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tommymilan311

Lossless files over bluetooth VS CD Quality

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I've been noticing some lossless steaming options becoming available, and this sounds nice. LOL

 

So I've been researching to see when and what services are and will be available. I've been a spotify user for quite some time but quality is... meh. Rumor is they have Lossless quality available. Well in my car I generally only listen to CDs, sometimes I'll listen to spotify for variety but.. meh.

 

Well through research I see a lot of claims that "most can't tell the difference in 320kbs or lossless WAV/CD quality even with high quality equipment, especially in car audio." Well I find this very untrue! There is a huge difference from what is on my CD.. and the 320kbs stream from spotify.. like night and day. I've done back to backs on the same song... but I decided to dig deeper.. Some of the CDs I buy come with lossless WAV downloads... I decided to take that to the test.

 

What I found was the bluetooth stream seemed to be more of a factor than the actual audio.. the Spotify to WAV wasn't huge, though I thought the WAV still sounded better, that could just be subliminal reasoning.. but the CD was just so much more full and open as compared to the bluetooth stream.

 

Have any of you tried to do this comparison? Any ideas how to better get the quality of the music from my phone to the receiver? and perhaps a better receiver? It sounds like Spotify is going to have lossless streaming within the year, I'd like to be able to take full advantage.


2014 Kia Optima

Pioneer AVH-X3600BHS / JBL MS8 / 2 Alpine Type-R 10"s / Alpine Type-R 6.5" / FSD Audio 2600D

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Out of curiosity I checked the Bluetooth standards. Bluetooth version 3 (currently we're up to at least 5) has a maximum speed of 25 MBit/second, and newer versions are faster. Version 1.2 of Bluetooth could handle at least 700 KB/s. A CD rom at regular speeds (aka "1x") has a transfer rate of 150 KB/s. Comparing those numbers, it's highly unlikely that the Bluetooth stream itself is the culprit. If there is a difference, it's likely in software or processing of signal on the part of the receiver or transmitter.

 

But I'm spitballing here. A real computer scientist, ECE, or EE would need to chime in.


Polk DB 6.5 components and coaxials, Alpine MRV M1200 (1200x1 @ 2) and MRX F30 (50x4 @ 4) amplifiers, Pioneer double din HU, Sundown SA-12 in ported enclosure (built to spec).

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I've been noticing some lossless steaming options becoming available, and this sounds nice. LOL

 

So I've been researching to see when and what services are and will be available. I've been a spotify user for quite some time but quality is... meh. Rumor is they have Lossless quality available. Well in my car I generally only listen to CDs, sometimes I'll listen to spotify for variety but.. meh.

 

Well through research I see a lot of claims that "most can't tell the difference in 320kbs or lossless WAV/CD quality even with high quality equipment, especially in car audio." Well I find this very untrue! There is a huge difference from what is on my CD.. and the 320kbs stream from spotify.. like night and day. I've done back to backs on the same song... but I decided to dig deeper.. Some of the CDs I buy come with lossless WAV downloads... I decided to take that to the test.

 

What I found was the bluetooth stream seemed to be more of a factor than the actual audio.. the Spotify to WAV wasn't huge, though I thought the WAV still sounded better, that could just be subliminal reasoning.. but the CD was just so much more full and open as compared to the bluetooth stream.

 

Have any of you tried to do this comparison? Any ideas how to better get the quality of the music from my phone to the receiver? and perhaps a better receiver? It sounds like Spotify is going to have lossless streaming within the year, I'd like to be able to take full advantage.

Cd plays at what is considered full volume due to direct play.

 

Bluetooth needs gain adjustment since you have to match device volume and headunit volume.

 

Also 320 and lossless wav are near identical.. flac is much more quality in comparison.

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

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I've been noticing some lossless steaming options becoming available, and this sounds nice. LOL

 

So I've been researching to see when and what services are and will be available. I've been a spotify user for quite some time but quality is... meh. Rumor is they have Lossless quality available. Well in my car I generally only listen to CDs, sometimes I'll listen to spotify for variety but.. meh.

 

Well through research I see a lot of claims that "most can't tell the difference in 320kbs or lossless WAV/CD quality even with high quality equipment, especially in car audio." Well I find this very untrue! There is a huge difference from what is on my CD.. and the 320kbs stream from spotify.. like night and day. I've done back to backs on the same song... but I decided to dig deeper.. Some of the CDs I buy come with lossless WAV downloads... I decided to take that to the test.

 

What I found was the bluetooth stream seemed to be more of a factor than the actual audio.. the Spotify to WAV wasn't huge, though I thought the WAV still sounded better, that could just be subliminal reasoning.. but the CD was just so much more full and open as compared to the bluetooth stream.

