B&w Vs Svs

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

I'm actually willing to put money on it, my RSS390HF would easily trounce your TC2000 from 50-200hz. The TC may beat a 12" Dayton in output, but just buy another one...hell they only cost a little over $100.

It would lol cause I have mines low passed at 45 hertz... My towers play down to 35 hertz no problems (definitive technology 7001s 2-10"s subs each with a 1800 watt plate amp) But for what my sub was made for 45 hertz hertz all the way down to 10 hertz, I doubt the dayton even 4 would have usable output down to 10 hertz lol

 

[Lil Poot 5,000+ posts]

i think my pb10 nsd sounds really good, use it for my computer system with an svs center and paradigm bookshelves for surrounds on a denon receiver. does the trick.

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

It would lol cause I have mines low passed at 45 hertz... My towers play down to 35 hertz no problems (definitive technology 7001s 2-10"s subs each with a 1800 watt plate amp) But for what my sub was made for 45 hertz hertz all the way down to 10 hertz, I doubt the dayton even 4 would have usable output down to 10 hertz lol

Down to 35hz...no problem? I'm not sure what you consider "no problem", 10% distortion seemed perfectly acceptable and actually good performance to you. Are you not familiar with dynamics?

1800 watts on 2 10s...HA. Why would you need that much power for the home, unless the speakers are miserably inefficient they should only need 200 watts to make your ears bleed. This isn't car audio where you're stuck with tiny boxes and huge power requirements to get any SPL.

FYI, I'd still put money that 2 of the RSS390HFs would trounce your TC2000 down to 10hz in distortion performance and output. It's a matter of physics and the Daytons don't cost much at all, AND have a better/low distortion motor.

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

Down to 35hz...no problem? I'm not sure what you consider "no problem", 10% distortion seemed perfectly acceptable and actually good performance to you. Are you not familiar with dynamics?

It is the standard used by many sub reviewers, you should look into it and maybe learn a thing or two

1800 watts on 2 10s...HA. Why would you need that much power for the home, unless the speakers are miserably inefficient they should only need 200 watts to make your ears bleed. This isn't car audio where you're stuck with tiny boxes and huge power requirements to get any SPL

actually its 3200 for both... (5200 watts total for all my subs) I need that more power for dynamics like you mentioned... 200 watts make your ear bleeds for the lower notes wow... Actually it makes more sense to need more power inside a house then in a car, since their is more air to compress. Or are you telling me that a house can get louder then a car with less power and less cone area?

FYI, I'd still put money that 2 of my RSS390HFs would trounce your TC2000 down to 10hz in distortion performance and output. It's a matter of physics and the Daytons don't cost much at all, AND have a better/low distortion motor.

Are you from the avs forum? LMFAO people over their seem to think modeling is the end all to everything....according to parts express they only have a frequency response down to 18 hertz, which probably means they drop off really bad below that.

Btw You can put all the money on it on earth but without no proof or even owning either then what you say is meaningless... I at least own the tc sub and have the FR graphs of it, do you own either and have FR graphs of it in your application ? Since you are also saying the THD value is low on them find me a graph of one in any box that it was tested in, If not how could you know it has less THD then any of the subs mentioned without real world tests? If so I would love to see the response on it //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif If not then thats like me saying well a velodyne DD 1812 is better then the dayton, but what does it matter I own neither and never will...

 

[joetama 5,000+ posts]

It is the standard used by many sub reviewers, you should look into it and maybe learn a thing or two

actually its 3200 for both... (5200 watts total for all my subs) I need that more power for dynamics like you mentioned... 200 watts make your ear bleeds for the lower notes wow... Actually it makes more sense to need more power inside a house then in a car, since their is more air to compress. Or are you telling me that a house can get louder then a car with less power and less cone area?

 

You really have no clue do you???

Are you from the avs forum? LMFAO people over their seem to think modeling is the end all to everything....according to parts express they only have a frequency response down to 18 hertz, which probably means they drop off really bad below that.

And why do you need a response lower than 18 Hz? How often do you use frequencies below 20? or for that matter 30?

Btw You can put all the money on it on earth but without no proof or even owning either then what you say is meaningless... I at least own the tc sub and have the FR graphs of it, do you own either and have FR graphs of it in your application ? Since you are also saying the THD value is low on them find me a graph of one in any box that it was tested in, If not how could you know it has less THD then any of the subs mentioned without real world tests? If so I would love to see the response on it //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif If not then thats like me saying well a velodyne DD 1812 is better then the dayton, but what does it matter I own neither and never will...

You haven't owned the SVS or the B&W... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

Ever had the feeling that you are just wrong?

[/QUOTE]

 

[newusername 10+ year member]

Without reading everything here...

Yes, I have listened to many sets of B&W speakers. My Uncle has a love affair with B&W that is hard to shake.

And yes, you don't need as much output in a house because the noise floor is substantially lower than in a vehicle.

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

[/b]You really have no clue do you???




And why do you need a response lower than 18 Hz? How often do you use frequencies below 20? or for that matter 30?

You haven't owned the SVS or the B&W... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

I have owned the svs ultra/2 //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

You really have no clue do you???

