A/B vs Class D for Subwoofer SQ

[oldschoolboomer 10+ year member]

I vote class a/b all day long. usually much higher damping, no odd noises. Just seem more "powerful" with equal wattages.

 

[azimuth 5,000+ posts]

my ppi pc2350 sounds far better than my viper 1200.1 did. that being said, the viper is a decent class D. the ppi is an excellent class a/b. an excellent class D probably sounds just as good as my ppi. i get pretty bad voltage drops running a class a/b, which is a disadvantage. ppi's do have regulated power supplies. i think either class will do what they're supposed to do when comparing quality to quality as opposed to comparing amps by class.

 

[cleansoundzz 10+ year member]

My PPI PCX 2200 sounds more powerful than my PPI PC 1800.2 did and they are both of equal quality pushing out equal watts (800). They both sound the same on rap but when it comes to music the PCX 2200 far exceeds the PC 1800.2. I have to agree with kcdc30, its all about comparing quality with quality. I suspect through that Sundown Audio class D and other advanced class D amps have closed the gaps over the years. That PPI PC 1800.2 was one of the first generation class D amps. I think more in the past the distinction was greater between AB and D. Now a days probably not as much anymore. I still like my AB.

 

[cleansoundzz 10+ year member]

I agree with old school boomer as well. ABs just seem more powerful with equal wattages. After I made the switch last week, it was clearly apparent between the two. The PCX 2200 just seemed so much more powerful than the PC 1800.2.

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

Thats interesting, so are you saying that NOBODY has the ability to detect changes in sound and the ability to remember those changes? Seems like you already assumed that every persons hearing and memory are created equal..

IF someone has the ability to identify a difference in sound betweeen class A/B and class D, then they have never been able to prove that ability in a scientifically valid test.

But once you identify the qualities of an amplifier that attribute to "differences in sound", you will see that amplifier class is not one of them.

If you can hear the subwoofer in a "SQ" system, then you have bigger issues. Amp class is irrelevant and your ears are horrible, deceiving liars. And your memory is worse than your ears.
If someone is trying to convince you to join the the 'amp class sonics' dogma, they're probably mostly interested in your $$$$$$. Either that, or they're not in tune with the known factors that make an amp have a quality of sound to it.

But thanks for your post, I can now scratch Image Dynamics off my list of ethical car audio amp manufacturers.

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/word.gif.64b12e39f936af3b4fff38a1c0bd0244.gif

 

[systemdesignz]

What's do you guys think of class h subwoofer amps such as some of Arc Audio's amps?

 

[DidUHearThat? 10+ year member]

What's do you guys think of class h subwoofer amps such as some of Arc Audio's amps?

H = Hype.

 

[FoxPro5 5,000+ posts]

Thats interesting, so are you saying that NOBODY has the ability to detect changes in sound and the ability to remember those changes?

I think pretty much anyone can detect changes to a certain level, but that's not the point. And 99% of these threads go the same way as people don't understand what contributes to an amp having a quality of sound to it. Bottom line; it's not the Class that you're hearing. Take any design you want and confound it to the known factors that contribute to the sound of the amp (thus severely limiting the influence of all others) then you can systematically go through and evaluate each one under a scientific microscope.

Seems like you already assumed that every persons hearing and memory are created equal..

I'm saying that the sounds we think we hear are decided largely by 1) the conditions in which we hear them and 2) our history with them. Does a gun shot sound the same to a person who's never heard one before vs another person that's an expert marksman? The sound could be objectively measured to be identical, yet those to people might describe them as completely different. Our ears lie, plain and simple. And our memory is not accurate when emotion is involved. So, different conditions = different factors involved = a difference in what we perceive (hear).

 

[FoxPro5 5,000+ posts]

You don't remember back in ECA's heyday when ID actually blamed class D amps for blowing their subs?
They used to specifically recommend against using class D amps on the IDMax.

What the? No, I don't. That has to be really embarrassing.

 

[hornedfrog1985 5,000+ posts]

IF someone has the ability to identify a difference in sound betweeen class A/B and class D, then they have never been able to prove that ability in a scientifically valid test.

But once you identify the qualities of an amplifier that attribute to "differences in sound", you will see that amplifier class is not one of them.

//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/word.gif.64b12e39f936af3b4fff38a1c0bd0244.gif

Isn't there some prize to anyone that can actually tell the difference? I'm not being a smartass. I know there was a person offering a cash prize to anyone who could a few years back : /

 

[FoxPro5 5,000+ posts]

All the bass sounded like it was coming from their mids anyway.

Something is not up to par. You shouldn't be able to hear speakers in a "SQ setup" and those that compete go to pretty extreme lengths to ensure so. AFAIC, audio systems should be an experience to be had, so the stupid class of the amps is so not even worth mentioning when it comes to the important elements that make up that experience. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crazy.gif.c13912c32de98515d3142759a824dae7.gif:crazy://content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crazy.gif.c13912c32de98515d3142759a824dae7.gif

 

[FoxPro5 5,000+ posts]

I vote class a/b all day long. usually much higher damping, no odd noises. Just seem more "powerful" with equal wattages.

Hate when my Class D's give off that awful "deeeeeee" sound!!!!!! Aaaah! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/mad.gif.c18f003ab0ef8a0d9c27ca78d77a6392.gif

This thread is so ridiculous...............

..........but it's so fun. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif:

 

[DidUHearThat? 10+ year member]

Isn't there some prize to anyone that can actually tell the difference? I'm not being a smartass. I know there was a person offering a cash prize to anyone who could a few years back : /

Yes, $10,000 cash prize that's still open to anyone. He's been offering it for about 15 years and no has ever been able to tell the difference between amp types. It started as tube vs solid state, and he later expanded the prize to include classes of amps.

Anyone who claims they can hear the difference between amp types is lying. Reliablity, ruggedness, warranty, THD, headroom, channel seperation, etc. These are real factors that people should consider.

 

[FoxPro5 5,000+ posts]

Isn't there some prize to anyone that can actually tell the difference? I'm not being a smartass. I know there was a person offering a cash prize to anyone who could a few years back : /

And.........here............we...........go...............

All amps sound the same

I'm teh w1nnAr!!!!! //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

 

[hornedfrog1985 5,000+ posts]

I'm not saying one way or the other. You can debate it, and I'll watch. I just didn't know if anyone collected on the prize yet.