 

Have any of you tried to do this comparison? Any ideas how to better get the quality of the music from my phone to the receiver? and perhaps a better receiver? It sounds like Spotify is going to have lossless streaming within the year, I'd like to be able to take full advantage.

 

actually its more of a factor of, you need a different tune for your BT settings vs your CD settings. Do it right, they sound the same. You cant expect to use the same tune for CD as bluetooth, it doesnt work that way.


09 Sienna Subs : Four Team Ascendant 18s......Sub amp: Two Taramps 15k

Headunit: Pioneer 80PRS......Mids/Highs two pioneer gm 8604 bridged, one at 4 ohms bridged one at 2 ohms bridged, one ppi 600.2 for tweets.

Front stage: Two PWX 10s per door midbass only....... PRV 6MR500 midrange....... Massive CT 2 german tweeters.

320 amp Singer alt....... 1 group 34 under the hood 6 group31 agms in the back 560 amp hours total.

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Cd plays at what is considered full volume due to direct play.

 

Bluetooth needs gain adjustment since you have to match device volume and headunit volume.

 

Also 320 and lossless wav are near identical.. flac is much more quality in comparison.

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

 

actually its more of a factor of, you need a different tune for your BT settings vs your CD settings. Do it right, they sound the same. You cant expect to use the same tune for CD as bluetooth, it doesnt work that way.

 

So I suppose the phone I'm using might make a difference? Probably not tho, cause its a Galaxy S8.

 

I did do a little bit of playing with volume levels and I found when I turned my phone down a bit.. like all the way down to the "damage your hearing" warning and then I turned my Input adjustment setting at the HU up... all the way up +4. It sounds a lot better, more clear and full. But its way quieter as compared to the CD. The problem is I think the is some internal compression going on with the phone beyond this volume.. I start to lose a full kick drum sound and my cymbals become washed (side by side comparisons).. I've played with the headroom that my head unit allows.. I generally do all my EQ settings from my processor, and it'd stink to have to have to different settings from the processor if I wanted to listen to CD vs Bluetooth

 

Also, the HU does allow different EQ settings for each input.


2014 Kia Optima

Pioneer AVH-X3600BHS / JBL MS8 / 2 Alpine Type-R 10"s / Alpine Type-R 6.5" / FSD Audio 2600D

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So I suppose the phone I'm using might make a difference? Probably not tho, cause its a Galaxy S8.

 

I did do a little bit of playing with volume levels and I found when I turned my phone down a bit.. like all the way down to the "damage your hearing" warning and then I turned my Input adjustment setting at the HU up... all the way up +4. It sounds a lot better, more clear and full. But its way quieter as compared to the CD. The problem is I think the is some internal compression going on with the phone beyond this volume.. I start to lose a full kick drum sound and my cymbals become washed (side by side comparisons).. I've played with the headroom that my head unit allows.. I generally do all my EQ settings from my processor, and it'd stink to have to have to different settings from the processor if I wanted to listen to CD vs Bluetooth

 

Also, the HU does allow different EQ settings for each input.

Samsung has preset eq's.

 

You need to root it and use viper4android to get a flat eq going and work the gains.

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

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Samsung has preset eq's.

 

You need to root it and use viper4android to get a flat eq going and work the gains.

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

 

Is there still possibility that there is internal compression and distortion to make it sound louder when I go passed the "too loud" volume?


2014 Kia Optima

Pioneer AVH-X3600BHS / JBL MS8 / 2 Alpine Type-R 10"s / Alpine Type-R 6.5" / FSD Audio 2600D

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Is there still possibility that there is internal compression and distortion to make it sound louder when I go passed the "too loud" volume?
Viper4android is a dsp its self and controls how the output from the device will be like..

 

So you will want to tune it while at full volume.

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

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Is there still possibility that there is internal compression and distortion to make it sound louder when I go passed the "too loud" volume?

 

no its just the internal dsp fking your sh*t up. I had to shut mines off when i tune as well, my phone's dsp actually was boosted so it was actually louder than CD/USB and caused some premature clipping.


09 Sienna Subs : Four Team Ascendant 18s......Sub amp: Two Taramps 15k

Headunit: Pioneer 80PRS......Mids/Highs two pioneer gm 8604 bridged, one at 4 ohms bridged one at 2 ohms bridged, one ppi 600.2 for tweets.

Front stage: Two PWX 10s per door midbass only....... PRV 6MR500 midrange....... Massive CT 2 german tweeters.

320 amp Singer alt....... 1 group 34 under the hood 6 group31 agms in the back 560 amp hours total.

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Viper4android is a dsp its self and controls how the output from the device will be like..

 

So you will want to tune it while at full volume.

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

 

no its just the internal dsp fking your sh*t up. I had to shut mines off when i tune as well, my phone's dsp actually was boosted so it was actually louder than CD/USB and caused some premature clipping.