Then why dont you teach me.... Lets see the b&w fanboy is gonna say b&w is better then the svs, wow I didnt see that coming.

And why do you need a response lower than 18 Hz? How often do you use frequencies below 20? or for that matter 30?

In movies theirs a ton of material below 30 hertz. Heres a list of movies that have even 5 hertz bass, I used to think "who cares about sub 30 hertz bass" but this new sub has opened up new things ive never heard or felt in movies before. Its not like I am the Only ht guy that likes sub 30 hertz bass, If you read in the diy sections no one that ive ever seen for an ht sub ever tune above 20 hertz.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=755493

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

And yes, you don't need as much output in a house because the noise floor is substantially lower than in a vehicle.

But will 200 watts to a subwoofer make your ears bleed in a car or a house //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/confused.gif.e820e0216602db4765798ac39d28caa9.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

The noise floor varies by car... My friends new denali sure is quieter then my explorer and even quieter then my room. But that doesn't mean he is happy with just 200 watts of subwoofer power lol Its all personal preference. Look at how many people have 4-15s or more in their ride including,steve meade,asman,97cavy,justinthorton and the list goes on.

I can point you to a ton of people who have 4-15 or more in their house! one that comes to mind right away is steve meade he built a 4-15" sub setup for his friend chicken and if you go to the home theater sections lots of people have 4-15s, or more.

Their was even a girl a while back building an 8-15" setup with about 20k watts... A GIRL! lol

 

[joetama 5,000+ posts]

I have owned the svs ultra/2 //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

Cool for you guy... But have you owned the sub that is being talked about here. The B&W or the SVS???

Then why dont you teach me.... Lets see the b&w fanboy is gonna say b&w is better then the svs, wow I didnt see that coming.

In movies theirs a ton of material below 30 hertz. Heres a list of movies that have even 5 hertz bass, I used to think "who cares about sub 30 hertz bass" but this new sub has opened up new things ive never heard or felt in movies before. Its not like I am the Only ht guy that likes sub 30 hertz bass, If you read in the diy sections no one that ive ever seen for an ht sub ever tune above 20 hertz.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=755493

B&W is better at somethings and SVS is better at somethings, but you compared pineapple to grapes...

B&W really isn't a movie sub, it is a music sub (and unless you are listening to something really odd 20Hz isn't going to get you much). This just goes back to my thoughts that movies and 5.1 have degraded stereo as a whole. Music is my love. Movies, keep me entertained when other people want to watch something. However, you are a little mother bird, with little or no experience at all you make assumptions from what you read and then regurgitate everything that you have read.

Maybe it is just me but I don't want 1xx.0 db subwoofer volume in my listening area. It is just not enjoyable. Plus, I really don't care if my subwoofer does 94db at 4Hz because for my and most peoples use it just isn't practical.

Plus, I don't know how many times I have said this but NO ONE thinks the PV1 is a kick *** sub. It was designed to be a modern statement where people don't want big bulky boxes, hence the XT Series too. See if you can find some specs on some ASW850 or ASW825. My father has a ASW825 to go with his 804S and it is in a 24' x 32' room with 14' cathedral ceilings with 7ft by 8ft arch ways that go into a very large open entry way and into a kitchen which is very large. Guess what! It is more subwoofer than is needed!!! It will fill the whole house with sound to excess.

B&W is obviously not the right choice for you. Neither is SVS. Or any other manufacturer for that matter.

See, different people have a different quest in life. Some people are purists, some people are modders, some people just don't give a damn, and some people are just ignorant. Which one are you?

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

B&W really isn't a movie sub, it is a music sub (and unless you are listening to something really odd 20Hz isn't going to get you much). This just goes back to my thoughts that movies and 5.1 have degraded stereo as a whole. Music is my love. Movies, keep me entertained when other people want to watch something. However, you are a little mother bird, with little or no experience at all you make assumptions from what you read and then regurgitate everything that you have read.

Ok so your saying it has degraded stereo as a whole right?

Well why dont you get a good stereo setup since they do exist and they havent degraded at all... I can find you audiophile quality mains all day long..

YOU decided to half *** both and not go all out in the sound you crave for stereo and did a 5.1 setup that is lacking also for ht. I bet if you really trully wanted that 2.0 setup then you could just sell the sub and surrounds and center and go to some higher end mains and processing.. It is YOUR choice not to do so, Ht has been around for years... So don't blame it on that.

Experience?? Do you know my background? I sure dont know what you know and neither do you know what I know... stop acting like a teeneger and think you know it all, their is always something new to learn.

btw for Ht my setup is better then yours which is what I wanted not stereo sound... YOU want stereo and are compromising with the 5.1 setup you have, stop complaining and change it.

 

[negativezeroz 5,000+ posts]

Everyone's ears are different so go ahead and argue but it comes down to what each individual likes.

 

[thadman 10+ year member]

It is the standard used by many sub reviewers, you should look into it and maybe learn a thing or two

Are you kidding me? Just from reading your posts, you know nothing of speaker design or physics other than what you heard was "the shit".

actually its 3200 for both... (5200 watts total for all my subs) I need that more power for dynamics like you mentioned... 200 watts make your ear bleeds for the lower notes wow... Actually it makes more sense to need more power inside a house then in a car, since their is more air to compress. Or are you telling me that a house can get louder then a car with less power and less cone area?

 

Have you factored in power compression at all? Theres no way each ten can handle 900 watts without severe power compression.

 

And yes, I am telling you less power is required in the home...but you obviously have no idea what you're talking about. You know a little about car audio and just apply those concepts to the home, the transition from car to home is quite drastic FYI. Home speakers are often much more efficient across a given bandwidth than car speakers, which alleviates their power requirements significantly.

 

I'm pretty sure everyone on this forum will agree, that you don't know what you're talking about. Please leave, become educated and stop embarrassing yourself. Come back when you know a little.

 

Are you from the avs forum? LMFAO people over their seem to think modeling is the end all to everything....according to parts express they only have a frequency response down to 18 hertz, which probably means they drop off really bad below that.

 

No, I'm not from AVS. What have I done to give you the impression that I think modeling is everything? Equalization can fix the response, modeling is definitely not the end all be all. I provided you with objective data of a Dayton RSS315HF measured free air (ie IB) between 100-106dB...that level of output is comparable with your SVS. The Dayton has MUCH MUCH less distortion. Also, the Dayton has a free air resonance of 18hz...thats definitely not the lowest it can go.

 

Btw You can put all the money on it on earth but without no proof or even owning either then what you say is meaningless... I at least own the tc sub and have the FR graphs of it, do you own either and have FR graphs of it in your application ? Since you are also saying the THD value is low on them find me a graph of one in any box that it was tested in, If not how could you know it has less THD then any of the subs mentioned without real world tests? If so I would love to see the response on it //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif If not then thats like me saying well a velodyne DD 1812 is better then the dayton, but what does it matter I own neither and never will...

 

I have provided you with distortion plots of the driver in my application. What you're arguing doesn't make sense...we both have objective data regarding the drivers. Your driver has 10% distortion at the lowest, the RSS315HF has way below 1% all the way up to 200hz. Thats like saying, we will never know who will win in a race a go cart or a porsche... We have objective data for both. The go cart goes 30mph and the Porsche goes 180mph...but we'll never know which one would win a race would we? Shame

[/QUOTE]

 

[1loudsuv 10+ year member]

Are you kidding me? Just from reading your posts, you know nothing of speaker design or physics other than what you heard was "the shit".

I have more proof and experience in my pinky then you ever will... by the who the fudge are you? some 15 year old boy? //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/graduate.gif.d982460be9f153bb54e5d4cb744f6ae8.gif

Have you factored in power compression at all? Theres no way each ten can handle 900 watts without severe power compression.

Ya it is unheard of, of a sub to handle 900 watts... power compression? I can give two shits about stupid graphs and all, the thing that matters to me is  

1. it sounds good to my ear

2. it gets loud

3. looks good

 

If you have different goals don't try to implement them onto me cause they are useless to me...//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/redface.gif.62fdbfe1a101588a808c4cff71bcb942.gif

And yes, I am telling you less power is required in the home...but you obviously have no idea what you're talking about. You know a little about car audio and just apply those concepts to the home, the transition from car to home is quite drastic FYI. Home speakers are often much more efficient across a given bandwidth than car speakers, which alleviates their power requirements significantly.

I'm pretty sure everyone on this forum will agree, that you don't know what you're talking about. Please leave, become educated and stop embarrassing yourself. Come back when you know a little.

Yep you and your lover joetemaam agree //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/redface.gif.62fdbfe1a101588a808c4cff71bcb942.gif You can argue all you want but in the end I have the proof of at least 7 years of experience in car audio... where is your proof? My box was designed/built by someone who shits more knowledge then you do //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/redface.gif.62fdbfe1a101588a808c4cff71bcb942.gif

I have provided you with distortion plots of the driver in my application. What you're arguing doesn't make sense...we both have objective data regarding the drivers. Your driver has 10% distortion at the lowest, the RSS315HF has way below 1% all the way up to 200hz. Thats like saying, we will never know who will win in a race a go cart or a porsche... We have objective data for both. The go cart goes 30mph and the Porsche goes 180mph...but we'll never know which one would win a race would we? Shame

OK let me see just the THD graph no other nonsense....

BTW go enjoy your $100 sub I bet it sound "the bomb" to you. and go play with some more modeling and graphs.... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/nerd.gif.c6fa51ddf7ff75f1c0371fbc648f70ae.gif

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

Ya it is unheard of, of a sub to handle 900 watts... power compression? I can give two shits about stupid graphs and all, the thing that matters to me is

 

1. it sounds good to my ear

2. it gets loud

3. looks good

 

Just curious.....you mention power compression then state you could care less about graphs. Do you know what power compression is?

 

 

 

 

I also find these statements funny, considering you started this thread by posting graphs:

 

I can give two shits about stupid graphs and all, the thing that matters to me is  

1. it sounds good to my ear

2. it gets loud

3. looks good

 

......and go play with some more modeling and graphs.... //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/nerd.gif.c6fa51ddf7ff75f1c0371fbc648f70ae.gif