advice on sound deaden

[jakl27 10+ year member]

let me explain my setup

f-150 single cab.

mb quart q series components (will have midbass in doors and tweeters mounted in a pillar)

re se 10 (600w rms).

Please answer in order as each next question depends on the prior one.

question #1: what sound deading do i need since i have a simple system? im thinking roof, back wall, floor and both doors. thats all i need right?

question #2: What company do i choose? i heard of secondskin but im thinking thats a real expensive choice since i have a small system.

question #3: What type of sound deadning for each part? Multiple types (sludge and mat) for floor, door, etc? or just mat our just sludge?

question #4": probally most important. how many layers do i use on each individual section? (so i can decide on how many gallons or sq ft of ma i need)

thanks in advannce guys.

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[jakl27 10+ year member]

bump

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

question #1: what sound deading do i need since i have a simple system? im thinking roof, back wall, floor and both doors. thats all i need right?

LOL...what else does that leave you? That's pretty much the entire cabin.

Doors, floor, back wall, side walls. I wouldn't bother with the roof, or atleast do minimal deadening there. Just a few sheets.

question #2: What company do i choose? i heard of secondskin but im thinking thats a real expensive choice since i have a small system.

http://www.raamaudio.com

IMHO best mat on the market in terms of price/performance. Dynamat Extreme and SecondSkin Damplifier Pro could be considered "better". But they are also considerably more expensive. And I personally liked my Raammat better than the SS Damplifier I used.

question #3: What type of sound deadning for each part? Multiple types (sludge and mat) for floor, door, etc? or just mat our just sludge?

Depends on what you are trying to accomplish. If you are just trying to kill resonances, mat deadener alone would be fine. If you are trying to kill road noise aswell, then you will want to use a combination of liquid, mat deadener and foam.

Mat has a little better sheer mass loading properties. Liquid has the best combination of mass and barrier loading properties. Then the foam for pure barrier loading.

question #4": probally most important. how many layers do i use on each individual section? (so i can decide on how many gallons or sq ft of ma i need)

Depends on how bad the resonances are. Doors I would use 2 layers mat on both outter and inner door metal, ~2mm thickness liquid then 1-2 layers of foam. Sealing the door with the deadener.

Floor/firewall and backwall I would use 1 layer of mat all over. Then add mat where need to further kill resonances. Then 2mm liquid over that, along with a layer or two of foam (such as Ensolite).

That's how I would attack it, atleast.

 

[jakl27 10+ year member]

thanks for the reply. i checked out the site they only have 3 products, is that right? is raamat asphalt? i heard that smells alot an that second skin doesnt smell. is asphalt better? oh i want to remove road noise as sometimes i like quiet trips in my car (i also have a dual side exhaust on the passeneger side near the door). so 2 layers of mat and some sludge would be fine for every body part i said?

pardon the post whoring, im a big newb to all this sound deadning, only heard the results in a car and i love it.

 

[jakl27 10+ year member]

well i was looking through the site of raamat, all i need is there mat and glue that foam for every section? u mentioned liquid , thats from second skin? if so get the sludge or the liquid.

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

thanks for the reply. i checked out the site they only have 3 products, is that right?

If you count the glue; yes

is raamat asphalt?

Butyle rubber

i heard that smells alot an that second skin doesnt smell. is asphalt better?

No, butyl rubber is better.

Second skin doesn't smell because they also use buytl rubber. Raammat doesn't smell either, for that same reason.

so 2 layers of mat and some sludge would be fine for every body part i said?

I would use Raammat mat deadener, Raammat's Ensolite for foam, and Second Skin's Spectrum for liquid.

 

[jakl27 10+ year member]

ok well im about to order. thought it would be cheaper, but o well, i want quality.

im thinking:

20 q ft per door (covering the outer skin and both sides of the inner skin with 2 layers and another layer behind the mid bass).

so for 40 sqft

40 sq ft for floor and some firewall(2 layers)

25 sq ft for back wall (2 layers)

25 sq ft for roof (2 layers)

misc (pillars, etc.): left overs.

now i know i need foam, do i still need a deflex pad behind the midbass if i use foam?

where should i put foam besides one sheet inside each door?

k now spectrum or spectrum sludge, which one or both and where should i put them.

feel free to adjust the amount of layers for each part.

thanks.

 

[bjfish11 5,000+ posts]

i just ordered 4 gallons of spectrum. I was told that the sludge is very hard to work with since it is such a thick paste. I went ahead and bought the sprayer too, thinking that will make the spectrum pretty easy to put on.

