For any one who has experience with the JBL MS8....

[Why So Cereal? 5,000+ posts]

I have a question for you.

I know the MS8, after its done its autotune thing, will have adjusted the levels of the drivers to match each other, which in most cases, will mean lowering the sub levels to SQ reference levels.

While this would be just fine for me daily, I would like to know, have any of you MS8 users come up with a way, or know of a way, that would allow me to sometimes crank the subs to their full potential?

Is there maybe some type of "bypass" mode on it that I can set it to for a while when I feel like bumping?

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[Timmy13091 10+ year member]

i have a question for you.
I know the ms8, after its done its autotune thing, will have adjusted the levels of the drivers to match each other, which in most cases, will mean lowering the sub levels to sq reference levels.

While this would be just fine for me daily, i would like to know, have any of you ms8 users come up with a way, or know of a way, that would allow me to sometimes crank the subs to their full potential?

Is there maybe some type of "bypass" mode on it that i can set it to for a while when i feel like bumping?

blazer!

 

[butterMilk 10+ year member]

Cant you use the ms8 display (if you chose to leave it in) to turn up the bass?

Though I know it turns up the bass on the entire system, including the mids. I think it also changes crossover settings while you turn up bass.

Im not sure, thats also a question I have had as I am looking into getting a ms8.

 

[TaylorFade 10+ year member]

meh.

 

[zako 10+ year member]

MS-8 has a bass control setting. It's not the same as subwoofer control. It's actually a little smarter. As you increase the bass level, not only the subwoofer volume is increased, but the mid bass played through the front speakers is also boosted a little in order to guarantee a nice subwoofer integration when you crank it. I believe there is no manual subwoofer level setting, or is there?

There is a loong discussion about MS-8 on DIYMA, with at least one Harman engineering posting answers sometimes. It may be worth asking there.

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

This is addressed in the giant MS-8 thread on DIYMA, but I can try to answer it to make it easier.

When you calibrate the MS-8 there are sweeps that play through the speakers. These need to be at around the same level as if you had someone in your passenger seat talking. You do this by adjusting the gains on your amplifiers if you have all speakers and your sub powered separately. The subwoofer gain may need to be turned down quite a bit. Andy Wehmeyer always says the bass sweep should be heard but not felt.

During calibration you need to set the volume on the MS-8. This is discussed in the manual. I've had best results setting it at -30, then after it's set up I set it to -10 and use the volume knob on my head unit. For anyone curious reading this thread, this is what worked for me on an all aftermarket system. Do not follow these instructions if your system is different. Read the manual.

If the levels were good during calibration you should have great imaging right away, although it will probably sound thin and lifeless. Don't forget to unplug the mic. If your imaging is good go into the graphic EQ and draw the curve to shape the sound how you want to hear it. I do +9 dB up to 60 Hz, gradually slope it down to 0 before 200 Hz, then it's flat until 10 kHz or so at which point I start to roll it off. This is when you start bringing the gains up on your amps. They all need to come up the same amount to maintain the equalization curve, and the "2V" position is your goal. It doesn't have to be there but this part was left out of the manual and it's what Andy recommends.

Don't turn up the sub amp's gain past 2V. It doesn't have to be precisely at 2V and you can't use a DMM to set it with MS-8. If the bass still isn't loud enough use the sub level in the MS-8 to bring it up.

 

[Why So Cereal? 5,000+ posts]

Thanks man. I got tired of searching that thread lol

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

Thanks man. I got tired of searching that thread lol

So did I. I searched every scrap of info I could get from Andy. I had some troubles getting my MS-8 to sound great and hopefully you can learn from my mistakes.

Here's the Harman target curve for tuning. This is the one they came up with after 30 years of research.

I don't like the treble rolled off that much but below 2K that's basically my graphic EQ.

 

[Why So Cereal? 5,000+ posts]

So did I. I searched every scrap of info I could get from Andy. I had some troubles getting my MS-8 to sound great and hopefully you can learn from my mistakes.
Here's the Harman target curve for tuning. This is the one they came up with after 30 years of research.

I don't like the treble rolled off that much but below 2K that's basically my graphic EQ.

After finally getting things right on the MS8, would u say it was a good investment?

I'm between the MS8, the PS8 and the 6to8.

I keep hearing negative things about the MS8, especially in how restrictive it is to those who like to tweak. Also, I want to be able to control my sub levels a bit more than what the MS8 may allow. But, I haven't played with either so I'm just scouring the forums for tips and tricks at this point before I buy anything.

If I plan to run my Scans, then I'll need to decide on one of them because this build will consist of processed rears and maybe even a center channel speaker.

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

After finally getting things right on the MS8, would u say it was a good investment?
I'm between the MS8, the PS8 and the 6to8.

I keep hearing negative things about the MS8, especially in how restrictive it is to those who like to tweak. Also, I want to be able to control my sub levels a bit more than what the MS8 may allow. But, I haven't played with either so I'm just scouring the forums for tips and tricks at this point before I buy anything.

If I plan to run my Scans, then I'll need to decide on one of them because this build will consist of processed rears and maybe even a center channel speaker.

