box broke wtf

[mlstrass 5,000+ posts]

glue dries hard. is it easier to break a stick or a peice of rubber? the glue will crack and box will fall apart if the bond isnt securely held together by screws.

if the box is built like shit this might be the case.

I've broken apart numerous old enclosures that I've built, some with screws and some without. EVERY single one of them the glue joint held and the wood/MDF tears/delaminates. Except for **** *** gorilla jizz which the glue joints separated. Hence the reason I don't use that crap anymore.

 

[ramos 5,000+ posts]

Yes, you can supply a lot of force using clamps. You can put too much. It's also possible to put too little. That's all in the control of the builder whether using clamps or screws.
I never implied that you're better off not clamping. I meant to offer the idea that there could be another cause as to why someone suffered a glue joint failure.

What kind of MDF are you using that holds screws so well it provides more pressure than clamping? I need to buy some of this stuff. You missed my point. Hercules could not tighten a screw into mdf to create the scenario you proposed. Glue failure maybe, something on the surface of the mdf when the glue was applied not allowing the glue to soak into the mdf maybe, crappy glue maybe, "torquing" the screws down so tight he squeezed all the glue out.....//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wow.gif.23d729408e9177caa2a0ed6a2ba6588e.gif

 

[Vermithrax 10+ year member]

What kind of MDF are you using that holds screws so well it provides more pressure than clamping? I need to buy some of this stuff. You missed my point. Hercules could not tighten a screw into mdf to create the scenario you proposed. Glue failure maybe, something on the surface of the mdf when the glue was applied not allowing the glue to soak into the mdf maybe, crappy glue maybe, "torquing" the screws down so tight he squeezed all the glue out.....//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wow.gif.23d729408e9177caa2a0ed6a2ba6588e.gif

I didn't miss your point at all. I think you missed mine.

I meant to offer the idea that there could be another cause as to why someone suffered a glue joint failure.

That was it.

 

[ramos 5,000+ posts]

Your killing me smalls.... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

Well either way, this is about shear strength, not so much glue strength. Though the glue is vital. No butt joint, even with screws, will have the shear strength of a dado or similar locking joint when properly glued and clamped.

 

[ramos 5,000+ posts]

I didn't miss your point at all. I think you missed mine.
I meant to offer the idea that there could be another cause as to why someone suffered a glue joint failure.

That was it.

Another reason yes, the one you suggested, no. I have seen and done all kinds of things to cause glue failures, yet I have never had one because I screwed the box together too tight and squeezed out all the glue //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[da box king 10+ year member]

just stop fegs

 

[mokedaddy 5,000+ posts]

CA.com.

Where even wood glue starts an argument...

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

just stop fegs

Why stop? People may actually be learning.

What say you "da box king"? Show us the light.

 

[Vermithrax 10+ year member]

Another reason yes, the one you suggested, no. I have seen and done all kinds of things to cause glue failures, yet I have never had one because I screwed the box together too tight and squeezed out all the glue //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

Fair enough. I made an error in citing that particular example rather than conferring the actual point that was intended. I can learn from it and move on.

You still seem to be stuck on looking past the intended point for sake of disagreeing with the example. What other possibility do you think could have been a more viable contributor?

 

[mazdakid 5,000+ posts]

I have an mt15 with 2200 watts and the only screws used are the ones to screw the sub in. You don't need screws if you have clamps.

Bobby it seems like you have something new wrong with your system every 2 days?

 

[ramos 5,000+ posts]

Fair enough. I made an error in citing that particular example rather than conferring the actual point that was intended. I can learn from it and move on.
You still seem to be stuck on looking past the intended point for sake of disagreeing with the example. What other possibility do you think could have been a more viable contributor?

I am stuck on disagreeing with the example because it's not a valid one. Wood by nature is porous, mdf is extremely hygroscopic. Most quality wood glues now a days are water based ( notice they always tell you to keep a damp cloth handy to wipe up excess //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif ) By the time you apply the glue properly to both pieces being bonded together, put them together and clamp them. Glue has already started seeping into the wood. Making clamping them to tight null and void.

what do I think ? Could be a number of things.

Bad glue, it happens every once in a while that a crappy batch makes it out. Or the glue had been sitting for a while.

Could be user error, I have seen that a number of times as well. Could be not clamping the joint well enough or allowing it to sit long enough.

But most of the time barring human error, it is caused by a foreign matter on the surface of the wood itself not allowing the capilary action of the glue to take place. Main reason i give a quick once over with some sand paper before I glue anything. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[Vermithrax 10+ year member]

I am stuck on disagreeing with the example because it's not a valid one. Wood by nature is porous, mdf is extremely hygroscopic. Most quality wood glues now a days are water based ( notice they always tell you to keep a damp cloth handy to wipe up excess //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif ) By the time you apply the glue properly to both pieces being bonded together, put them together and clamp them. Glue has already started seeping into the wood. Making clamping them to tight null and void.
what do I think ? Could be a number of things.

Bad glue, it happens every once in a while that a crappy batch makes it out. Or the glue had been sitting for a while.

Could be user error, I have seen that a number of times as well. Could be not clamping the joint well enough or allowing it to sit long enough.

But most of the time barring human error, it is caused by a foreign matter on the surface of the wood itself not allowing the capilary action of the glue to take place. Main reason i give a quick once over with some sand paper before I glue anything. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

I couldn't agree with you more. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[da box king 10+ year member]

Why stop? People may actually be learning.
What say you "da box king"? Show us the light.

Cuz this site is getting to be a joke

and fyi...I glue, clamp, brad nail, then countersink screws to bring boards tighter

works like a charm, the first box I ever made for my ranger(4 years ago) has now been sitting in a field for 1 1/2 years, and is still all together...wood is just swollen a bit:laugh:

 

[basebalz13 10+ year member]

are you serious //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wow.gif.23d729408e9177caa2a0ed6a2ba6588e.gif Clamping puts a hell of a lot more force pushing the two panels together than a screw could even begin to fathom.So are you telling me I would be better off not clamping because too much glue might escape //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/confused.gif.e820e0216602db4765798ac39d28caa9.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crap.gif.7f4dd41e3e9b23fbd170a1ee6f65cecc.gif Please dear god tell me that's not what you just said //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/frown.gif.a3531fa0534503350665a1e957861287.gif

better watch it bud now you shall get flamed by these expert box builders //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif