adding an extral battery helps?

[ahole-ic]

Correction: That is a 100% efficiency system. And you are assuming that the only thing the amp can draw power from is the alt. Why do you think adding an extra battery helps his voltage drops?
I run an amp that has put out a full 1500 watts. Stock alt is 95 amp. Being that It delivered a full 1500 watts It had to draw > 104.16 amps. Thats a little more than 95 especially when coupled with the 20 some amps the car uses when on. and The other mid amp and HU. Does everything die? no Because the battery supplies the extra current needed for a limited time.

This works because an amp that reaches that kind of output won't be reaching it all the time. Giving the battery time to recharge. It depends on the "amp hours" the battery can supply and how easily the battery can be re-charged (whether its old or not.)

A 100 amp hour battery can deliver 100 amps for an hour, 200 amps for 30 minutes, 400 amps for 15 minutes. and so on. Of course, the higher the discharge the lower the efficiency.

Thanks for the lesson pal. I don't think he or I needed it as we're well aware of how the charging system works. When you corrected his lack of showing efficiency, that would have actually only reinforced his point. Drawing the power for 5000 watts vs 1500-2000 are different animals. If you're running a 5000 watt amp, you're not playing music at full power. You only play tones at full power. 5000 watts burped might last for one burp here or there, but it won't last much longer than that on 2 batteries. Also, your amp doesn't do full power at 12v most likely. The efficiency really drops going from 14.4 to 12v. It's incredibly hard on the alternator. To you guys who do it and recommend it, you're only making noobs that much more uneducated. It might work for you for now, but soon you'll need a tow and a new alt. Have fun with that mr. knowitall.

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

Oh yeah, and op its a 2500 watt amp. Peak voltage ratings are for newbs. But I will say its SN ratio looks terrible at 59 //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crap.gif.7f4dd41e3e9b23fbd170a1ee6f65cecc.gif

 

[DidUHearThat? 10+ year member]

Correction: That is a 100% efficiency system. And you are assuming that the only thing the amp can draw power from is the alt. Why do you think adding an extra battery helps his voltage drops?I run an amp that has put out a full 1500 watts. Stock alt is 95 amp. Being that It delivered a full 1500 watts It had to draw > 104.16 amps. Thats a little more than 95 especially when coupled with the 20 some amps the car uses when on. and The other mid amp and HU. Does everything die? no Because the battery supplies the extra current needed for a limited time.

This works because an amp that reaches that kind of output won't be reaching it all the time. Giving the battery time to recharge. It depends on the "amp hours" the battery can supply and how easily the battery can be re-charged (whether its old or not.)

A 100 amp hour battery can deliver 100 amps for an hour, 200 amps for 30 minutes, 400 amps for 15 minutes. and so on. Of course, the higher the discharge the lower the efficiency.

No, it's not a 100% efficency system. It is a gross calculation of potential draw versus potential input. Not even close. My statement is 100% accurate. A 90 watt [sic] alt cannot power a 5kw amp. If you have an abusrd pile of batts (10+), you could power it for a few minutes, but the 90 amp alt cannot provide a reasonable recharge time. 5 hours recharge to get 4 minutes of play time in a daily driver? No, 100% fail system. He needs AAA, because he will be broken down somewhere in the first week.

Your system has a much tighter input to output potential, simialr to mine. A decent battery, or two, can make up a small shortfall for limited periods of time, but not at more than 3 times the source power. Ultimately the alt is the ONLY source of power. Noobs need to be told point blank you can't power jiggawatt amps from lawn mower sized electrical systems. Don't waste your money on 5kw amps when you can't power them. If you want to run with the big dogs, look at the electrical systems that they use. If you want to use stock electrical then you need to manage your energy budget intelligently. 5kw class AB amp on 90 watt [sic] stock electrical = fail.

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

Thanks for the lesson pal. I don't think he or I needed it as we're well aware of how the charging system works. When you corrected his lack of showing efficiency, that would have actually only reinforced his point. Drawing the power for 5000 watts vs 1500-2000 are different animals. If you're running a 5000 watt amp, you're not playing music at full power. You only play tones at full power. 5000 watts burped might last for one burp here or there, but it won't last much longer than that on 2 batteries. Also, your amp doesn't do full power at 12v most likely. The efficiency really drops going from 14.4 to 12v. It's incredibly hard on the alternator. To you guys who do it and recommend it, you're only making noobs that much more uneducated. It might work for you for now, but soon you'll need a tow and a new alt. Have fun with that mr. knowitall.