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

now i know i need foam, do i still need a deflex pad behind the midbass if i use foam?

Yeah. The foam is there to block road noise. The deflex paid is there to clean up some wave issues with the mid.

where should i put foam besides one sheet inside each door?

Floor, and possibly back wall.

k now spectrum or spectrum sludge, which one or both and where should i put them.

I would get the spectrum.

 

[jakl27 10+ year member]

k i spectrum everything right? (be specific), also put spectrum before foam correct?

 

[jakl27 10+ year member]

also how many sq ft does one gallon in one layer? do i put multiple layers?

sorry for post whoring ya. just real new to this deaden stuff and wanna do it right the frst time.

 

[Anthony Collova 10+ year member]

1 gallon of Spectrum will cover 40 sq feet at 1mm thick.

This is for spectrum or anything else..

IT doesnt matter what is in the bucket.

some manufactures will tell you that you can apply their liquids at 2mm thick and get 50 feet out of a bucket..

I am curious how these companies change the rules of mathmatics....

ANT

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

k i spectrum everything right? (be specific), also put spectrum before foam correct?

Yes and yes.

do i put multiple layers?

It is better to put multiple thinner layers as opposed to one thick layer.

 

[adhumston 10+ year member]

okay, i will be doing the same thing, so i want to be sure i got this right. first you lay down the mat, then you use the spectrum, and once that cures you put down the ensolite? the spectrum doesn't have any problems sticking to the foil on the mat?

 

[tplaya07 10+ year member]

I have an S-10 extended cab. What I did was gut the interior, and put about 4 gallons of spectrum sludge over the entire floor, back wall, inner firewall, outer doors, roof, and even did in the wheel wells. I didn't buy the sprayer, but was told that most people just apply it with some sort of puddy knife. I found that just wearing some disposable gloves and applying it by hand was the easiest way to go about it, and in doing so, you are able to feel the contours of the vehicle as well, and try to maintain a uniform thickness. After applying it by hand, you can go back over it with the puddy knife to smooth it out, if you like.

Also, I have to disagree with Squeak to a certain extent on deadening the roof. While I concur that in a car, the trunk will likely be absorbing/vibrating the brunt of the sub's vibrations, the roof of a truck tends to do the same thing...being the large chunk of flexible sheet metal that it is. I hate when you can hear metal (roof or trunk) over the sound of the bass itself. I also did the entire roof with both Sludge and Overkill (closed cell foam), just so that the majority of the sound would stay inside the vehicle, rather than eminate (sp??) throughout the neighborhood...making it more noticeable to would be thieves.

I also got some damplifier Pro, which I put under the hood, on the inner doors (the metal that the panel attatched to), and a few other small places that it seemed easier to do mat than liquid. The hood was recommend by ANT, and one of the first thing I did (before the sludge and everything else), as I was skeptical about any improvement it would make there. After an entire layer of Damplifier was placed under the hood, I started the truck up and really noticed no difference whatsoever (probably due to the sound reflections from bouncing right back up off the driveway). However, I did notice a bit of improvement while driving. Before, alot of the engine noise could be heard coming through at windshield level, but it now was quite deteriorated, and mainly just heard from the sides of the vehicle.

I luckily did not have a ton of rattling in the doors to begin with, as I have a newer vehicle, so I really didn't not notice a ton of difference in this department. I am certain though that over time, without the deadener, the rattles/vibrations would increase greatly over time, as things begin to loosen.

Overkill (neoprene, closed cell barrier) was added to the roof, floor, doors (between panel and metal), inner firewall, and many other little areas like behind the jumpseat, etc. This, in combination with the deadener, made a HUGE difference in road noise, wind noise, and the liking. Cars/trucks/semi's with loud exhaust systems or engines were greatly diminished, and you no longer heard that "woosh" sound as you would pass vehilcles on a 2-lane road. I ripped off the cheap absorbant backing on the carpet, to make more room for the better neoprene/ closed cell foam for sound absorption. Foam on the floor and rear cab wall will greatly reduce the amount of engine/transmission/exhaust noise that radiates through the cabin floor. All of these nuances gone allowed for a much more peaceful interior that would allow to just enjoy the music while driving.

Finally, rattle pad was added to the door panels, behind the A-pillars, third door, and other small areas that I thought could pose a problem. Again, I did not have a big problem with rattles/vibrations in the first place, so I did not notice a huge improvement in this area. More for just peace of mind.

I hope that better explains what each material will do in certain areas of the vehicle, so that you can focus more on trouble areas if needs be.