Acoustic Elegance AV15

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

i didn't blow it after he sent the chec it was done the second day i had it.. you don't have any clue as to what happen... i had the thing crossed @50 in 3.5 and @ 60 in 2.8, it had some serious problems above 55 when i gave it power... i had the woofer with a much cleaner signal than any class d 1500 running at 1 ohm.. both me and john discussed that 1500 wouldn't cause over excursion, an it shouldn't yet above 50 it showed signs of a very non liner suspension causing it to prematurely bottom... there is no way to over extend the spider on the AE AV. it will bottom or the cone will fold.. 32mm rear ward and about 35mm forward, the spider in normal cases is good th 40+mm each way.. the only problem with the driver is the cone warped.. it weak at its edges...

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

Johnathan sent you a check to send his sub back, the fact you would just go out and blow it after For anyone is not familiar with this issue, John and him agreed to have the money exchanged for the sub and John would get the sub back cause it was only moving in one direction and didnt sound right. Well John held up his end but before John could get the sub back for me to look at and test papermaker went out of his way to throw more power at it and break the cone, btw I messed around with one of these cones. 2000wrms will not fold it. I have an even larger enclosure, almost twice the size of yours and only tuned six hz higher, the sub had no issue.

your completly wrong, son.. its been boxed up since last wedensday... it was ****ed with 2 days of play. it was bearly listenable. i waited almost 8 weeks to get it.. visit caf you can see exactly what happened.. fact that it plays up to 80hz with 2k in 4.5 tuned to 38 is totally unbelieveable.. qt an fs are too **** low...

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

your completly wrong, son.. its been boxed up since last wedensday... it was ****ed with 2 days of play. it was bearly listenable. i waited almost 8 weeks to get it.. visit caf you can see exactly what happened.. fact that it plays up to 80hz with 2k in 4.5 tuned to 38 is totally unbelieveable.. qt an fs are too **** low...

Please elaborate on how a low Fs and low Qts determine how high a driver plays.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

its causes huge peaks near tuning and falls much faster than a mid q higer fs driver, ie something like the rd hw with a stiff spider, not to mention stiffness is proportional to mechanical Q.. that big a box and port the suspenion cannot control inerita....

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

its causes huge peaks near tuning and falls much faster than a mid q higer fs driver, ie something like the rd hw with a stiff spider, not to mention stiffness is proportional to mechanical Q.. that big a box and port the suspenion cannot control inerita....

I misaligned enclosure causes what you have described here. Simple as that.

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

I'm beginning to appreciate my apparently rare and unique occurrence as an individual who not only loves wideband, low Q, low inductance, drivers with soft suspensions, but also knows how to use them within their limits and extract all the performance they have to offer.

Some of you should be thankful John is even taking the time to humor your responses. Especially when you tell him that you haven't even read what he's had to say, let alone try to learn from it, but you'll certainly argue back with little to no experience as a designer or even a small understanding of driver parameters. Obviously this statement does not include everyone who has contributed to this thread but for those who are taking exception to what I'm saying right now, you should read and try to comprehend what John is giving you which is basically a free lesson in driver performance regarding certain things.

It's a shame that he has to come here and defend what he is obviously very good at doing because of one or two people's misuse of a product that was not intended for the abuse it suffered. I've followed all of these threads concerning AE products and John has been very forthcoming and transparent with his very thorough explanations, mostly to people who don't understand it or appreciate it, and from what my experience tells me, he has been right on every account. And I know a few things. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

It's time to show this man some respect and end the smear campaign. Every company at every point has had some type of failure, whether it was a flawed design that went out and had to be used for a given period of time to expose the flaw, or whether it was simply a fluke such as a bad part or a less than thorough QC. The important part is taking note of these problems and doing what is necessary to make things right. This might involve recalls or replacements, further R&D, and public relations, or in this case, crowd control. Point being is that John is taking on that responsibility and yet you're continuing to attempt to discredit his efforts and his products. Shameful.

