Under Powered Sub ?!

[bigbassman Premium Member]

Originally posted by wesleysh Your still talking theory. If you want to spend the money on a sub and never listen to what it is fully capable of, that's your business. And if you want to buy a Viper and never go above 55 mph, that's your business too. I bought my subs for a reason, as did most people.

So what is a person to do when their sub doesn't perform as loud as they would want? In your world, they are to just deal with it. Why? Because it doesn't create distortion nor does it hurt the sub. That's just silly. Your trying to be as objective as possible about something that is completely subjective. If I don't like the sound I'm either going to push the amp harder or buy a new one. I'm saying that investing in a good amp is worth it, if yours doesn't produce as expected. Would save you the problems that come with the OTHER solution.

You've went from "you can't put low power on a sub cause it will hurt it / sound bad.. to " it's simply the preference of the user" and down we go.. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

Loyd L.

 

[zane 10+ year member]

Originally posted by wesleysh If I don't like the sound I'm either going to push the amp harder

And this in your own words would be your problem, as well as your solution. Pushing your low power amp harder is what would cause the damage, not the underpowering of the speaker itself.

I will also ask- what does power have to do with the sound quality?

I would be glad to call that bluff; if you would care to have a listen to my Alchemy's. Once ran from my Phoenix Gold XS2500, Once ran with 35 watts of HU power. I guarantee that the only difference you will notice is in the area of response, not in Sound Quality.

take it easy,

-zane

 

[bigbassman Premium Member]

Originally posted by zane  

 

And this in your own words would be your problem, as well as your solution. Pushing your low power amp harder is what would cause the damage, not the underpowering of the speaker itself.

 

I will also ask- what does power have to do with the sound quality?

 

I would be glad to call that bluff; if you would care to have a listen to my Alchemy's. Once ran from my Phoenix Gold XS2500, Once ran with 35 watts of HU power. I guarantee that the only difference you will notice is in the area of response, not in Sound Quality.

 

take it easy,

 

-zane

zane's now my hero for the day.. //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

Loyd L.

 

[jlaine 10+ year member]

Originally posted by wesleysh Your still talking theory. If you want to spend the money on a sub and never listen to what it is fully capable of, that's your business. And if you want to buy a Viper and never go above 55 mph, that's your business too. I bought my subs for a reason, as did most people.

I did also, to listen to them.

Why would I redline an engine I just finished because "it can go that far?"

There is no theory there. None at all.. you show me where there is any theory in my statements... Honestly...

Originally posted by wesleysh So what is a person to do when their sub doesn't perform as loud as they would want? In your world, they are to just deal with it.

No, in my world, you match the sub and the power input to the user, there would be nobody unhappy with their choices, as they would make the right choice immediately. Being 'happy' does not equate to turning the volume up to 100% and possibly overdriving your speakers with input energy.

Originally posted by wesleysh Why? Because it doesn't create distortion nor does it hurt the sub. That's just silly.

What creates distortion? What harms the sub?

Do you think your subs have feelings? Are they going to tell you that you are being mean by sending a clipped signal into them? They are designed to do one thing, and they'll do it, reguardless of what you send into them. I can send square waves through my speakers and they'll be fine as long as I stay within thermal limitations.

Originally posted by wesleysh Your trying to be as objective as possible about something that is completely subjective.

What is? Power in = power out. Nothing subjective there. Some humans want excessively loud systems, there is nothing subjective about that. They can show me exactly how loud they want things to be, and I can duplicate it. That is completely objective. I can get to both levels, but I still am not the one saying that underpowering the subs will damage them.

Originally posted by wesleysh If I don't like the sound I'm either going to push the amp harder or buy a new one. I'm saying that investing in a good amp is worth it, if yours doesn't produce as expected. Would save you the problems that come with the OTHER solution.

If you don't like the sound, it is time to look at the install, the design, or the woofer you chose.

If you don't like the amount of output, it is time to look at the amount of power you have on tap, the install, or the subwoofer you chose.

The OTHER solution, IE, finding an amp that matches your tastes, is the perfect solution. No sense in having an amp capable of 1400w when you only want 400. Why? Smaller footprint, smaller cost...

 

[ramos 5,000+ posts]

Originally posted by wesleysh jlaine,

Nobody said anything about throwing 1200 watts into all your subs. Their are so many possibilities with either one of those amps. You can run a sub down at 75w very easily with one of the JBL's, so again what's your point?

 

I'm trying to understand how you will accomplish this. Does your 1200.1 come with a power knob that let's you reduce the power output ?

 

 

 

I said AS A RULE you should power it at 2/3 or above. It doesn't mean its always the case and there's no way to deviate. But are you saying that you can not improve the sound of your Brahma's if you ran more power into them?

 

I have to agree with jlaine I don't believe more power can "improve" the sound either. Just produce the same sound with greater amplitude.

 

 

Better go tell everyone they are wasting their money on the bigger amps, all they need is 18% of its top rms figure, anything else is a waste of money.

 

 

The brahma is a rather capable SPL competitor. Hence the reason for the bigger amps.

 

 

We are not saying you can't get good ABSOLUTE sound, we are talking RELATIVE. Which is why relatively my L7's would and have been proven to sound like doodoo with a small amp. If they were Pyramid subs I would have said, "cool, that sounds pretty nice." But Kickers and Pyramid's aren't the same price now are they? /QUOTE

What does price have to do with underpowering subs ? Simple fact is underpowering speakers will NOT harm them. I'll bet I can take those pyramid subs and the little amp. And make them sound just as good if not better than your L7's. Want to put some money on it ?