Ouch buthurt much?

First of all I think its more than safe to assume HE had NO knowledge of electrical systems just by the fact that he stated peak voltage as a meaningful measure. If you don't think so, you are just as ignorant (in the amount of knowledge sense, not the insult sense) as him!.

And it matters not, Battery amp hours are given at 12 volts. Yes like I said the efficiency goes down the higher the amp over less time, but thats how it works and thats how people ride around getting what should be 120 and 200 amps of alternation generation from a 90 amp alt.

Tell me, since I'm the know-it-all and should spread the opportunity to depart this amazing knowledge you apparently posses...

How, in ANY way, Is discharging more than a normal load on an power generation source bad for that source? Do this windings start saying "F U, i'm going on strike?" //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

Now is it bad for the battery? Sure, because every time the battery charges and discharges Ions are lost, and current delivery becomes less efficient. That said, current supplied by the alternator declines over time too but no more in an amp suppling 50 amps than in one suppling 20. because alternator current is constant based on RPMs not draw.

A batteries current supply is regulated by that very current draw, and alt is regulated by engine RPMs.

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

No, it's not a 100% efficency system. It is a gross calculation of potential draw versus potential input. Not even close. My statement is 100% accurate. A 90 watt alt cannot power a 5kw amp. If you have an abusrd pile of batts (10+), you could power it for a few minutes, but the 90 amp alt cannot provide a reasonable recharge time. 5 hours recharge to get 4 minutes of play time in a daily driver? No, 100% fail system. He needs AAA, because he will be broken down somewhere in the first week.
Your system has a much tighter input to output potential, simialr to mine. A decent battery, or two, can make up a small shortfall for limited periods of time, but not at more than 3 times the source power. Ultimately the alt is the ONLY source of power. Noobs need to be told point blank you can't power jiggawatt amps from lawn mower sized electrical systems. Don't waste your money on 5kw amps when you can't power them. If you want to run with the big dogs, look at the electrical systems that they use. If you want to use stock electrial then you need to manage your energy budget intelligently. 5kw class AB amp on 90 watt [sic] stock electrical = fail.

Thats just not true. How long can you run your radio at normal tilt with the engine not running and still have current? Well imagine adding a constant 90 amp charging source and you can power alot more than an amp that reaches a peak of 120 amp draw. Simply because if its peaking at 120amps, it will be spending most of its time at a reasonable level of current draw, meaning the battery will have plenty of time to recharge between hits.

 

[memphis_vette 10+ year member]

battle royal!!!

 

[RJesus 10+ year member]

I must say this thread was full of laughs until everything got serious.

People set their amp's gains with a test tone recorded at 0db, right?

Music is usually recorded at -6 db, right?

so a 1000w amp usually puts out about 500w, and only reaches 1000w on very loud bass notes. Right?

 

[DidUHearThat? 10+ year member]

Thats just not true. How long can you run your radio at normal tilt with the engine not running and still have current? Well imagine adding a constant 90 amp charging source and you can power alot more than an amp that reaches a peak of 120 amp draw. Simply because if its peaking at 120amps, it will be spending most of its time at a reasonable level of current draw, meaning the battery will have plenty of time to recharge between hits.

Step away from the crack pipe if you think you can power a 5kw amplifier with a 90 watt alternator [sic]. I realize it's not really 5kw amplifer or 90 watt alt. Obviously he's a noob who doesn't understand these terms and your just confusing and distracting him with discussions of reserve power and peak versus current draw. Irrelevent. It's simple; no, you can't power that amp with that electrical. Get over it. Are you going to come pick him up when his car is broken down on the side of the road because his electrical system is dead? Do you think a noob is NOT going to pound the shit out of his system till it dies? Of course he will. 2 dead alts, 4 dead batts and 3 tow trucks later maybe you'll both realize something here isn't adding up.

I don't know where you got the 120 amp figure, but that's wrong. 2500 watts is 178 amps @ 14.4v @ 100% efficency. A 90 amp alt does not provide 90 amps of constant current. 50% - 70% at idle, not counting, the vehicles needs, voltage dips due to high current drain or thin stock power wire. Even allowing for average draw, charging time, reserve capacity and magic fairy dust; no, he will kill his electrical with that system and he will never give that amp the power it needs.

