this cant be right......can it?

[kmanian 5,000+ posts]

Well the way I see it is instead of simply stating the guy is an idiot, how about enlighting the rest of us, ther is a thought pattern that the guy had, and I think it is a situation that is worth explaning, so that is what I was trying to do. An the fact is that THD typically does rise, and I personally don't think 1% distortion is somthing that I would settle for. I have seen amps so called well engineered amps that start with a rating of .075 THD @ 4 omhs per channel and end up at 4-5% at 0.5 ohms per channel.

 

[sinosic 10+ year member]

this is the reply i got from dude when i emailed him the link to this thread

I know, I used to think the same thing. I talked with your client earlier and tried to explain it. I don't think he caught was I was saying but I told him that the problem is that you can't argue with some people especially if they're ignorant.. (not stupid), just unknowing... ESPECIALLY IN AN ONLINE FORUM. This is really reinforced when they have trophies to back up their 'skills' in car audio. I've had several technical augments with people... but if I don't have any trophies, I'm wrong.

Either way, the subs are great and you'll max them out with no problems.

Don't depend on forums for facts. Read science books! ;-) LOL!

I got most of my training from the Air Force in my prep for my job as a telecom technician and later as an engineer.

I remember reading a showcase article in Car Audio magazine where the guy they featured had installed fuses on the power and the ground for 'extra' protection. AND THEY FEATURED THIS GUY!

This is why I started RU, to help cut through some of the nonsense associated with the sport... And this is nothing compared to home audio. Do you think $10k speaker cables sound better? Some people do and if they have the money, they pay it. I'm not a fan of predator companies like this but there's nothing you can do about stupidity except stick to the facts, stick to science and real measurable results.

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

Well the way I see it is instead of simply stating the guy is an idiot, how about enlighting the rest of us, ther is a thought pattern that the guy had, and I think it is a situation that is worth explaning, so that is what I was trying to do.

Considering I'm not "that guy", I don't feel any obligation to try to explain why he answered the way he did. But I can explain why he is wrong.....which I have already done.

An the fact is that THD typically does rise, and I personally don't think 1% distortion is somthing that I would settle for.

Why ? You certainly can't hear it and it is more than an acceptable level of distortion. You aren't gaining anything by going any lower in distortion......you won't hear the difference. And yes, I say that with confidence.

I have seen amps so called well engineered amps that start with a rating of .075 THD @ 4 omhs per channel and end up at 4-5% at 0.5 ohms per channel.

Well, possibly 1) the amplifier wasn't rated for .5ohm or 2) maybe it shouldn't have been, or 3) that was an "SPL burp only" rating, or 4) maybe the person doing the measuring didn't know how to properly measure ? Lots of variables.

Regardless; .5ohm is getting rather far down there. 1ohm has become almost a standard and it's not uncommon, unconventional or difficult for an amplifier designed to operate at 1ohm to do so with acceptable (i.e. inaudible) levels of distortion.

 

[squeak9798 5,000+ posts]

this is the reply i got from dude when i emailed him the link to this thread

I know, I used to think the same thing. I talked with your client earlier and tried to explain it. I don't think he caught was I was saying but I told him that the problem is that you can't argue with some people especially if they're ignorant.. (not stupid), just unknowing... ESPECIALLY IN AN ONLINE FORUM. This is really reinforced when they have trophies to back up their 'skills' in car audio. I've had several technical augments with people... but if I don't have any trophies, I'm wrong.

Either way, the subs are great and you'll max them out with no problems.

Don't depend on forums for facts. Read science books! ;-) LOL!

I got most of my training from the Air Force in my prep for my job as a telecom technician and later as an engineer.

I remember reading a showcase article in Car Audio magazine where the guy they featured had installed fuses on the power and the ground for 'extra' protection. AND THEY FEATURED THIS GUY!

This is why I started RU, to help cut through some of the nonsense associated with the sport... And this is nothing compared to home audio. Do you think $10k speaker cables sound better? Some people do and if they have the money, they pay it. I'm not a fan of predator companies like this but there's nothing you can do about stupidity except stick to the facts, stick to science and real measurable results.

That was a decently long e-mail...with not a SINGLE statement included in it to support his original statement //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif

Why ? Because he's wrong, and now he can't back up his statement with any factual information.

If I'm simply misreading his original statements....that's fine....I'm open to rereading a corrected explaination to eradicate my "ignorance".

