how do these subs compare for the money?

[thadman 10+ year member]

Each driver offers the same thing...

one just costs twice as much

 

[mannyb18b]

Or the new Mags?

Cause I have heard both, me being the first to have 2 15" Q setup, and the sounds of both drivers are COMPLETLY different

 

[mannyb18b]

Each driver offers the same thing...
one just costs twice as much

ok //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

Hey Buddy...did you read my post at all?

Im guessing NO

I did not say they sound the same, I did not say theyd reach the same SPL figures at the same frequencies.

I said the characteristics of the subwoofer shape its response, (where it will reach maximum excursion) and this response is often coined as Sound Quality. Distortion is much less of an issue vs how the subwoofer performs. You can electronically alter the response of these woofers (either with an equalizer, a passive circuit, or a feedback loop with the use of a servo or accelerometer) each of these subwoofers to sound exactly the same, regardless of their mechanical characteristics.

I also pointed out that there is no magic...or secrets in creating SPL. It is black and white, all a subwoofer is doing is transfering electrical energy to acoustical energy. DISPLACEMENT=OUTPUT.

my point was that Fi's offerings have a MUCH higher DISPLACEMENT potentiality.

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

If you like the sound of a Mag, just setup a circuit so that it performs exactly how the Magnum does.

 

[Johnny Drama 5,000+ posts]

The Fi Qs are a MUCH better value than the Magnums...
Honestly, Stereo Integrity would be nowhere on this forum if certain members havent been saying they are the *shit* when the prices for the sub are so outrageous compared to their competition.

Obvously this is your opinion...They are the best sounding sub I have heard to date. They are plenty loud and definatly worth the price I paid...less then current btw.

Also, members here say that it is the "shit" because it is a very good sub. It might just be the "shit" to us and to everyone who has used them so far.

all a subwoofer is doing is transfering electrical energy to acoustical energy, displacement IS DIRECTLY correlated to output. The reason subwoofers are so inefficient is because they have to compress the air within the box to reach maximum excursion...smaller box requires a higher motor strength to get the same linear excursion.

...Didnt see where this tied into anything discussed. Maybe on the BTL vs. Mag post. Daily I'd pick the mag for the SQ to output over the BTLs...(Only stating due to the fact that most have said that the BTL is close to the MT in many respects.)

SQ is often related to the response curve of the driver, which is determined by its physical characteristics (its suspension, motor strength, weight of moving parts) that determine where it will reach maximum excursion. Lower Q drivers have a much easier time of reaching maximum excursion and thus reach it at a higher frequency, and low-end suffers as a result because the subwoofer doesnt have the extra displacement necessary for the lower octaves. Higher Q drivers on the other hand have a much more difficult job of reaching maximum excursion and thus reach it at a lower frequency where it doesnt have to move as much. The mechanical characteristics of the driver shape its response, but you can alter that with electronic means to whatever you like. A low Q driver can have heavy bottom end if you equalize it!

Not only is SQ subjective, but in most cases two drivers with relativly close Q can and usually do sound completly different. The T/S of a sub isnt everything. Its a start, an idea of what the subs specs in an open but controlled environment. Add the box, power, and car and things will change...thus, no factor in the Mag vs. Q argument.

Lets compare apples to apples (even though...you could still get a Fi Q18 $141 cheaper than a Mag 12)

This is a valid point. You can indeed get an 18" Q for less then a mag 12".

Mag 12 vs Fi Q12

They each have the same surface area and roughly the same linear displacement...so they have the same potentiality of reaching a given sound pressure level. The mag isnt magically a louder driver because it has a bigger motor or because somebody told you it was. Its all a matter of getting each to its respectable xmax (70% of BL strength if I recall correctly?), (im not including xmag in this because neither of these woofers are SPL woofers and shouldnt have a much higher xmag compared to their xmax, and you dont push your woofers to xmag in a daily setup)

I have never, nor will ever state that its louder until I test for myself. At that point it would be specifically to my install.

Each driver has to compress the air within the box, they are working with the same forces. The woofer with the lower motor/suspension characteristics will require a larger compliance of air to reach the same xmax, but that doesnt negate the fact that it is able to reach xmax.

$309 for a Fi Q18 or $450 for a Mag 12?

Again, understandable on the price perspective. Performance per dollar does favor the Q. Doesnt mean that the Q > Mag...

Fi Q18 has 152% more surface area which equates to over 9dB (10dB = doubling of sound pressure levels) and the difference between linear displacement is very minute (24.6 for the mag and 27 for the Q18) so im not including it...

Reeeeeally? an 18" will be louder then a 12"?

If you want to get ***** up the ***...buy the Mag

Wow, I guess my *** is gapping...I have owned two. I am sorry you feel that way, but its very incorrect. The price of the mag more then reflects its performance. Yes, there are cheaper out there. Doesnt mean that anyone is getting *****.

definetley go for the Fi route
I honestly dont understand what the big Mag boner is coming from...you could get a much better driver and or pairs of drivers for the cost of one Mag.