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

Step away from the crack pipe if you think you can power a 5kw amplifier with a 90 watt alternator [sic]. I realize it's not really 5kw amplifer or 90 watt alt. Obviously he's a noob who doesn't understand these terms and your just confusing and distracting him with discussions of reserve power and peak versus current draw. Irrelevent. It's simple; no, you can't power that amp with that electrical. Get over it. Are you going to come pick him up when his car is broken down on the side of the road because his electrical system is dead? Do you think a noob is NOT going to pound the shit out of his system till it dies? Of course he will. 2 dead alts, 4 dead batts and 3 tow trucks later maybe you'll both realize something here isn't adding up.
I don't know where you got the 120 amp figure, but that's wrong. 2500 watts is 178 amps @ 14.4v @ 100% efficency. A 90 amp alt does not provide 90 amps of constant current. 50% - 70% at idle, not counting, the vehicles needs, voltage dips due to high current drain or thin stock power wire. Even allowing for average draw, charging time, reserve capacity and magic fairy dust; no, he will kill his electrical with that system and he will never give that amp the power it needs.

No I ignored what he said and paid attention to what he meant. It is perfectly possible to run a 2500watt amp off of a 90amp alt, and 2 high amp hour batteries. Thats what I was explaining, That doesn't change the fact that you can run a 5kw amp on the same system for a few minutes, would I recommend it? Of course not, is it possible? sure is. But as I said the higher the current discharge, the more inefficient the battery discharge and charge. Thats a major reason cars have such larger capacity for current draw than necessary. However, a higher current draw is harder on the BATTERY(S). not the alternator. The alternator delivers the same current potential at all times, although this current is controlled by the voltage regulator. You simply can't "DISCHARGE" an alternator because it doesn't store a charge. It's output is a constant modified by the output regulator. Or X(h)|h>1 where X is a constant and h is variable. So if your alt is 90 amp your equation is 90(h)|h>1

Even if your h is 1. (100% delivery of the amps current supply) The nominal current of the alt does not change.

More importantly you are one of those really annoying forum members who pretends to not understand logical arguments and gives highly specified rebuttals with the intention of either protecting your as$ from looking wrong, or intensionally causing arguments, Ive seen you do it many times.

The fact is you know i'm right, And you understand my argument. Whether or not you can admit this, and thus apply the information to the given situation will determine your maturity and self image.

 

[RJesus 10+ year member]

cotjones has 2x more posts.... obv hes correct.

 

[k_schutte 10+ year member]

who cares... we all know what this guy needs is a 100 Farad CAP!

Brand X 100 Farad Capacitor Huge Cap XFL100F - eBay (item 320458709380 end time Mar-05-10 15:32:02 PST)

 

[cotjones 10+ year member]

cotjones has 2x more posts.... obv hes correct.

The only one implying that the length or quantity of posts has any determining value on validity is you.

It could be a valid argument against me if you were able to discredit ANY information contained in the posts themselves but unsurprisingly you can't.

THAT, my friend is what makes me correct. Not the length or amount of my posts.

:facepalm: just another stereotypical CA.com post.

 

[ahole-ic]

Ouch buthurt much?
First of all I think its more than safe to assume HE had NO knowledge of electrical systems just by the fact that he stated peak voltage as a meaningful measure. If you don't think so, you are just as ignorant (in the amount of knowledge sense, not the insult sense) as him!.

And it matters not, Battery amp hours are given at 12 volts. Yes like I said the efficiency goes down the higher the amp over less time, but thats how it works and thats how people ride around getting what should be 120 and 200 amps of alternation generation from a 90 amp alt.

Tell me, since I'm the know-it-all and should spread the opportunity to depart this amazing knowledge you apparently posses...

How, in ANY way, Is discharging more than a normal load on an power generation source bad for that source? Do this windings start saying "F U, i'm going on strike?" //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

Now is it bad for the battery? Sure, because every time the battery charges and discharges Ions are lost, and current delivery becomes less efficient. That said, current supplied by the alternator declines over time too but no more in an amp suppling 50 amps than in one suppling 20. because alternator current is constant based on RPMs not draw.

A batteries current supply is regulated by that very current draw, and alt is regulated by engine RPMs.

You just showed how stupid you are. Learn what a diode is and then get back to me.

Also, you were clearly making up words as well as how things work. You need to exercise your ability to read more than your ability to lie.

 

[neverfinished 10+ year member]

Im learning alot from this thread haha keep arguing

 

[csu87 10+ year member]

since everyone is concerned with theory, ill let the op know the answer to his question.

you can do it, but it wont last

/thread