 

[kendogg 10+ year member]

I'm beginning to appreciate my apparently rare and unique occurrence as an individual who not only loves wideband, low Q, low inductance, drivers with soft suspensions, but also knows how to use them within their limits and extract all the performance they have to offer.
Some of you should be thankful John is even taking the time to humor your responses. Especially when you tell him that you haven't even read what he's had to say, let alone try to learn from it, but you'll certainly argue back with little to no experience as a designer or even a small understanding of driver parameters. Obviously this statement does not include everyone who has contributed to this thread but for those who are taking exception to what I'm saying right now, you should read and try to comprehend what John is giving you which is basically a free lesson in driver performance regarding certain things.

It's a shame that he has to come here and defend what he is obviously very good at doing because of one or two people's misuse of a product that was not intended for the abuse it suffered. I've followed all of these threads concerning AE products and John has been very forthcoming and transparent with his very thorough explanations, mostly to people who don't understand it or appreciate it, and from what my experience tells me, he has been right on every account. And I know a few things. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

It's time to show this man some respect and end the smear campaign. Every company at every point has had some type of failure, whether it was a flawed design that went out and had to be used for a given period of time to expose the flaw, or whether it was simply a fluke such as a bad part or a less than thorough QC. The important part is taking note of these problems and doing what is necessary to make things right. This might involve recalls or replacements, further R&D, and public relations, or in this case, crowd control. Point being is that John is taking on that responsibility and yet you're continuing to attempt to discredit his efforts and his products. Shameful.

Just wait until you have a problem and post your problem publically. Papermaker had John's full backing when he was supporting the driver. Once papermaker started actually using the sub, and realized what it's issues were (especially once the suspension broke in and softened up), he was ousted by John and berated as well. You'll see man, is all I have to say.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

I misaligned enclosure causes what you have described here. Simple as that.

dude 2.8 tuned to 31, NO! bull-shit. ive used nearly every popular woofer on the market... i've competed as a teenager a one countless 1st places... there is nothing you can tell me, i have first hand experence, identified the problem, but told i was wrong... i used recently a dd 2512 with the newest soft parts with over 1500 daily, 2.3 tuned to 33 bo bottoming or any issues electrically.. simply put your wasting you time just like i did....

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

Just wait until you have a problem and post your problem publically. Papermaker had John's full backing when he was supporting the driver. Once papermaker started actually using the sub, and realized what it's issues were (especially once the suspension broke in and softened up), he was ousted by John and berated as well. You'll see man, is all I have to say.

But you see, that's just it. I choose not to handle my affairs in that fashion, crying to the public for help. I don't need anyone's backing to run a product that I chose to buy therefore I wouldn't need to turn around and say, "well he said it would be okay".

If I had a driver that had an issue, I would take it up with those who handle such matters and give them a chance to see to it my satisfaction was met. I would also accept responsibility for abusing a product or using it for purposes other than it was intended and chalk it up to experience for when I bought the new one. I wouldn't hold someone else responsible, demanding that they designed it wrong and that it be replaced and I certainly wouldn't go on public record looking like a fool and exposing the fact that indeed I don't actually know how to build the proper enclosure and I use more power than is needed.

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

dude 2.8 tuned to 31, NO! bull-shit. ive used nearly every popular woofer on the market... i've competed as a teenager a one countless 1st places... there is nothing you can tell me, i have first hand experence, identified the problem, but told i was wrong... i used recently a dd 2512 with the newest soft parts with over 1500 daily, 2.3 tuned to 33 bo bottoming or any issues electrically.. simply put your wasting you time just like i did....

There's nothing anyone can tell you. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[kendogg 10+ year member]

But you see, that's just it. I choose not to handle my affairs in that fashion, crying to the public for help. I don't need anyone's backing to run a product that I chose to buy therefore I wouldn't need to turn around and say, "well he said it would be okay".
If I had a driver that had an issue, I would take it up with those who handle such matters and give them a chance to see to it my satisfaction was met. I would also accept responsibility for abusing a product or using it for purposes other than it was intended and chalk it up to experience for when I bought the new one. I wouldn't hold someone else responsible, demanding that they designed it wrong and that it be replaced and I certainly wouldn't go on public record looking like a fool and exposing the fact that indeed I don't actually know how to build the proper enclosure and I use more power than is needed.