 

Are there any ways to fix this without rooting my phone? all method for the GS8 are sketchy as can be


2014 Kia Optima

Pioneer AVH-X3600BHS / JBL MS8 / 2 Alpine Type-R 10"s / Alpine Type-R 6.5" / FSD Audio 2600D

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Are there any ways to fix this without rooting my phone? all method for the GS8 are sketchy as can be
Sketchy? Its just odin with a zip containing root, but no there is not

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

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Sketchy? Its just odin with a zip containing root, but no there is not

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

 

From what I read.. the Galaxy 8 has fail safes that prevent you from setting it up properly.. I have never rooted my phone because I haven't known what exactly I'd do with it. I'm seeing a lot of folks get stuck in boot lock.


2014 Kia Optima

Pioneer AVH-X3600BHS / JBL MS8 / 2 Alpine Type-R 10"s / Alpine Type-R 6.5" / FSD Audio 2600D

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IG this is more reason to hate this phone and the Galaxy family. I'll never get one of these POS again lol


2014 Kia Optima

Pioneer AVH-X3600BHS / JBL MS8 / 2 Alpine Type-R 10"s / Alpine Type-R 6.5" / FSD Audio 2600D

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Pretty sure I messed my phone up attempting this


2014 Kia Optima

Pioneer AVH-X3600BHS / JBL MS8 / 2 Alpine Type-R 10"s / Alpine Type-R 6.5" / FSD Audio 2600D

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Pretty sure I messed my phone up attempting this
https://forum.xda-developers.com/galaxy-s8/development/samsung-galaxy-s8-root-snapdragon-t3659305

 

Do this..

 

With samsung phones its impossible to mess up because you can download the stock firmware and redo it all over again over and over and over again.

 

Just take your time and read thru it all.

 

If not then go buy a usb and put your music or a cd and a headunit that supports both lol

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

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https://forum.xda-developers.com/galaxy-s8/development/samsung-galaxy-s8-root-snapdragon-t3659305

 

Do this..

 

With samsung phones its impossible to mess up because you can download the stock firmware and redo it all over again over and over and over again.

 

Just take your time and read thru it all.

 

If not then go buy a usb and put your music or a cd and a headunit that supports both lol

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

 

Thank you, I was also able to get my phone back to stock but haven't been able to root.. I've tried a couple different things now but haven't seen this one, I'll give it a shot. And I'll continue to stick with CDs if I can't get it to work

 

Thanks!


2014 Kia Optima

Pioneer AVH-X3600BHS / JBL MS8 / 2 Alpine Type-R 10"s / Alpine Type-R 6.5" / FSD Audio 2600D

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Even the step by step instructions followed to a T does not work.. so IG I'm stuck. I'll never recommend anyone to, or buy a Samsung phone again.


2014 Kia Optima

Pioneer AVH-X3600BHS / JBL MS8 / 2 Alpine Type-R 10"s / Alpine Type-R 6.5" / FSD Audio 2600D

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Thank you, I was also able to get my phone back to stock but haven't been able to root.. I've tried a couple different things now but haven't seen this one, I'll give it a shot. And I'll continue to stick with CDs if I can't get it to work

 

Thanks!

 

I'm still a bit surprised this problem exists in the first place. I have an S4 that I stream Pandora to my head unit with via Bluetooth and it sounds great. Makes me wonder if this built in EQ thing is unique to the newer models.


Polk DB 6.5 components and coaxials, Alpine MRV M1200 (1200x1 @ 2) and MRX F30 (50x4 @ 4) amplifiers, Pioneer double din HU, Sundown SA-12 in ported enclosure (built to spec).

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Out of curiosity I checked the Bluetooth standards. Bluetooth version 3 (currently we're up to at least 5) has a maximum speed of 25 MBit/second, and newer versions are faster. Version 1.2 of Bluetooth could handle at least 700 KB/s. A CD rom at regular speeds (aka "1x") has a transfer rate of 150 KB/s. Comparing those numbers, it's highly unlikely that the Bluetooth stream itself is the culprit. If there is a difference, it's likely in software or processing of signal on the part of the receiver or transmitter.

 

But I'm spitballing here. A real computer scientist, ECE, or EE would need to chime in.

 

I want to see REAL time data transfer rates.


i told wife guy on here pm'ed me wanting to buy my amp she said tell him it not fs (cause she knows i'll spend more $ on new one) and told her i wanted d2 sub for bday next week she said tell ya'll i'm to old to go down to 1ohm lol..

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I'm still a bit surprised this problem exists in the first place. I have an S4 that I stream Pandora to my head unit with via Bluetooth and it sounds great. Makes me wonder if this built in EQ thing is unique to the newer models.
S4 had a simple amplified chip internally.. the newer versions have a separate amp chip now

 

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

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