 

[bumpin_blazer 5,000+ posts]

**** everyone on here is arguing again. all b/c some stupid fool named wesley decided to try and pick a fight with like the 1 guy you shouldn't try and pick a fight with on here b/c he knows dang near everything. basically i say just quit the arguing but that fool won't stop until he is just totally proven an idiot. anyway no one answered my question, is that MA audio amp i have a good solid amp?? or should i got back to my 1000bd RF amp?? the MA audio is the 1500X, the class X series amplifier. any feedback would be appreciated.

keep it thumpin,

adam

 

[Phatillusion 5,000+ posts]

Originally posted by wesleysh Your still talking theory. If you want to spend the money on a sub and never listen to what it is fully capable of, that's your business. And if you want to buy a Viper and never go above 55 mph, that's your business too. I bought my subs for a reason, as did most people.

 

 

Your ears can't handle what most subs are fully capable of dishing out. So tell me how you are suppose to enjoy sounds that are damaging your hearing. I know many people who have never even come close to trying to push the full potential of their system, so what are you saying, that they wasted their money? I seriously doubt that, what more do you need than good quality listening. You don't need glass shattering boom to enjoy your music. And for the record, I don't think anybody has ever driven their woofer to it's full capability, if that were the case, their would be only one enclosure and one amp that would be the perfect match, which there isn't. You've lost the war, give it up. Zane, Jlaine, Bigbassman, and now Ramos gettin in on the action. Give it up, they've probably been into car audio before you were born.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

Hell I think their first word was woofer.

 

[ramos 5,000+ posts]

I have never dealt with that exact amp. But judging by the MA audio products I have dealt with in the past I would have to take the fosgate hands down. Just my humble opinion //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/smile.gif.1ebc41e1811405b213edfc4622c41e27.gif

 

[wesleysh 10+ year member]

If someone's giving bad advice then help them out, there are things that everybody lacks knowledge in. I'd run circles around most in discussing the ins and outs of offensive schemes in football or in a discussion about cognitive psychology. But what does it all mean?

I apologize if I have over stepped my bounds on this one, my bad.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/nono.gif.eca61d170185779e0921b0faa9704973.gif

I should be punished.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/banghead.gif.8606515f668c74f6de0281deb475b6fd.gif

At any rate I'm sure I gave at least a few of you a good laugh.//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

Just to clarify, I never said that driving your amp harder was the thing to do. Driving the amp harder WAS the OTHER thing I was talking about that causes damage. I personally don't know what my system would sound like with the gains up past 3/4. That's the highest I've gotten before when matching the amp with the receiver. Once someone says "don't do this" I don't do it. You can see that by my reluctance to underpower a speaker after being told not to. LOL

 

[wesleysh 10+ year member]

Ramos,

I would accept your challenge, but I think there would be too many rules. My system was not installed by me(the dumb guy) but by someone with over 30 years in the business. Not saying that you're less knowledgable than him, but relying on install alone would be asking a lot.

To achieve 75w per sub:

JBL600.1 w/ two 4 Ohm subs wired in series

or

JBL1200.1 w/two 8 Ohm subs wired in series

Am I wrong again?//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[ramos 5,000+ posts]

The only rules would be the same as in IASCA sound quality judging. No SPL scores. Let's be realistic //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/biggrin.gif.d71a5d36fcbab170f2364c9f2e3946cb.gif

 

[tuca33 10+ year member]

In my case its the opposite,,i just bought 1 L7 12" and i will power it whith a Kx1200.1

That is rated at 1540 rms at a 1 ohm load.(mysubs are 2 ohms voice coil)

So i use it in 1 ohm load..

Do you think i am overpowering my sub(as the S12L7 can handle 750 rms,,or 1500 peak)Or do you think it will hit very hard??

Do you think there's any chance of damaging my sub???

Thanks Tuca

 

[bootleg 10+ year member]

wesleysh;

I do believe we live in America for a reason. Your arguments hold no ground to the idea of free will, if someone wants to buy a viper and do 55 on the highway, they are allowed to, you silly little nazi wanna be. BTW, in my humble opinion, you're incredibly contradictive and hypocritical. This is just my opinion, and I could be wrong, and I'll put money down that you'll say that sometime soon, but you have got to be the most ignorant person on this particular forum.

 

[RangerMan Premium Member]

Along with zane, before I got my amp for my MTX 6000, I pushed my sub with 26 watts of massive hu power for about 2 weeks. It actually sounded nice...//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/wink.gif.608e3ea05f1a9f98611af0861652f8fb.gif

 

[RangerMan Premium Member]

Originally posted by bootleg wesleysh;

I do believe we live in America for a reason. Your arguments hold no ground to the idea of free will, if someone wants to buy a viper and do 55 on the highway, they are allowed to, you silly little nazi wanna be. BTW, in my humble opinion, you're incredibly contradictive and hypocritical. This is just my opinion, and I could be wrong, and I'll put money down that you'll say that sometime soon, but you have got to be the most ignorant person on this particular forum.

I smell an arguement //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/eek.gif.771b7a90cf45cabdc554ff1121c21c4a.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/crazy.gif.c13912c32de98515d3142759a824dae7.gif