic, I'm running this DB4.2 4/3/2 Channel Class D Bridgeable Micro Stereo 12v Power Amplifier 400w RMS from a mobile phone headphone jack. One of the problems I have with this is I can only use one channel for the subwoofer, which means it's getting half the volume? - maybe I need a preamp which can output proper 2.1?

Thanks!

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[Jeffdachef 5,000+ posts]

soo many things wrong with this setup. You dont have anywhere near enough space to port it. The box is WAAAY too small for any kind of low end response. Box needs to be roughly 2x the size if your currently in order for it to work in ported.

Get a proper head unit instead of using your phone jack.

Subwoofers normally dont play 50 to 100hz, either your perception of frequencies are off or the box is REALLY extremely small. subwoofers normally play 20 to 60hz especially in a sealed box.

 

[blazian87 10+ year member]

yea there's not much you can do because of space. Unless maybe you were to use your trunk space and go ported. The 10" Dayton HO does well in small spaces ported so maybe you can look into that. Or if you can get a hold of some beefy 6.5" subs in your country, it might work out.

 

[The Camry]

Okay first off.

What are you using to listen to music? Files on your phone? Pandora. Spotify? If your pulling music from streaming like pandora/spotify. They cut off the high and low end of music for compression reasons. If you're downloading songs from like "youtubetomp3", you'll run into the same issue.

Basically anything but a cd or hi res music files will sound terrible in the bass region

99% of phones have terrible DACs. A DAC is what turns your digitally stored song into an analog signal (your aux). Your phone most likely is helping worsen the sq as well.

If you have a headunit laying around. Try hooking that up instead and playing a cd and see if u notice a difference.

Pretty sure you have a weird amp wiring situation going. That amp is putting out 50 rms which is basically nothing for a subwoofer. You may not be even getting output from it and are hearing your other speakers instead.

Id recommend a ppi 900.5 and a sundown sd-3 10. Thatll definitely get you on the right track. Involves spending some money tho

Ill assume you have channels 1+2 on dash speakers and channel 3 on sub. For channel 3, set it to lpf and lower the lpf and see if you get the 100hz attunement you're looking for.

What is 100hz to you btw? What sounds are you referring to? You can check specifics with a free phone rta app

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[shredder1 10+ year member]

yea there's not much you can do because of space. Unless maybe you were to use your trunk space and go ported. The 10" Dayton HO does well in small spaces ported so maybe you can look into that. Or if you can get a hold of some beefy 6.5" subs in your country, it might work out.

Yeah... I'll bet a pair of these powered right even in your boxes... just re-baffle them... would stomp on the 10 you've got!.. (2) SUNDOWN AUDIO SA-6.5 SW D2 6.5" SUBS 200W RMS DUAL 2-OHM SUBWOOFERS SPEAKERS | eBay ... in this case of yours a small sub is a given... IDK... maybe there is enough air there after displacement to externally port them? The box is .75 ft3 right? Run 2 on adequate power and I'm betting that it surprises you.

 

[LosIsATool 5,000+ posts]

Okay first off.
What are you using to listen to music? Files on your phone? Pandora. Spotify? If your pulling music from streaming like pandora/spotify. They cut off the high and low end of music for compression reasons. If you're downloading songs from like "youtubetomp3", you'll run into the same issue.

Basically anything but a cd or hi res music files will sound terrible in the bass region

99% of phones have terrible DACs. A DAC is what turns your digitally stored song into an analog signal (your aux). Your phone most likely is helping worsen the sq as well.

If you have a headunit laying around. Try hooking that up instead and playing a cd and see if u notice a difference.

Pretty sure you have a weird amp wiring situation going. That amp is putting out 50 rms which is basically nothing for a subwoofer. You may not be even getting output from it and are hearing your other speakers instead.

Id recommend a ppi 900.5 and a sundown sd-3 10. Thatll definitely get you on the right track. Involves spending some money tho

Ill assume you have channels 1+2 on dash speakers and channel 3 on sub. For channel 3, set it to lpf and lower the lpf and see if you get the 100hz attunement you're looking for.

What is 100hz to you btw? What sounds are you referring to? You can check specifics with a free phone rta app

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk

They don't cut off the highs and lows. It's just lower resolution. If you pay for it you get 320

 

[The Camry]

They don't cut off the highs and lows. It's just lower resolution. If you pay for it you get 320

Im not going to argue with you. Compression over wireless has an effect on highs and lows. There is data to back it up. Im just not going to start citing just to be right. Hes not paying for hi-res and he wont be, thus i didnt mention it.

Lets not do the usual CA thing and start argueing

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[shredder1 10+ year member]

Yeah... I'll bet a pair of these powered right even in your boxes... just re-baffle them... would stomp on the 10 you've got!.. (2) SUNDOWN AUDIO SA-6.5 SW D2 6.5" SUBS 200W RMS DUAL 2-OHM SUBWOOFERS SPEAKERS | eBay ... in this case of yours a small sub is a given... IDK... maybe there is enough air there after displacement to externally port them? The box is .75 ft3 right? Run 2 on adequate power and I'm betting that it surprises you.

Do you have 2 enclosures, if not I'd get another... They are the same for each side... no?... Everyone talking about your source is correct and this is the FIRST thing I'd change. A real amp, maybe a alpine will be a good choice here... "small footprint"... MRV 450?