I chose to go to the public forum for guidance because I had ran out of options. Thats what forums are for. Guidance, idea's, etc. Think about when you watch House, and he does his 'differential diagnosis' with hs team. They're bouncing idea's amongst eachother. THAT is what a forum is for, along with consumer protection. I was discouraged by the runaround I was given by John. I had made a simple thread asking which one of HIS drivers I should go with to move from the AV that I was not happy with, since John at that point was not helpful anymore. I've stated numerous times that simply swapping to a differnt driver has cured my issues. It's a driver problem, not a vehicle, enclosure, etc. problem.

I did not abuse the AV. 3.5 tuned to 25 Hz. with 29 in^2 of port area. ~1000 watts rms. Exactly what John TOLD me to run. I even went out and bought a BIGGER amp because John told me I could run MORE power. I had planned to get the AV reconed into a D2 to use said amp. And then, afterwards, he tells me my enclosure is WRONG (even though he said it would work, and was ideal, on HIS fourm), and tells me I have TOO MUCH power. All the while telling me my amp only made ~300 watts //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif He's flippy-floppy. You'll learn. Don't you even dare consider talking down to me. You haven't had your driver very long, and most certainly haven't pushed it yet.

 

[Papermaker85 5,000+ posts]

There's nothing anyone can tell you. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

your right better bring scientific proof...

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

I chose to go to the public forum for guidance because I had ran out of options. Thats what forums are for. Guidance, idea's, etc. Think about when you watch House, and he does his 'differential diagnosis' with hs team. They're bouncing idea's amongst eachother. THAT is what a forum is for, along with consumer protection. I was discouraged by the runaround I was given by John. I had made a simple thread asking which one of HIS drivers I should go with to move from the AV that I was not happy with, since John at that point was not helpful anymore. I've stated numerous times that simply swapping to a differnt driver has cured my issues. It's a driver problem, not a vehicle, enclosure, etc. problem.
I did not abuse the AV. 3.5 tuned to 25 Hz. with 29 in^2 of port area. ~1000 watts rms. Exactly what John TOLD me to run. I even went out and bought a BIGGER amp because John told me I could run MORE power. I had planned to get the AV reconed into a D2 to use said amp. And then, afterwards, he tells me my enclosure is WRONG (even though he said it would work, and was ideal, on HIS fourm), and tells me I have TOO MUCH power. All the while telling me my amp only made ~300 watts //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif He's flippy-floppy. You'll learn. Don't you even dare consider talking down to me. You haven't had your driver very long, and most certainly haven't pushed it yet.

While addressing your quote I was making reference to papermaker.

It's funny that you would tell me to refrain from condescending to you while simultaneously telling me what equipment I own and how I'm using it. Maybe not condescending of you but very presumptuous.

 

[kendogg 10+ year member]

While addressing your quote I was making reference to papermaker.
It's funny that you would tell me to refrain from condescending to you while simultaneously telling me what equipment I own and how I'm using it. Maybe not condescending of you but very presumptuous.

I'm amking an educated guess by what I know, what I've read from you, and my own experiences. Once it breaks in, it'll change.

 

[ciaonzo 5,000+ posts]

I'm amking an educated guess by what I know, what I've read from you, and my own experiences. Once it breaks in, it'll change.

Every single driver I have ever put into use for myself has had a minimum of 100 hours of break-in using a Polarad signal generator and any one of my capable amplifiers. I have had hundreds upon hundreds of drivers in my hands since the age of twelve. I know when a driver is good and when it isn't.

My efforts are to bring a halt to this smear campaign. Your issues are with John and and his product, not the rest of us.