Better? Output yes. SQ...remember its subjective.

Stereo Integritys lineup looks...incredibly bleak compared to its competition and a terrible value:crap: boo to SI

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crying.gif.ec0ebefe590df0251476573bc49e46d8.gif Sure, you can think and feel that way...//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crying.gif.ec0ebefe590df0251476573bc49e46d8.gif

GO BACK TO SELLING DIRECTLY TO THE CONSUMERS!!! I could actually recommend SI when they had their old prices.

Actually its a business...they are there to make money. The more the better. Guess what?...They are doing a good job.

These subs are definatly worth the price.

2 RLP 15s $500 vs 1 Mag 15 $500?

Cool...I like the mags better then the RL-p so what if I can only get one.

Hmm...

Each driver offers the same thing...
one just costs twice as much

Each driver doesnt offer the same thing. Unless they are the EXACT same driver that statement is false. Output they may be similar, and SQ may be subjective, but I'd pick the mag and get "anally *****"(paraphrasing with your words) anyday.

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

...I said SOUND QUALITY was based upon the RESPONSE of the woofer which is shaped by its mechanical characteristics in addition to the transfer function of the car and box being used (transfer function of the car is the same, regardless of what driver is being used). It can be altered to sound whatever you want it to sound like. You could model a sealed box to sound exactly like a ported box, an MT exactly like an idmax.

I also never said a Q would be louder, I said it has the potentiality to get just as loud. If the Q 15 and Mag 15 move the same distance linearly at the same frequency, they WILL achieve the same SPL figures. There are a lot of factors such as compressing the air within the box that hinder the sub from reaching maximum excursion.

and I threw the Q18 out there because it is another option...that is still $140+ cheaper than the Mag 12.

You could buy a pair of RLP 15s and electronically intervene to shape the response to that of the Mag 15...POW you've got the same *Sound Quality* as the Mag 15 but much more output.

The Mag 12s have been labeled the *shit* because they have been exploited to get extremely loud in a certain scenario. That doesnt mean a Q12 couldnt get just as loud if the same amount of work was applied to it.

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

Please, Jntar almighty one, point out what is wrong with these statements ^

You dont seem to be getting the message I was trying to convey...

#1 They each have roughly the same displacement

#2 displacement = output, it is black and white. There are no secrets or magic that a certain woofer may possess that make it defy physics and become louder than the other.

#3 There are several factors that contribute to the woofer reaching maximum excursion (compliance of air being compressed and strength of the motor in accordance with its moving parts)

#4 sound quality is subjective and is often the response of the woofer in its environment

#5 response of the woofer can be altered to sound like whatever you want it to sound like with electronic means such as equalization, a passive circuit, or a feedback loop.

#6 go with the cheaper option

#7 Fi's offer the same thing, but are MUCH cheaper

 

[mannyb18b]

Ok everyone ready.

Heres my explanation.....

Your a Tard

 

[Johnny Drama 5,000+ posts]

Ok everyone ready.

Heres my explanation.....

Your a Tard

Its you're not your //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

 

[Johnny Drama 5,000+ posts]

Please, Jntar almighty one, point out what is wrong with these statements ^
You dont seem to be getting the message I was trying to convey...

#1 They each have roughly the same displacement

#2 displacement = output, it is black and white. There are no secrets or magic that a certain woofer may possess that make it defy physics and become louder than the other.

#3 There are several factors that contribute to the woofer reaching maximum excursion (compliance of air being compressed and strength of the motor in accordance with its moving parts)

#4 sound quality is subjective and is often the response of the woofer in its environment

#5 response of the woofer can be altered to sound like whatever you want it to sound like with electronic means such as equalization, a passive circuit, or a feedback loop.

#6 go with the cheaper option

#7 Fi's offer the same thing, but are MUCH cheaper

Sweet! I am almighty...

Obvously I didnt get the message you were throwing out there...Apparently I am still crying about getting butt *****. You lost credability to me when you typed that.

I dont need to really get into this any further. They aren't the same driver. Both get the job done. I like to pay more I guess //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

getting ***** up the butt...wasnt directed towards anyone. It was supposed to be a funny metaphor:laugh: //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif ...obviously it wasnt seen as that.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/uhoh.gif.c07307dd22ee7e63e22fc8e9c614d1fd.gif

 

[mannyb18b]

Its you're not your //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

Yes I know but my pinky doesnt like extending to the right...//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[dennisthamenace 10+ year member]

where does the tc-3000 fit into all this value to performance?

 

[T3mpest 10+ year member]

I think all thadmans trying to say is that when you get near that level of gear, which can be reached for cheaper, it's not hard to create a similar sound using processing or even playing with your box dimensions. Drivers such as the RLP have similar performance, cost less, and realistically can sound the same, if perhaps coming up a bit short on a meter in SPL, but when you throw price in there, you could simply buy multipe drivers and outdo the mag.