6.5 in door..boxed or open?

[abqrb2000 10+ year member]

I will be doing some build outs in my mustang. I will do a 6.5 in the door and most likely a tweeter in the door too. Is it better to box the mid or just leave it open to the inside of the door?

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[djdilliodon 10+ year member]

That all depends on the drivers you use. Some are designed to work sealed, some IB, and even ported.

 

[Gary S 10+ year member]

It's true that you should first find out from the specs/manufacturer the recommended box type and size.

1st though, you would have to make the box waterproof... doors are not water proof... in fact, chances are you have drain holes in the bottom of your door.

If you can cover those first two problems, in a lot of cases, a box would probably sound better... even infinite baffle, a car door is too big in most cases to give the response a smaller box could... plus, you can line the inside of a box with insulation to cancel standing waves... it's hard to do that in a door (can't put anything on the window, and insulation in the door might get moldy). Finally, power handling will probably go up, and the speaker would be protected from the elements.

A Kick panel install would solve those problems and be a better location anyway if you could do it in your vehicle.

 

[helotaxi 5,000+ posts]

You usually can't get enough air in a normal kickpanel install to get even decent midbass.

The route you go must be based on the drivers that you choose. If the driver wants an IB setup, putting it in a sealed pod will really mess up its response. Same for putting a driver meant for sealed in IB. If you're really super concerned about standing waves and you have an IB designed driver, simply use a deflex pad on the skin of the door behind the driver in addition to the sound deadening you should be doing anyway. The window isn't a concern as long as it clears the speaker. Your response isn't going to be stellar as soon as the windows come down anyway so worrying about the window's effect on standing waves is pretty pointless. Kinda like locking the doors when you leave the convertible top down.

 

[Gary S 10+ year member]

The route you go must be based on the drivers that you choose. If the driver wants an IB setup, putting it in a sealed pod will really mess up its response. Same for putting a driver meant for sealed in IB..

- That's a half-truth... IB for the average 6" midbass driver equates to little more than a bigger sealed box if you look at the box simulations. Plus, sealed boxes are very forgiving... exact air space is overrated.

You usually can't get enough air in a normal kickpanel install to get even decent midbass..

- Another half-truth... in most cases, this is correct... usually they just glass around the back of the mid to the magnet... it ends up being a glorified closed back midrange with no air space... and no midbass. But if you can go into the factory steel kick or the floor and use that air space, not only can you get midbass, but better imaging and soundstage. Speaker placement is a big issue that too many people overlook.

Your response isn't going to be stellar as soon as the windows come down anyway so worrying about the window's effect on standing waves is pretty pointless. Kinda like locking the doors when you leave the convertible top down.

- That sounds similar to the old argument that you can get better sound in the home than the car, so why even bother with the car at all, it's a waste of time.

Take a couple of test boxes with a pair of high resolution mids... one in each box... line one box with at least one-inch thick foam rubber, leave the other raw... then listen to the difference between the two boxes.

With all that said, I have to admit, the way door and kick panel installs are traditionally done, Helotaxi is right... in the real world, in most cases, you will have more midbass in a typical door installation than kicks.... but the key word there is "typical". Even though I am playing devils' advocate and arguing the fine details, you can't go wrong with his advice... it's some of the best I have seen on this board.

 

[helotaxi 5,000+ posts]

- That's a half-truth... IB for the average 6" midbass driver equates to little more than a bigger sealed box if you look at the box simulations. Plus, sealed boxes are very forgiving... exact air space is overrated.

Fair enough. A really small sealed enclosure or a really big one that leaks air. Certain midbasses do better in one or the other.

- Another half-truth... in most cases, this is correct... usually they just glass around the back of the mid to the magnet... it ends up being a glorified closed back midrange with no air space... and no midbass. But if you can go into the factory steel kick or the floor and use that air space, not only can you get midbass, but better imaging and soundstage. Speaker placement is a big issue that too many people overlook.

Note that I said a "normal" kickpanel install. Once you start cutting sheetmetal in the kickpanel you have gone past what is going to be normal and you are leaning toward an extreme.

- That sounds similar to the old argument that you can get better sound in the home than the car, so why even bother with the car at all, it's a waste of time.
Take a couple of test boxes with a pair of high resolution mids... one in each box... line one box with at least one-inch thick foam rubber, leave the other raw... then listen to the difference between the two boxes.

Let me clarify what I said. I didn't say that you shouldn't worry about standing waves in the door. I said that you shouldn't worry about the difference between the window up, where you can and should address the standing wave issue, and the windows down where the glass of the window being present behind the driver might introduce some new standing waves but where you are also competing with a ton of wind noise making the standing waves introduced the least of your concerns.

With all that said, I have to admit, the way door and kick panel installs are traditionally done, Helotaxi is right... in the real world, in most cases, you will have more midbass in a typical door installation than kicks.... but the key word there is "typical". Even though I am playing devils' advocate and arguing the fine details, you can't go wrong with his advice... it's some of the best I have seen on this board.

Thanks for the compliment. I'm not busting your balls either but rather trying to prevent confusion.

 

[abqrb2000 10+ year member]

I will find the comps I want first and go from there. I was thinking I will keep the build out completely inside of the door. I was thinking a sealed box would be better than open to the huge door panel. I am also thinking about putting the tweeter on the door too as opposed to the dash but that is another issue.

Thanks for the info guys.