But his original statement is flat out incorrect and inaccurate based on science/physics, as far as I'm reading it.

RU.......Robot Underground ??

 

[sinosic 10+ year member]

he just sent me this email

It's just something we want to debunk. We put it in many of our listings.. Many times a client will pass on a sub thinking it won't work or maximize their amp due to the impedance.. I know I have in the past.

So I take it you don't need help on how to wire the subs up? I'll include four of our round box terminals as well to help with the install.

 

[IgnoreMe 5,000+ posts]

the fact is you will not get 4kw @ 2 ohms on a 12V system.

no ifs, ands, or buts. i dont care if he thinks he jesus christ. it aint happening period.

you will get 4kw @ 1 ohm and 2kw @ 2 ohm on a proper electrical system (not including impedance rise)

 

[sinosic 10+ year member]

the fact is you will not get 4kw @ 2 ohms on a 12V system.
no ifs, ands, or buts. i dont care if he thinks he jesus christ. it aint happening period.

you will get 4kw @ 1 ohm and 2kw @ 2 ohm on a proper electrical system (not including impedance rise)

word

 

[sinosic 10+ year member]

That was a decently long e-mail...with not a SINGLE statement included in it to support his original statement //content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/rolleyes.gif.c1fef805e9d1464d377451cd5bc18bfb.gif//content.invisioncic.com/y282845/emoticons/laugh.gif.48439b2acf2cfca21620f01e7f77d1e4.gif
Why ? Because he's wrong, and now he can't back up his statement with any factual information.

If I'm simply misreading his original statements....that's fine....I'm open to rereading a corrected explaination to eradicate my "ignorance".

But his original statement is flat out incorrect and inaccurate based on science/physics, as far as I'm reading it.

RU.......Robot Underground ??

RU.......robotunderground on ebay. you are correct.

 

[IgnoreMe 5,000+ posts]

word

also let me tell you something, you really do need a proper electrical for that amp. i will give you an example and its one i always use for telling people what kind of electrical support that amp needs.

ngsm13 ran a 15" btl off a kicker 2500.1 and then off a memphis 4kw.

electrical was a 220A alt, 2 yellow top optima batts.

with the 2500 (2500w amp) his score was (dont remember so lets just say) 145db

with the memphis 4kw, his score was exactly the same. it wasn't until he added a third yellow top battery that his score went up.

so as you can see, if you arent backing this amp up properly, you just wont get its full benefits either.

 

[sinosic 10+ year member]

also let me tell you something, you really do need a proper electrical for that amp. i will give you an example and its one i always use for telling people what kind of electrical support that amp needs.
ngsm13 ran a 15" btl off a kicker 2500.1 and then off a memphis 4kw.

electrical was a 220A alt, 2 yellow top optima batts.

with the 2500 (2500w amp) his score was (dont remember so lets just say) 145db

with the memphis 4kw, his score was exactly the same. it wasn't until he added a third yellow top battery that his score went up.

so as you can see, if you arent backing this amp up properly, you just wont get its full benefits either.

200 alt amp and was thinking 2 yellow tops but you think more? power cable size is 01gauge.

 

[skateboardkid 10+ year member]

Q :RU retarded

A: RU is retarded

 

[Trey803 5,000+ posts]

You will not obtain the max RMS output at all ohms. Typically the lower the ohms(resistance) the more power you will obtain. Some amplifiers have special regulators on the power and make it possible to produce equal wattage at the same ohms.(ie JL 1000/1) These amps are often modded to bypass this regulation and take advantage of the extra watts achieved by running at a lower ohm. When you reach a clippied signal there is no reason why you should continue to increase the gain. All amplifiers have limits, it is until these limits are realized that one can obtain optimum results from an amplifier.

 

[DBfan187 5,000+ posts]

this thread is old

 

[Trey803 5,000+ posts]

In the audio domain, clipping may be heard as general distortion or as pops.

Because the clipped waveform has more area underneath it than the smaller unclipped waveform, the amplifier produces more power when it is clipping. This extra power can damage any part of the loudspeaker, including the woofer or the tweeter, by causing over-excursion, or by overheating the voice coil.

Trying to exceed the power limitations of an amplifier will have negative result on the amplifier and the speaker(s) it is powering

 

[tapout 5,000+ posts]

only 1 year 7 weeks.