 

[youdoofus]

If you take the time and energy to build a custome fiberglass box, you can get more space out of your enclosure to give any sub some more breathing room. Its a time consuming and painstaking process thatll have you making MDF rings fo the sub placement and cross members for supports. Is it a 1990(or after) or a 1989(or before)? if its from the 90s, are you willing to take the center console that connects to your rear firewall out? that would afford you TONS more space for the box, and when its done, you could wrap it in vinyl color matching your interior and it would look pretty smart if you did it well. Plus, if you remove the center part, it could offer a great mounting point for the enclosure

also, for the amp, yes... get something better. even an old ppi 2 channel such as the PC250 for a single sub that youre not wanting to crack the windshield with. the CAB 1500 is a pretty meaty one for $200. you could even put it in your trunk up front since your battery is up there anyways, and run the speaker wires thru a grommet in the firewall.

 

[Jeffdachef 5,000+ posts]

Im not going to argue with you. Compression over wireless has an effect on highs and lows. There is data to back it up. Im just not going to start citing just to be right. Hes not paying for hi-res and he wont be, thus i didnt mention it.
Lets not do the usual CA thing and start argueing

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk

Just saying spotify premium sounds better than flac discographies encoded to 320kbps via usb. What you are talking about is old bluetooth 2.0 where you get loss and compression. Newer phones do not have that issue since everything is approaching bluetooth 4.2 and 5.0 now. Its a whole new age of bluetooth transmission where there's no difference between BT and USB. All the data and test are outdated, technology is rapidly improving and research cant catch up.

 

[DaveWS]

Thanks for the response all.

First of all, I'm definitely NOT an audiophile, but I appreciate "reasonable" audio. Unfortunately using a bigger box is out of the question, and I certainly can't use the boot (there's an engine in the way ). The only place it can go is direct behind the drivers seat, and that custom made box is as big as can be - yes it's 0.75 ft3.

I normally use spotify yes, and I pay for it so 320kbs is plenty good enough for me (I tested cd ripping a few years ago and couldn't tell any difference above 192kbs).

At home I just use basic Logitech Z2300's, which I'm happy enough with. The sub with those is barely 0.5 ft3 (ported, 8 inch), and I get much lower bass even on those.

As for using my phone, again, I'm not an audiophile and to me I can't tell any difference between my phone and my PC when outputting audio to my Z2300's, so I don't really think it's too much of a limiting factor although I realise a head unit would be better. Currently I've got the amp hidden in the dash (space is minimal with this car), so no room for one.

I've got the two door speakers going to ch's 1 & 2, and the sub to 3 (bridged, so in theory it will get up to 100w rms, so similar to my Z2300's).

 

[The Camry]

Just saying spotify premium sounds better than flac discographies encoded to 320kbps via usb. What you are talking about is old bluetooth 2.0 where you get loss and compression. Newer phones do not have that issue since everything is approaching bluetooth 4.2 and 5.0 now. Its a whole new age of bluetooth transmission where there's no difference between BT and USB. All the data and test are outdated, technology is rapidly improving and research cant catch up.

At no point did i or OP mention bluetooth. Yes apt-x is miles better. We are talking wireless from 4g towers to phone

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[youdoofus]

Thanks for the response all.
First of all, I'm definitely NOT an audiophile, but I appreciate "reasonable" audio. Unfortunately using a bigger box is out of the question, and I certainly can't use the boot (there's an engine in the way ). The only place it can go is direct behind the drivers seat, and that custom made box is as big as can be - yes it's 0.75 ft3.

I normally use spotify yes, and I pay for it so 320kbs is plenty good enough for me (I tested cd ripping a few years ago and couldn't tell any difference above 192kbs).

At home I just use basic Logitech Z2300's, which I'm happy enough with. The sub with those is barely 0.5 ft3 (ported, 8 inch), and I get much lower bass even on those.

As for using my phone, again, I'm not an audiophile and to me I can't tell any difference between my phone and my PC when outputting audio to my Z2300's, so I don't really think it's too much of a limiting factor although I realise a head unit would be better. Currently I've got the amp hidden in the dash (space is minimal with this car), so no room for one.

I've got the two door speakers going to ch's 1 & 2, and the sub to 3 (bridged, so in theory it will get up to 100w rms, so similar to my Z2300's).

Dude, you could easily put the amp in either trunk.

 

[LosIsATool 5,000+ posts]

At no point did i or OP mention bluetooth. Yes apt-x is miles better. We are talking wireless from 4g towers to phone


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You can steam 320 as long as you have a good signal.

It's the exact same as a 320 download.

 

[youdoofus]

You can steam 320 as long as you have a good signal. It's the exact same as a 320 download.

i have a 128 GB card on my phone that i use for music in cars that arent mine and hopefully have aux jacks or usb connections LOL. I have a 128 gb flash drive with 320 kb files on it and almost NEVER use a disc and maybe 0.00000001% of the music i play in my car is over data, usually just bluetoothing a song from the phone to the deck because i saw a post on my fb feed or got a text recommending a song, merely for better speakers than that of my phone. I dont see why people dont snatch up a 128 gb card when amazon has them for $25 and be done with it