I have an inconsistent problem with the unit not turning on unless I reset the display's cable, but otherwise I absolutely love my MS-8. The only other processor I've used is the Alpine H700 with the single DIN controller, and I do not miss tuning manually. Even if I had a laptop software interface I still would have issues because of trying to EQ around reflections and all that mess. With the H700 controller right under my head unit I rarely messed with it while driving. I know other people tend to play with something like that all the time if given the opportunity.

I can dial in more than enough sub if I really want it to come on strongly. I'd like it if I could use JBL's wireless bass level knob, but it's not a big deal to me as I usually leave the level alone.

Something to be aware of with MS-8 in the system is it's not going to do well to focus the imaging from your tweeters if they're on axis on the A-pillars. All the reflections make it "think" you have multiple tweeters in various locations and the result is a wandering stage. The same thing can happen if you have small mids on the A-pillars. I took Andy's advice and moved my mids and tweeters to the door panels. It's worked out brilliantly to give me a well defined left, center, and right, with the stage width extending into the A-pillars.

 

[neo_styles 10+ year member]

This is all awesome info and I have done my best to pore through the entire DIYMA thread. Andy's got some great stuff on there.

The one question I don't think got answered has been something that is kinda bugging me. How exactly do you properly set your amp gains prior to calibration. I am used to using test tones for doing that, but it seems that would be impossible with the MS-8 in the middle of the pipeline.

So @trumpet ; and @TaylorFade ; how did you make this work? I'm assuming you set them prior to hooking up the MS-8 and then integrated the unit, but I could be wrong. As much as I'd love to run the PS8 for its optical in, the ease of use with the MS-8 keeps calling me back. Not to mention I can get it for 500 direct from Harmon...

 

[Why So Cereal? 5,000+ posts]

[quote name='neo_styles']This is all awesome info and I have done my best to pore through the entire DIYMA thread. Andy's got some great stuff on there.

The one question I don't think got answered has been something that is kinda bugging me. How exactly do you properly set your amp gains prior to calibration. I am used to using test tones for doing that, but it seems that would be impossible with the MS-8 in the middle of the pipeline.

So @trumpet ; and @TaylorFade ; how did you make this work? I'm assuming you set them prior to hooking up the MS-8 and then integrated the unit, but I could be wrong. As much as I'd love to run the PS8 for its optical in, the ease of use with the MS-8 keeps calling me back. Not to mention I can get it for 500 direct from Harmon...[/QUOTE]

this

 

[trumpet 5,000+ posts]

[quote name='neo_styles']The one question I don't think got answered has been something that is kinda bugging me. How exactly do you properly set your amp gains prior to calibration. I am used to using test tones for doing that, but it seems that would be impossible with the MS-8 in the middle of the pipeline.

So @trumpet ; and @TaylorFade ; how did you make this work? I'm assuming you set them prior to hooking up the MS-8 and then integrated the unit, but I could be wrong. As much as I'd love to run the PS8 for its optical in, the ease of use with the MS-8 keeps calling me back. Not to mention I can get it for 500 direct from Harmon...[/QUOTE]

Before I knew the MS-8 has 2V pre-outs I basically set my gains about halfway before I did the MS-8 input configuration and calibration. You can use the volt meter method to set the gains with the MS-8 as the source. It's set up so you can adjust your levels on the MS-8 and adjust the gains on your amps by ear along with guidance from the instruction manual.

The calibration sweeps need to be roughly 85-90 dB. It doesn't even have to be exact, just normal speaking volume. You check if the levels were correct by unplugging the mic and playing music that you know should image well. If your vocals are centered above the dash you did it right. I've heard the vocal image change place depending on how loud the sweeps are, and at the worst I've had no imaging at all. It's probably the most fiddly part about setting up the MS-8.

To recap, the gains initially get set by ear. Once calibration is done and if you desire more output you go to the amps and slowly turn all your gain knobs up the same amount. Your maximum gain position is roughly the 2V mark.

I'm trying to not rewrite **** that's in the manual, but the gain setting is not properly described in the manual.

 

[neo_styles 10+ year member]

Before I knew the MS-8 has 2V pre-outs I basically set my gains about halfway before I did the MS-8 input configuration and calibration. You can use the volt meter method to set the gains with the MS-8 as the source. It's set up so you can adjust your levels on the MS-8 and adjust the gains on your amps by ear along with guidance from the instruction manual.
The calibration sweeps need to be roughly 85-90 dB. It doesn't even have to be exact, just normal speaking volume. You check if the levels were correct by unplugging the mic and playing music that you know should image well. If your vocals are centered above the dash you did it right. I've heard the vocal image change place depending on how loud the sweeps are, and at the worst I've had no imaging at all. It's probably the most fiddly part about setting up the MS-8.

To recap, the gains initially get set by ear. Once calibration is done and if you desire more output you go to the amps and slowly turn all your gain knobs up the same amount. Your maximum gain position is roughly the 2V mark.

I'm trying to not rewrite **** that's in the manual, but the gain setting is not properly described in the manual.

Fair 'nuff. As long as there's a step by step for it, I can make it work. Thank god for the remote because I'd be SOL doing this in the Tahoe without it.